996 GT3 FS

[lemmingjames]

Is it easy to return to oem? If not, mention it and say what it does etc.


Its more likely to be purchased by someone looking to drive than speculate as its not a low mileage car (is it)?

[squirejo]

Speed yellow anyone?

http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/996...

[EGTE_RPF]

Are they honestly 6 times better than a decent C2?

That's what I end up asking myself whenever I look at one of these cars.

I want one, but not that much.

[rallyeman]

squirejo said:

Speed yellow anyone?

http://www.jzmporsche.com/porsche-for-sale/911/996...

I reckon, mines a bargain at 61k

Edited by rallyeman on Sunday 26th July 13:18

[rallyeman]

Slippydiff said:

EGTE_RPF said:

Are they honestly 6 times better than a decent C2?

That's what I end up asking myself whenever I look at one of these cars.

I want one, but not that much.

Rather than pontificate, drive one, then you'll be qualified to make the decision

Totally agree!
Although a decent 996 C2 is 15-20k, and my GT3 is 61k. So not 6 times better.......

[EGTE_RPF]

Slippydiff said:

EGTE_RPF said:

Are they honestly 6 times better than a decent C2?

That's what I end up asking myself whenever I look at one of these cars.

I want one, but not that much.

Rather than pontificate, drive one, then you'll be qualified to make the decision

I wasn't pontificating; I genuinely wonder why/if people do think they're (3-)6 times better than a C2 (especially if C2 has sports suspension and exhaust).

Don't forget, I could be implying that the (good) non-Mezger 996s are under-priced and not that GT3s are over-priced.

Edited by EGTE_RPF on Sunday 26th July 17:23

[andy102]

EGTE_RPF said:

Are they honestly 6 times better than a decent C2?

That's what I end up asking myself whenever I look at one of these cars.

I want one, but not that much.

I had both and I think so.
Another question, is the RS twice the car the 996.2 GT3 is ?

[DasChin]

Its got nothing to do with whether sth is 5 times better just because it 5 x more expensive....there are so many other factors.

Its the sum of the parts in the gt3 that makes it and in many ways its a very very different car to the c2 underneath. Yes external there are common parts as there are with the interior but once you get to drivetrain, handling, suspension and engine its very different.

Rarity and limited supply is a major one and its pure supply and demand mixed with market conditions. How many normal c2 996 were made? 10000 plus probably.

There there is the engine in the gt3 versus the well documented issues in the c2 with the 3.4 and 3.6. The mezger has the le mans winning gt1 bloodline.

I used to have the same discussion when I had the csl...why is it so much more. Again its the sun of the parts and the rarity of it. Drive a gt3 and c2 back to back and they are WORLDS apart. I am talking standard c2 and gt3....not some tweaked c2.

Face facts if you want one you have to pay up.

[Richie200]

DasChin said:

Its got nothing to do with whether sth is 5 times better just because it 5 x more expensive....there are so many other factors.

Its the sum of the parts in the gt3 that makes it and in many ways its a very very different car to the c2 underneath. Yes external there are common parts as there are with the interior but once you get to drivetrain, handling, suspension and engine its very different.

Rarity and limited supply is a major one and its pure supply and demand mixed with market conditions. How many normal c2 996 were made? 10000 plus probably.

There there is the engine in the gt3 versus the well documented issues in the c2 with the 3.4 and 3.6. The mezger has the le mans winning gt1 bloodline.

I used to have the same discussion when I had the csl...why is it so much more. Again its the sun of the parts and the rarity of it. Drive a gt3 and c2 back to back and they are WORLDS apart. I am talking standard c2 and gt3....not some tweaked c2.

Face facts if you want one you have to pay up.

^Completely agree with this^ However there are various C2's to consider. IMHO it all depends on which 996. There were 8296 C2 Coupe's produced with Mechanical throttle (the 3.4 from 1998), of those, say around 50% were auto, so a total of 4000ish isn't a particularly big number of the 175000 996's that were produced.

To put in perspective there were around 65,000 964's from memory and about 2300 of those were 964RS's. So in absolute terms there are/were roughly twice the number of Non E-throttle 996 C2 manuals floating around. Add in a full Hartech rebuild and a fully sorted non-E throttle is quite a rare beast...

Still not a patch on the GT3 but the point made above about '6 times as much' has some validity.

[Mousem40]

Price has little to do with how relatively good a car is to drive.
Is a 250GTO 300 times a better car to drive than a 6GT3? It's very likely a worse car.

The 996 Carrera is a massively underpriced car, so is the 986 Boxster. I would say (having owned both) the GT3 is at most 100% better as a drive (and I think the GT3 is an absolutely stunning car to drive) probably less. It's a crazy price bubble we are going through.

Edited by Mousem40 on Monday 27th July 08:32

[EGTE_RPF]

Good replies, thanks Gents.

