Would you buy a car with high miles?
Discussion
lance1a said:
You can call what you want, I know it for a fact. The car had one owner prior to me and I'm pretty sure he would have known if someone stuck a clutch in the car. What you missed is that the car was only used long distance, hence the very low wear to the interior and drivetrain. It has more than likely done the same amount of gearchanges as a car with 100 000 miles on it. The same as clutches can wear on some shopping or school run cars within a short time or distance. Years ago we ran an Opel test in SA wgere we did a continuous lap of the country for a distance of 480 000 miles in a few Monza/Reckord models, after the test was completed (during which only service items were replaced) the cars were stripped and tested. Compression ratios were within manufacturers specs and if you drove one (as I did) you would have thought the car had less than 50 000 miles on it. No clutches were required.
I sometimes think engine hours would be a more sensible measure of a cars wear.If you drive for 2 hours in London every day for 2 years you'll have a car with, what, 14k miles on it? Low mileage, people will pay a premium for it.
If you drive for 2 hours every day up and down the A38 here in Devon for 2 years you'd have 65k miles on the same car.
I wonder which has suffered the most wear and tear? Which car would be hard to sell and which would have a queue of numpties wanting it?
IMHO depends whether diesel or petrol.
Diesel high miler I had was 2005 Focus 1600TDCI. By time I'd sold it was over the 120k mark at 4 and a half years old. Starting to show up issues with injectors and the odd leak.
Nothing major, just niggles, and wouldn't return decent MPG.
Drove fantastic though and was still relatively quiet.
Petrol, 1996 BMW 320i tourer. 115k on the clock, ticks over almost silently, will take relentless abuse. Surprisingly economical. And no matter what it just keeps firing up and running spot-on.
Diesel round 2: 2006 SAAB 9-3 TID vector sport (150bhp 1.9diesel). Owned just over 14months, 77k on clock, munched an alternator, EGR needed it's 2nd clear out/remedy. Apart from that, it looks the same as the dealer offerings with 20k on the clock.
And drives the same.
IME (known plenty of mates with high mile diesels and petrols) anything Turbo Diseasal, seems to cost money or have niggles when you pass the 100k-110k mark.
Petrols, may not get the MPG but just keep ploughing on
Diesel high miler I had was 2005 Focus 1600TDCI. By time I'd sold it was over the 120k mark at 4 and a half years old. Starting to show up issues with injectors and the odd leak.
Nothing major, just niggles, and wouldn't return decent MPG.
Drove fantastic though and was still relatively quiet.
Petrol, 1996 BMW 320i tourer. 115k on the clock, ticks over almost silently, will take relentless abuse. Surprisingly economical. And no matter what it just keeps firing up and running spot-on.
Diesel round 2: 2006 SAAB 9-3 TID vector sport (150bhp 1.9diesel). Owned just over 14months, 77k on clock, munched an alternator, EGR needed it's 2nd clear out/remedy. Apart from that, it looks the same as the dealer offerings with 20k on the clock.
And drives the same.
IME (known plenty of mates with high mile diesels and petrols) anything Turbo Diseasal, seems to cost money or have niggles when you pass the 100k-110k mark.
Petrols, may not get the MPG but just keep ploughing on
lance1a said:
You can call what you want, I know it for a fact. The car had one owner prior to me and I'm pretty sure he would have known if someone stuck a clutch in the car. What you missed is that the car was only used long distance, hence the very low wear to the interior and drivetrain. It has more than likely done the same amount of gearchanges as a car with 100 000 miles on it. The same as clutches can wear on some shopping or school run cars within a short time or distance. Years ago we ran an Opel test in SA wgere we did a continuous lap of the country for a distance of 480 000 miles in a few Monza/Reckord models, after the test was completed (during which only service items were replaced) the cars were stripped and tested. Compression ratios were within manufacturers specs and if you drove one (as I did) you would have thought the car had less than 50 000 miles on it. No clutches were required.
Would not surprise me. My car had a new clutch at 130 ish thou as the release bearing was causing issues. However it is now on 340 thou. Thats 210 thou on a clutch and its showing no wear issues at all.
Depends on the driver and where and how the car is used.
I'm currently driving a 405 Estate with 215K on it - I traded from a 3-year-younger Vectra with 83K which was in a far poorer mechanical nick!!
It's a diesel ofc. - and it's a bit of a throwback in some ways (Peugeot clutches of that era are sticky and nasty) but it runs well and, indeed, pulls better than the 5-year-younger 406 I borrowed whilst I was having some stuff tidied-up on it...
It's a diesel ofc. - and it's a bit of a throwback in some ways (Peugeot clutches of that era are sticky and nasty) but it runs well and, indeed, pulls better than the 5-year-younger 406 I borrowed whilst I was having some stuff tidied-up on it...
DJC said:
My Father has 200k on his 2003 Volvo, again - no issues.
5pot petrol?My dad bought one that was 5years old, C70, had 135k on. Which around here was considered "high mileage".
Kept it 3years, sold it for £1800 less than paid for it.
With 180+k on the clock.
Only 2 known faults/niggles: 1) the washer bottle indicator needed changing every 18months at £35. And 2) after a month of around town pootling it would become a bit lumpy, so a 5mile burn down a straightish set of B roads, aiming for the red-line in the first 3gears, would clear it out. Hey presto, another month of clean use was to be had. (more down to type of driving than the car I presume)
My beemer has 115k on a 96, which is bugger all and simply will not die.
MOT station commented that it's as solid as they've seen in years, for test this year it needed 2x front brake flex's at £30 a piece.
Emissions were spot on, and it runs nigh-on silently. It does round town mileage 4days a week, and sees A and B roads at weekends. Driven properly.
Then of course there is the issue of not enough miles –
http://funsverylimited.blogspot.com/2011/07/undriv...
http://funsverylimited.blogspot.com/2011/07/undriv...
Fox- said:
lance1a said:
You can call what you want, I know it for a fact. The car had one owner prior to me and I'm pretty sure he would have known if someone stuck a clutch in the car. What you missed is that the car was only used long distance, hence the very low wear to the interior and drivetrain. It has more than likely done the same amount of gearchanges as a car with 100 000 miles on it. The same as clutches can wear on some shopping or school run cars within a short time or distance. Years ago we ran an Opel test in SA wgere we did a continuous lap of the country for a distance of 480 000 miles in a few Monza/Reckord models, after the test was completed (during which only service items were replaced) the cars were stripped and tested. Compression ratios were within manufacturers specs and if you drove one (as I did) you would have thought the car had less than 50 000 miles on it. No clutches were required.
I sometimes think engine hours would be a more sensible measure of a cars wear.If you drive for 2 hours in London every day for 2 years you'll have a car with, what, 14k miles on it? Low mileage, people will pay a premium for it.
If you drive for 2 hours every day up and down the A38 here in Devon for 2 years you'd have 65k miles on the same car.
I wonder which has suffered the most wear and tear? Which car would be hard to sell and which would have a queue of numpties wanting it?
billzeebub said:
I have always owned quality marques. Usually high milers with full service history and receipts, low total owners and try to buy from a well heeled sort. There are a great many middle class professional people who keep their cars for several years..those are the ones I go for..and try to research original factory specs and go for one of those..never had a problem following these rules..and never needed to hpi or had any hidden problems
as long as modern cars are well serviced they should keep going..particularly the premium brands..though some modern cars do rely rather heavily on technology/electrics and I wonder what the long term cost of fettling all these gizmos will be!!?
Always HPI a car you buy (beforehand of course)as long as modern cars are well serviced they should keep going..particularly the premium brands..though some modern cars do rely rather heavily on technology/electrics and I wonder what the long term cost of fettling all these gizmos will be!!?
lance1a said:
You can call what you want, I know it for a fact. The car had one owner prior to me and I'm pretty sure he would have known if someone stuck a clutch in the car. What you missed is that the car was only used long distance, hence the very low wear to the interior and drivetrain. It has more than likely done the same amount of gearchanges as a car with 100 000 miles on it. The same as clutches can wear on some shopping or school run cars within a short time or distance. Years ago we ran an Opel test in SA wgere we did a continuous lap of the country for a distance of 480 000 miles in a few Monza/Reckord models, after the test was completed (during which only service items were replaced) the cars were stripped and tested. Compression ratios were within manufacturers specs and if you drove one (as I did) you would have thought the car had less than 50 000 miles on it. No clutches were required.
Sorry, think I may have been a bit hasty pulling the BS card out! Nearly half a million miles on one clutch is seriously impressive though! I get your point about longer average trip distance equals many less gearchanges per mile, hence correspondingly less clutch wear. They really must have been looong trips :-)
I think by the time you hit 100,000ish miles manufacturer reliability has gone out of the window and the engine life is dictated by the previous owners. You could buy an 90,000 miler that has been thrashed to death by the previous 3 owners which then goes pop 5,000 miles down the road. Or you could buy a 120,000 miler that has been cared for all of it's life and will end up doing it's mileage all over again.
The problem with a lot of high mileage cars is the use the new owners put them to.
Alot of high mileage cars are happy to be warmed up and drive smoothly down a motorway 10-100+ miles, then people buy 150k mile cars to go 2 miles twice a day over loads of speed bumps at the speed limit + some to drop the kids off at school possibly even less distance and the car never warms up, then they get surprised that everything on it breaks and it doesn't manage the 70mpg they were expecting.
A turbo, injectors, dmf and dpf and £4k lighter and back you go to a low mileage petrol. Except that hasn't been used enough either and so its already suffered the fate they gave the high mileage diesel they purchased so the costs add up as they kill off another car.
Meanwhile, those who actually have time for their car to warm up (even longer for diesel, especially in winter correct?) reap the rewards of a bargain high miler.
A lot of high mileage cars have never had bush, suspension etc work done and can need alot spent to get the ride back to anything like new, obviously depends on the car but its silly paying extra for a car with sports suspension that's completely shot.
Alot of high mileage cars are happy to be warmed up and drive smoothly down a motorway 10-100+ miles, then people buy 150k mile cars to go 2 miles twice a day over loads of speed bumps at the speed limit + some to drop the kids off at school possibly even less distance and the car never warms up, then they get surprised that everything on it breaks and it doesn't manage the 70mpg they were expecting.
A turbo, injectors, dmf and dpf and £4k lighter and back you go to a low mileage petrol. Except that hasn't been used enough either and so its already suffered the fate they gave the high mileage diesel they purchased so the costs add up as they kill off another car.
Meanwhile, those who actually have time for their car to warm up (even longer for diesel, especially in winter correct?) reap the rewards of a bargain high miler.
A lot of high mileage cars have never had bush, suspension etc work done and can need alot spent to get the ride back to anything like new, obviously depends on the car but its silly paying extra for a car with sports suspension that's completely shot.
Edited by BlueMR2 on Tuesday 2nd August 15:50
mgmrw2003 said:
IMHO depends whether diesel or petrol.
Diesel high miler I had was 2005 Focus 1600TDCI. By time I'd sold it was over the 120k mark at 4 and a half years old. Starting to show up issues with injectors and the odd leak.
Nothing major, just niggles, and wouldn't return decent MPG.
Drove fantastic though and was still relatively quiet.
Petrol, 1996 BMW 320i tourer. 115k on the clock, ticks over almost silently, will take relentless abuse. Surprisingly economical. And no matter what it just keeps firing up and running spot-on.
Diesel round 2: 2006 SAAB 9-3 TID vector sport (150bhp 1.9diesel). Owned just over 14months, 77k on clock, munched an alternator, EGR needed it's 2nd clear out/remedy. Apart from that, it looks the same as the dealer offerings with 20k on the clock.
And drives the same.
IME (known plenty of mates with high mile diesels and petrols) anything Turbo Diseasal, seems to cost money or have niggles when you pass the 100k-110k mark.
Petrols, may not get the MPG but just keep ploughing on
I have to agree with you totally!Diesel high miler I had was 2005 Focus 1600TDCI. By time I'd sold it was over the 120k mark at 4 and a half years old. Starting to show up issues with injectors and the odd leak.
Nothing major, just niggles, and wouldn't return decent MPG.
Drove fantastic though and was still relatively quiet.
Petrol, 1996 BMW 320i tourer. 115k on the clock, ticks over almost silently, will take relentless abuse. Surprisingly economical. And no matter what it just keeps firing up and running spot-on.
Diesel round 2: 2006 SAAB 9-3 TID vector sport (150bhp 1.9diesel). Owned just over 14months, 77k on clock, munched an alternator, EGR needed it's 2nd clear out/remedy. Apart from that, it looks the same as the dealer offerings with 20k on the clock.
And drives the same.
IME (known plenty of mates with high mile diesels and petrols) anything Turbo Diseasal, seems to cost money or have niggles when you pass the 100k-110k mark.
