M135i to 996/997?

[Phateuk]

mrdemon said:

imo never buy a stter as a run about, why spend 80% of your life in a stter.

B: the m135i is not that fast a car any way some people are saying other cars ie 911's and Caymans will be slower but the m135i is about 11 seconds to a ton !! A new Boxster is faster than that !

not that you are buying new but even a 2003 base model 911 does the ton faster !!!

So the quotes given on here are a bit misleading, also fast these days is sub 8 to a ton with the GTR and 911 turbo's doing the ton in the 6's that's twice as fast as a M135i

I see ORD has the same feeling, great minds and all that :-)

Edited by mrdemon on Monday 21st July 09:39

I see what you mean about the daily snotter, but I think this would prevent the nicer car becoming dulled down and feeling boring during commute traffic.

Comparing 0-100 is a better benchmark for outright speed of a car, however in day to day real world driving I wouldn't consider it that relevant, I do full bore 30-80 at least once a day but going up to a ton not that often due to traffic constraints an the fondness of my licence

[mrdemon]

you just become a far better driver driving the right car 100% of the time.

I don't get the stter thing at all, seems pointless to me and the money would go towards a better 911.

30-80 a Cayman/911 is quite fast below 90 you are just used to the torque and have prob got lazy.

depends what you want ? A to B fastest car out there is a chipped TTRS DSG :-) 4WD 430ft'lbs torque mine did 30-80- in 4 seconds and was a manual !!!
easy sub 4 for DSG cars.

My Cayman does 30-80 in 5.5 again a manual stock car but that's right on a gear change at 72 mph , 30-70 is 3.9 seconds.

m135i is about 5.3 30-80.

depends what you call fast, my TTRS was a laugh for a while having that punch (40-60mph was just a second) but once you are used to it that's that.
plus all these cars you can use that power in the wet, the M135i in the damp just does not work, forget snow ;-)

Edited by mrdemon on Monday 21st July 10:38

[Phateuk]

mrdemon said:

you just become a far better driver driving the right car 100% of the time.

I don't get the stter thing at all, seems pointless to me and the money would go towards a better 911.

30-80 a Cayman/911 is quite fast below 90 you are just used to the torque and have prob got lazy.

depends what you want ? A to B fastest car out there is a chipped TTRS DSG :-) 4WD 430ft'lbs torque mine did 30-80- in 4 seconds and was a manual !!!
easy sub 4 for DSG cars.

My Cayman does 30-80 in 5.5 again a manual stock car but that's right on a gear change at 72 mph , 30-70 is 3.9 seconds.

m135i is about 5.3 30-80.

depends what you call fast, my TTRS was a laugh for a while having that punch (40-60mph was just a second) but once you are used to it that's that.

I'm not after the fastest car A to B, I'm after a car that feels special on the road when driven for pleasure (not commuting) and also fairly competant on track (I realise it will always be compromised due to being a road car).

The M135i does everything so well I'm concerned I'll miss the all round capability. As a road car I don't think I'd want for any more, on track you do notice it lacking above 100-110+ and as mentioned you look down and you're going slower than you realise - the acceleration really drops off over 120.

Maybe I should leave the porsche for now and keep the 135i for daily use and buy a vx220/elise

[LordHaveMurci]

Phateuk said:

I'm not after the fastest car A to B, I'm after a car that feels special on the road when driven for pleasure (not commuting) and also fairly competant on track (I realise it will always be compromised due to being a road car).

The M135i does everything so well I'm concerned I'll miss the all round capability. As a road car I don't think I'd want for any more, on track you do notice it lacking above 100-110+ and as mentioned you look down and you're going slower than you realise - the acceleration really drops off over 120.

Maybe I should leave the porsche for now and keep the 135i for daily use and buy a vx220/elise

Took the family down to the beach yesterday afternoon for an ice cream as the weather was lovely, took the 996 for a run knowing the traffic would be heavy & slow.

Even at sunday afternoon speeds I could feel the car flowing over the road & transmitting so much information through the wheel & the seat of my pants! I am very biased, I can't deny that, but a 911 is a truly special car to drive, sadly many people buy them as status symbols & never appreciate how special they actually are but that's their loss. And the only other 911 we saw was a 997 C4S Cab, saw plenty of 1 series beemers though.

[Riyazc]

We go on a eurotrip each yr and this yr one of the guys had a 135i ... had no issue keeping up!

Its a bloody fast car for what it is. No it doesnt drive or handle like a porsche, but then its a BMW.

Pace wise the car lacks for nothing... we were all impressed but how much the car could do.

Guess part of your choice is practicalities - 4 seats a necessity, or a nice to have? Boot space etc...

[ORD]

The keeping up on public roads test is fairly easy to pass, though, especially for a turbocharged car. I had a maniac in a Mini Cooper S stick with me for most of some fairly spirited driving recently. She was about half a mile back by the top of Fish Hill but caught up on the next straight by hitting 100, which is pretty stupid but a good way to close a gap that results from better handling.

