RE: New M5 Gets Show Debut In Shanghai

[kambites]

Sivraj said:

I've never experienced a stop/start system myself but I was told that the vehicle would need to be stationary for more than 30-60 seconds before the system kicked in,
Have to say I would not be happy living within with the system you describe!

The ones I've driven, the car has to be stationary, in neutral with the clutch fully up. As soon as you depress the clutch, the engine restarts.

[The JM]

"The 'S63' motor has also undergone some tweakery to its induction and exhausts for more top-end power and a sharper response than the X5 M and X6 M provide."

More Top end power? The maximum is the same as the X5M X6M is it not?

[130R]

Where did this figure of 552bhp come from?

[Zod]

130R said:

Where did this figure of 552bhp come from?

I don't know. They said when I was there a couple of weeks ago that the figure was remaining secret at Shanghai. The strong hint was that it would be more than the X5/6 M figure.

[DeadMeat_UK]

iOversteer said:

Zod said:

Can't see a problem with it. Around town it won't disturb you, but will boost economy. On the motorway or on a hoon it won't kick in.

I was refering to, someone driving in a PH manor (on boost, sideways etc) and then suddenly has to pull up at a set of traffic lights (for example). The turbo chargers will still be spinning, then the engine shuts off as does the oil supply. Leaving two expensive BMW turbos spinning with no oil supply

I sure hope those experienced, proven, reliable, expert BMW engineers read the internet. They may not have thought of that.

[Dagnut]

sootyrumble said:

Dagnut said:

It's like that old chestnut the turbo timer, completely unnecessary yet people still fit them to modern turbo cars...only takes a couple of seconds for the turbo's to slow their spin to a harmless level ,so unless you were hammering the car and pulled up to a complete halt in 2 seconds you're not going to have a problem

Its not the turbo still spinning that hammers them its the elevated turbo temperature burning the oil in the housing when the engines stopped and leaving the bearings dry, in this case stopping for seconds at a time will make no difference at all as the oil will still be around them, thats why you should let a turbo car "cool" down for the last 1 mile of a drive :-. This is why turbo timers do still have some function as they keep the engine ticking over and feeding oil to the turbo till it reaches a reasobable temperature so when you next start the car the bearings are still lubricated

Edited by sootyrumble on Tuesday 19th April 12:55

I've had 2 turbo cars and I always followed this rational, until I read that it doesn't make a blind bit of difference.. a couple of seconds is enough...30 years of turbo's a not one manufacture has fitted one of even specified in the warranties you should cool down your car for a couple of minutes.

[iOversteer]

DeadMeat_UK said:

I sure hope those experienced, proven, reliable, expert BMW engineers read the internet. They may not have thought of that.

I would very much hope so too.

[Mermaid]

DeadMeat_UK said:

iOversteer said:

Zod said:

Can't see a problem with it. Around town it won't disturb you, but will boost economy. On the motorway or on a hoon it won't kick in.

I was refering to, someone driving in a PH manor (on boost, sideways etc) and then suddenly has to pull up at a set of traffic lights (for example). The turbo chargers will still be spinning, then the engine shuts off as does the oil supply. Leaving two expensive BMW turbos spinning with no oil supply

I sure hope those experienced, proven, reliable, expert BMW engineers read the internet. They may not have thought of that.

The earliest Alpina Turbo cars suffered Turbo issues - they advised driving at a gentle pace for a few miles before you switched off the engine - but that was in the 80's. They sorted the problem out and no doubt their expertise will be available to BMW.

[predding]

neil_bmw said:

Kong said:

I think this goes to show the German power war is over.

1998 - M5 400bhp
2000 - E55 AMG 470bhp
2002 - RS6 440bhp
2005 - M5 500bhp
2007 - RS6 570bhp
2009 - E63 AMG 525bhp
2011 - M5 552bhp

For the first time BMW and Merc have both released their fastest executive saloon with LESS power than the existing Audi.

And the corresponding torque figures and power to weight figures are?

Good / important point. BTW 2002 RS6 V8 had 450 bhp - even Audi got this wrong at Goodwood FoS last year. Torque is key. My 635d 'only' has 286bhp but now 600 Nm of torque; compare that to RS5 450bhp and 317 lb/ft (430Nm) torque.

[rb5230]

A tractor, bus or lorry has even more torque, does not mean its fast though.

[Polarbert]

sootyrumble said:

I still think that the V8 M5 was the best of them all, it was the most understated lightest and smallest (Apart from the first M5), to my mind the perfect combination of luxury, power, control and stealth

I would absolutely love one of those motors. Very good cars from what I've seen of them. Much more appealing that the outgoing model.

[Zod]

predding said:

Good / important point. BTW 2002 RS6 V8 had 450 bhp - even Audi got this wrong at Goodwood FoS last year. Torque is key. My 635d 'only' has 286bhp but now 600 Nm of torque; compare that to RS5 450bhp and 317 lb/ft (430Nm) torque.

Really? So my X5 with 600Nm of torque must perform better than my M5 with "only" 500Nm then.

(It doesn't by the way)

[Zod]

Polarbert said:

sootyrumble said:

I still think that the V8 M5 was the best of them all, it was the most understated lightest and smallest (Apart from the first M5), to my mind the perfect combination of luxury, power, control and stealth

I would absolutely love one of those motors. Very good cars from what I've seen of them. Much more appealing that the outgoing model.

The E39 is lighter by the weight of a small child than the E60, but has 20% less power. The appeal is in the drvie. Until you've driven both, it's difficult to see how you can make the comparison.

[M666 EVO]

fatboy b said:

Does nothing for me at all - and that goes for all current BMW styling.

And past...

[Dagnut]

Zod said:

Polarbert said:

sootyrumble said:

I still think that the V8 M5 was the best of them all, it was the most understated lightest and smallest (Apart from the first M5), to my mind the perfect combination of luxury, power, control and stealth

I would absolutely love one of those motors. Very good cars from what I've seen of them. Much more appealing that the outgoing model.

The E39 is lighter by the weight of a small child than the E60, but has 20% less power. The appeal is in the drvie. Until you've driven both, it's difficult to see how you can make the comparison.

Yeah theres a lot of romanticising over the E39..its a big heavy car.

[130R]

Zod said:

I don't know. They said when I was there a couple of weeks ago that the figure was remaining secret at Shanghai. The strong hint was that it would be more than the X5/6 M figure.

That's what I thought too, so I'd be surprised if the number in this story turns out to be correct.

[AbarthChris]

kambites said:

The ones I've driven, the car has to be stationary, in neutral with the clutch fully up. As soon as you depress the clutch, the engine restarts.

Exactly, I don't see how Johnpeat's mate manages it...

[scoopz]

Zod said:

130R said:

Where did this figure of 552bhp come from?

I don't know. They said when I was there a couple of weeks ago that the figure was remaining secret at Shanghai. The strong hint was that it would be more than the X5/6 M figure.

The performance figures have not yet been confirmed by BMW, looks like PistonHeads are going off fabricated numbers published by one of the car magazines.

Edited by scoopz on Tuesday 19th April 17:42

[Atrophy]

goron59 said:

Yawn. I'm sure it's a lovely motor, but this is a concept, so couldn't they even try to make it interesting?

Exactly what im thinking!

[Zod]

Atrophy said:

goron59 said:

Yawn. I'm sure it's a lovely motor, but this is a concept, so couldn't they even try to make it interesting?

Exactly what im thinking!

You two don't really get the M5.