RE: Driven: Porsche Cayman R
Discussion
j123 said:
As to Rob's thoughts on the Cayman and steering feel, just wait until the new cayman and 911 platform comes on line soon, they will both have fully electric steering with even less feel. I think that many 911 owners will indeed protest but again its an issue of it being too late.
Indeed this is a serious issue; the final loss of feel from all Porsche's. Feel now will become the mostly the sole province of Lotus. I wonder how Lotus will deal with this. j
Even less feel? Is that possible Indeed this is a serious issue; the final loss of feel from all Porsche's. Feel now will become the mostly the sole province of Lotus. I wonder how Lotus will deal with this. j
Perhaps if there's a general progression for cars to have less feel, I'm just more picky about it than most and have gone off Porsches a generation before everyone else?
In case people here need a quick reminder...
Most people are happy going to Walmart, or whatever mega shopping center to purchase most all their goods. Most people are happy with fast food. People are happy with the poor television shows and movies we get that have nothing in common with that of the 50's/60's and 70's. Same thing with cars. I'm surprised this is such a difficult point to make on here, I'm assuming a lot of PH'ers are of a conservative bent. well such is the way it goes, j
Most people are happy going to Walmart, or whatever mega shopping center to purchase most all their goods. Most people are happy with fast food. People are happy with the poor television shows and movies we get that have nothing in common with that of the 50's/60's and 70's. Same thing with cars. I'm surprised this is such a difficult point to make on here, I'm assuming a lot of PH'ers are of a conservative bent. well such is the way it goes, j
j123 said:
Indeed this is a serious issue; the final loss of feel from all Porsche's. Feel now will become the mostly the sole province of Lotus. I wonder how Lotus will deal with this. j
Lotus management seems intent on emulating Porsche - so I guess it will either try to scoop up the customers who would like some feel, or else will follow where Porsche leads, chasing the more mainstream audience. I suspect that one man's communication is another's NVH, to be engineered out in the name of refinement."that one man's communication is another's NVH"
Very well encapsulated. In fact I think that is what Lotus is trying to pull off in these next years the combination of two never before combined elements into a modern car; but at a very very high price and with questionable ability to do the reliability thing. "The thinking man's Porsche." might be their marketing one day. Or maybe we all wait and like I said before eventually custom cars might become possible, pick your style, configuration, feel, within your governments legislation's. 15 years off I'd say, that is if people are still able to drive themselves at that point!? j
Very well encapsulated. In fact I think that is what Lotus is trying to pull off in these next years the combination of two never before combined elements into a modern car; but at a very very high price and with questionable ability to do the reliability thing. "The thinking man's Porsche." might be their marketing one day. Or maybe we all wait and like I said before eventually custom cars might become possible, pick your style, configuration, feel, within your governments legislation's. 15 years off I'd say, that is if people are still able to drive themselves at that point!? j
j123 said:
shoestring7 said:
VW did in 1992 when they launch the mk3. The steering was awful and the 'Gti' a laggardly slug. The VR6 'superGolf' on OE suspension wasn't much better. There was an outcry in the press and enthusiast community which was compleletly ignored; the mk4 was a much better car overall especially the engine and interior, but no better to drive. Even the 'mk5', heralded as the 'return of the Gti' wasn't that great a driving car, as a recent spin I had in a tatty old mk2 16v reminded me.
In sum? The great gmass of drivers don't give much priority to feedback and response.
SS7
Completely disagree. In sum? The great gmass of drivers don't give much priority to feedback and response.
SS7
SS7
RobM77 said:
j123 said:
As to Rob's thoughts on the Cayman and steering feel, just wait until the new cayman and 911 platform comes on line soon, they will both have fully electric steering with even less feel. I think that many 911 owners will indeed protest but again its an issue of it being too late.
Indeed this is a serious issue; the final loss of feel from all Porsche's. Feel now will become the mostly the sole province of Lotus. I wonder how Lotus will deal with this. j
Even less feel? Is that possible Indeed this is a serious issue; the final loss of feel from all Porsche's. Feel now will become the mostly the sole province of Lotus. I wonder how Lotus will deal with this. j
Especially the if buyer is smart enough to specify the smallest possible wheel+tyre combination.
SS7
shoestring7 said:
Rob, you might have some utopia in mind where all cars weigh 600kgs and have the steering feel of a Lotus 25, but even you have to admit that by any current standards Porsches 997 and 987s are at or near to the top of the tree for that aspect of vehicle dynamics.
Especially the if buyer is smart enough to specify the smallest possible wheel+tyre combination.
SS7
Especially the if buyer is smart enough to specify the smallest possible wheel+tyre combination.
SS7
Seriously though, I'd be happy with ~1400kg and I've no need to vast amounts of power. All I want is something where I can adjust the seat and steering wheel to suit and that has controls that are linear, nicely weighted and feelsome. I'm quite happy with my two cars at the moment, but I will keep an eye out for cars that fit my criteria - I won't be holding my breath though
Diesel Meister said:
No mention of the lifeless, non-linear steering or throttle lag. Is the man mad?SS7
Diesel Meister said:
Clearly without the requisite powers of perception and driving prowess
Not at all; he just has different priorities to me and drives in s different way. There are no absolutes in the world of cars - if there were then all sports car drivers would drive the same car, which they don't.Gassing Station | General Gassing | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff