RE: On Video: Nissan's 2011 GT-R Round The Ring
Discussion
Guibo said:
Like just about any front-heavy roadcar, it will tend toward understeer at the limit. The natural reaction for almost any driver in this first limit is to back off the throttle to reign in the understeer. But that is not the way to get the fastest out of the GT-R. RSR Nurburg driving instructor, Dale Lomas, commented:
"Both the GT-R and the 911 are specialist cars. They don't drive like anything else on the market. You just can't get into a GT2 never having driven one before and expect to go 10/10ths fast. It's a beast of a car and one that requires special skills and Porsche experience.
Whereas there's a seemingly universal belief that the GT-R is the opposite of that...it's apparently a PlayStation car, one that can go fast with any old muppet behind the wheel. Well, this is kind of true, all the way up to about 8/10ths of what he car can do. Drive over this, really push the car, and it all gets a bit difficult again. The Atessa system only punts power to the front wheels when it thinks you need it. To make the computer think you need it, you must deliberately throw the car with commitment and a little violence over the edges of its envelope. Only as the back wheels light up, or the front pushes desperately wide, will the car start to work its magic.
...the Atessa system needs a heavy right foot to push through natural understeer and into the realm of computer induced power oversteer."
This partially explains Suzuki's early turn-in, with quick sawing at the wheel well before what looks like should be the turn-in point. He seems to be deliberately throwing the car into a slide to nip any understeer in the bud, and with the wheels more or less pointing straight ahead by the apex, he can go to full throttle very early. This is only part of the process, because as front-heavy car which is RWD most of the time, it can still lose grip at the rear in turns.
This brings us to the other part, which may have to do with the GT-R's AWD system. According to some comments made by driving instructors who have used GT-R, it's not really AWD when more than a few degrees of lock are applied. It needs the front wheels to be pointing close to straight ahead, plus a loss of traction at the rear, to unleash its full AWD potential. Another incentive for Suzuki to come into turns with as little understeer as possible. Not a technique to be taken lightly, and it definitely requires driver involvement (and intimate knowledge of the vehicle) to make it happen like you see in the video.
great post"Both the GT-R and the 911 are specialist cars. They don't drive like anything else on the market. You just can't get into a GT2 never having driven one before and expect to go 10/10ths fast. It's a beast of a car and one that requires special skills and Porsche experience.
Whereas there's a seemingly universal belief that the GT-R is the opposite of that...it's apparently a PlayStation car, one that can go fast with any old muppet behind the wheel. Well, this is kind of true, all the way up to about 8/10ths of what he car can do. Drive over this, really push the car, and it all gets a bit difficult again. The Atessa system only punts power to the front wheels when it thinks you need it. To make the computer think you need it, you must deliberately throw the car with commitment and a little violence over the edges of its envelope. Only as the back wheels light up, or the front pushes desperately wide, will the car start to work its magic.
...the Atessa system needs a heavy right foot to push through natural understeer and into the realm of computer induced power oversteer."
This partially explains Suzuki's early turn-in, with quick sawing at the wheel well before what looks like should be the turn-in point. He seems to be deliberately throwing the car into a slide to nip any understeer in the bud, and with the wheels more or less pointing straight ahead by the apex, he can go to full throttle very early. This is only part of the process, because as front-heavy car which is RWD most of the time, it can still lose grip at the rear in turns.
This brings us to the other part, which may have to do with the GT-R's AWD system. According to some comments made by driving instructors who have used GT-R, it's not really AWD when more than a few degrees of lock are applied. It needs the front wheels to be pointing close to straight ahead, plus a loss of traction at the rear, to unleash its full AWD potential. Another incentive for Suzuki to come into turns with as little understeer as possible. Not a technique to be taken lightly, and it definitely requires driver involvement (and intimate knowledge of the vehicle) to make it happen like you see in the video.
personally, i've not got through the understeer yet
must try harder
They said the lap time beats the GT-Rs previous best around the ring.
Not sure what official record books you're talking about, because Nissan certainly aren't making a claim other than the new car being faster than the old.
is your post perhaps your roundabout way of saying "I'm not impressed with the lap time" or "I don't like the GT-R" ??.
Not sure what official record books you're talking about, because Nissan certainly aren't making a claim other than the new car being faster than the old.
is your post perhaps your roundabout way of saying "I'm not impressed with the lap time" or "I don't like the GT-R" ??.
Edited by Marf on Monday 28th March 10:54
Marf said:
is your post perhaps your roundabout way of saying "I'm not impressed with the lap time" or "I don't like the GT-R" ??.
The time is not actually for a full lap. The timing starts at the original start/finish line on the Nordschliefe, at the point where the clock is stopped, the car has just cleared the final bend at T13.Edited by Marf on Monday 28th March 10:54
The time is impressive by any standards. Whether I like the GTR or not is immaterial.
Marf said:
So where do your comments about record books originate? All they are saying is this year's car is faster than the previous models.
Just seems like a totally pointless post to me
I made one comment about record books, utilised to illustrate the fact that the time of 7:24:22 is optimistic as the car did not complete a full lap. Just seems like a totally pointless post to me
If Nissan are saying the car is faster than previous models based upon not quite a full lap then you are right and my post is pointless.
Tankman said:
The time is not actually for a full lap. The timing starts at the original start/finish line on the Nordschliefe, at the point where the clock is stopped, the car has just cleared the final bend at T13.
That's the accepted timing point (used by Sport Auto etc.) when you can't do a flying lap.
Trommel said:
That's the accepted timing point (used by Sport Auto etc.) when you can't do a flying lap.
One post, simple answer, no sarcasm, no condescending, no judgemental attitude, no pre-conceptions, nothing but a simple answer to a question as to why the lap was incomplete.Take note, Marf. You might learn something too today?
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