Petrols, may not get the MPG but just keep ploughing on
Everybody I know who has had a diesel (including the 2 I had) have spent more money on replacing the injectors/pump than they ever saved on fuel! Especially when you consider the original outlay.
Some people may be very lucky and had a good diesel last 200,000miles?
Just that I've never met one! I'd never buy another diesel with 100,000 on the clock!
I bought a 3.9 petrol Range Rover some years ago with over 100,000 on the clock and drove that for 5 years without a fault.
A friend who drove that RR bought a diesel Toyota Land Cruiser -- because it had a better reputation???
Three times the engine blew up on cylinder No3! Abandoned in France once!
His diesel Galaxy has has had three engines now due to turbo/injector failures! Abandoned in France twice!
His 12 year old 4.0 litre XKR Jag? Not a single problem that has left him at the side of the road!
Another friend had a diesel Vauxhall Omega with that BMW 6 cylinder engine, where a 20pence seal went in the back of the pump, it would have cost £2000 to fix! He did it himself in the end once he got that 20pence seal! But had to strip the engine out!
Light weight diesels just don't seem to last as long as the truck engines they were copied from.
Some (a lot?) of diesel failures were caused when they changed from hi sulphur to the low with eco juice mix. My Peugeot was one that had seal failure put down to this!
So perhaps newer diesels will last longer?
Petrol for me every time! LPG it if you want economy.
VPower said:
Some (a lot?) of diesel failures were caused when they changed from hi sulphur to the low with eco juice mix. My Peugeot was one that had seal failure put down to this!
So perhaps newer diesels will last longer?
Petrol for me every time! LPG it if you want economy.
Unfortunately, new petrol with methanol? has the potential to kill off older petrols.So perhaps newer diesels will last longer?
Petrol for me every time! LPG it if you want economy.
VPower said:
I have to agree with you totally!
Everybody I know who has had a diesel (including the 2 I had) have spent more money on replacing the injectors/pump than they ever saved on fuel! Especially when you consider the original outlay.
I've got several mates in the trade, and they all drive mondeo/astra/focus/punto diesels, and only do 6-7k mile a year. I cannot fathom it.Everybody I know who has had a diesel (including the 2 I had) have spent more money on replacing the injectors/pump than they ever saved on fuel! Especially when you consider the original outlay.
Also they all tell you how many diesels come back to their place of work needing expensive parts.
Seem to justify it by telling you how they got 55mpg on a landsend to john-agrotes trip they did 5years ago.
VPower said:
Stuff in between --------
Light weight diesels just don't seem to last as long as the truck engines they were copied from.
Some (a lot?) of diesel failures were caused when they changed from hi sulphur to the low with eco juice mix. My Peugeot was one that had seal failure put down to this!
So perhaps newer diesels will last longer?
Petrol for me every time! LPG it if you want economy.
One mate, was telling me how his place basically scrapped 1x mondeo and 1x vectra, both 125kish miles dervs..... Because the problems they had, whilst minor in symptoms, were going to set the owner back at least 2k. (like the omega you mentioned).
Only diseasals I owned were for purpose, I.E. wacking 30-40,000 miles a year.
If I'm buying a high miler, it'll always be petrol, usually a big lazy engine.
Can't see new diesels lasting any longer TBH. They're being pushed to be:
> quieter, smoother, faster, more eco friendly, more efficient
End result is that they'll just go bang. Start having new breed failiures.
A14RGS said:
My '96 Audi A4 2.6 (V6 petrol) is now showing 350000 miles. I bought it almost six years ago when it had a mere 236000 - it had been owned by father and son from new and had a fab service history.
I bought it as a stop-gap, but it just keeps on going! I've kept up the history using a very good local independant garage and the car still drives really well and is incredibly reliable. I did have to change the original exhaust last year, but it's still on the original clutch and the engine has never been apart. It's a good 'un, although absolutely worthless in financial terms!
Who says high mileage cars aren't a good buy?!
Happy days - Audi passed its MoT yesterday at 350152 miles, fifth consecutive year with 'No Advisories' I bought it as a stop-gap, but it just keeps on going! I've kept up the history using a very good local independant garage and the car still drives really well and is incredibly reliable. I did have to change the original exhaust last year, but it's still on the original clutch and the engine has never been apart. It's a good 'un, although absolutely worthless in financial terms!
Who says high mileage cars aren't a good buy?!
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