Good question about the RS, too.

[DasChin]

I see what you are saying Richie....but then how many of those 964s and RSs are left now? we are talking about 20-25 year old cars now. many would have rotted away or been crashed or stolen/never seen again. they were not cherished but the ones that were are now worth fortunes.

if there are 4000+ C2 coupe with manual...there are say 200 RHD GT3 MK2s left.. that takes the C2 a large multiple (20x) more available.

I agree a 996 C2 is well underpriced and would be a great great buy. 1300 KGs, 300 BHP, loads of fun and rwd. buy one that has had the engine sorted and its a great great buy/car to enjoy.

I have had both C2 and GT3 now. is the GT3 6 times the car? I would say no, not at all. but then how are you measuring it? fun? speed? enjoyment? reliability? etc etc.

its not a great measure or multiple to use and the whole price/value increase thing has just got stupid. sadly it seems to ruin every conversation now on here and other forums.

I always wanted a GT3 after a few le mans & ring trips in the early/mid 2000s as it was just an all round awesome car and just pounded the euro miles and then the tracks. I got one and just enjoy every minute I am in the car. its not a daily admittedly but I always try to use it when I can. every journey is just an epic mission and it so so different to the modern family Sofas that we also have.

Edited by DasChin on Monday 27th July 09:59

[Richie200]

DasChin said:

I see what you are saying Richie....but then how many of those 964s and RSs are left now? we are talking about 20-25 year old cars now. many would have rotted away or been crashed or stolen/never seen again. they were not cherished but the ones that were are now worth fortunes.

if there are 4000+ C2 coupe with manual...there are say 200 RHD GT3 MK2s left.. that takes the C2 a large multiple (20x) more available.

I agree a 996 C2 is well underpriced and would be a great great buy. 1300 KGs, 300 BHP, loads of fun and rwd. buy one that has had the engine sorted and its a great great buy/car to enjoy.

I have had both C2 and GT3 now. is the GT3 6 times the car? I would say no, not at all. but then how are you measuring it? fun? speed? enjoyment? reliability? etc etc.

its not a great measure or multiple to use and the whole price/value increase thing has just got stupid. sadly it seems to ruin every conversation now on here and other forums.

I always wanted a GT3 after a few le mans & ring trips in the early/mid 2000s as it was just an all round awesome car and just pounded the euro miles and then the tracks. I got one and just enjoy every minute I am in the car. its not a daily admittedly but I always try to use it when I can. every journey is just an epic mission and it so so different to the modern family Sofas that we also have.

Edited by DasChin on Monday 27th July 09:59

Sorry just to clarify, the 4000, was total World-wide production, not UK only (I've no idea of UK RHD numbers). Fully understand the draw of the Mezger, I also have one myself along with the C2.
Really glad to hear you using your cars as intended; seems quite rare nowadays

[LaSource]

6GT3s still do get used as intended...its the 6RSs which have stopped doing active duty on the whole. However, once the 6GT3s climb above £100k I can see them also retreating from active service.

All very sad (and understandable) of course...

[DasChin]

some already have LaSource. looks at the two in the classifieds. ultra low milers.

shame to see such great cars not used and wrapped up. real waste.

[Steve Rance]

I agree. A real shame. Good old busses, I think some of the very best.

[Mousem40]

The Yorkshire classic Porsche 996.2 has dropped from £92 to £82.5 now.

[rallyeman]

Mousem40 said:

The Yorkshire classic Porsche 996.2 has dropped from £92 to £82.5 now.

I feel this will be the trend for a while, if sales are wanted

Edited by rallyeman on Thursday 30th July 12:21

[lboase]

Certainly seem to have found a price level where owners are willing to sell, given the number of cars available, including some nice spec and colours.

911V and JZM seem to price a little more realistically. I can't see why anyone would buy the Yorkshire classic Porsche car over the JZM black car at 8k cheaper and the JZM warranty etc.

Jackal's car looks very smart at 911V. That would be my pick. Or the RPM car but looks less good value.

[DiscoColin]

LaSource said:

6GT3s still do get used as intended...its the 6RSs which have stopped doing active duty on the whole. However, once the 6GT3s climb above £100k I can see them also retreating from active service.

All very sad (and understandable) of course...

To put this into perspective - at DN12 the other week I counted only 3 UK 996 GT3s and no 996RSs. And they were still the most common kind of GT3 amongst the UK-plated contingent. For DN regulars that would have to be considered a positive collapse of the number of them there, and it does fit with what I have seen at other track days on the continent this year. Part of it is the value, part of it the per-event insurance costs in Europe that have arrived on the policies most popular with TD users. But they are vanishing, and fast.

It is quite a drastic shift when you consider how ubiquitous they were not that long ago