I think the 1 series is a pretty average platform. The 135i a great engine (if you don't mind tc) in a pretty average car. It's a damn shame it's got very little competition unless you want a stressed out 4 cyl with artificial engine sound.

[Callughan]

Based on experience in a straight there's not much in it until very high speed. However everything else will be more sharper and fun.

[simonriley11]

I've had a 996 Turbo for 3 years and 16000 miles and a new M135i auto for 8 months and 9000 miles. I bought the BMW because I wanted to reduce the miles I was putting on the 911 with commuting (12000 miles per annum) and it has worked really well for me. For everyday driving there is no real performance difference between them as they are both so fast that you can't really use all the performance. The BMW is fun and a bit lairy (which I like) and is practical and so far bullet proof, the 911 is in a different performance league once you wind it up and has a much more resolved chassis when you really push on. I know this is subjective but somehow the 911 just feels special where the BMW doesn't.
I think the BMW is an excellent car for the money and would recommend it to anyone and the 996 Turbo is just fantastic, full stop.

[Gibbo205]

Phateuk said:

I'm not after the fastest car A to B, I'm after a car that feels special on the road when driven for pleasure (not commuting) and also fairly competant on track (I realise it will always be compromised due to being a road car).

The M135i does everything so well I'm concerned I'll miss the all round capability. As a road car I don't think I'd want for any more, on track you do notice it lacking above 100-110+ and as mentioned you look down and you're going slower than you realise - the acceleration really drops off over 120.

Maybe I should leave the porsche for now and keep the 135i for daily use and buy a vx220/elise

I you want truly epic feel, something that is a challenge then yes a 996 C2S or 997 C2S is absolutely spot on and will excel on both road and track. The 997 variant has more power and is a far nicer place to be. My C2S is the longest car I've owned, nearly 4 years now, I've also got an E46 M3 car as well which is a track project. To compare the two my 997.1 C2S out the box was doing around 1:25-1:26 lap times, out the box on PS2 tyres. With GT3 ARB's, front arms, aggressive road/track geo and some Supersport tyres, I was down to 1:23 driving smoothly and not at the limit, it was no slouch. My M3 in comparison was around 1:28, but it was setup wrong, now its in the 1:20ish lap time ability at Donnington, so the M3 is now quicker, with slicks it goes even quicker again.

But which do I prefer driving on the road? 911 the feel, communication and just the enjoyment of driving the thing is on another level, don't get me wrong the M3 is huge fun too, it should be its on KW Clubsports, Alcons and weighs 1300kg, but the 911 which its rear engine and immense amounts of rear traction is simply more fun to drive and the grip is unreal even in the wet.

I love the Boxster and Cayman too, but I can jump in a Cayman or Boxster and drive it pretty much flat out, sliding around and though its great fun it just does not seem the same challenge or as engaging as the 911.

A 911 is a tick box in life, do it and you won't be disappointed.

[T25UFO]

I have owned a 911 GTS (manual) for nearly 3 years and an M135i (auto) since March 1st. Most of my recent mileage has been in the M135i; it's comfortable and it's quick, but every time I go back to the 911 it feels even more special. The main difference for me is not the few tenths of a second off acceleration times (talk of measuring 0-100 is just plain daft on any road) but rather the brakes and steering.

I didn't realise just how nice the 911's slim alcantara steering wheel was until I drove the M135i with its horribly fat thing. Of course, the GTS doesn't have the electric steering of later 911 models and the feedback is just in a different class entirely. Both cars stop as good as they go, but once again the feedback through the 911's pedal is far better, and braking is more progressive and easy to modulate.

Of course, that's how it should be given the difference in list price between the two cars; even a secondhand GTS is nearly double the price of a new M135i. But the BMW is still an easy (and enjoyable) car to drive. It does what I want it to do when four doors and four seats are needed. If you have to choose between the two (and you don't need four proper seats) then there is only one winner . . .

[T25UFO]

I have owned a 911 GTS (manual) for nearly 3 years and an M135i (auto) since March 1st. Most of my recent mileage has been in the M135i; it's comfortable and it's quick, but every time I go back to the 911 it feels even more special. The main difference for me is not the few tenths of a second off acceleration times (talk of measuring 0-100 is just plain daft on any road) but rather the brakes and steering.

I didn't realise just how nice the 911's slim alcantara steering wheel was until I drove the M135i with its horribly fat thing. Of course, the GTS doesn't have the electric steering of later 911 models and the feedback is just in a different class entirely. Both cars stop as good as they go, but once again the feedback through the 911's pedal is far better, and braking is more progressive and easy to modulate.

Of course, that's how it should be given the difference in list price between the two cars; even a secondhand GTS is nearly double the price of a new M135i. But the BMW is still an easy (and enjoyable) car to drive. It does what I want it to do when four doors and four seats are needed. If you have to choose between the two (and you don't need four proper seats) then there is only one winner . . .

[Phateuk]

Seems a fair amount of you guys have a 911 and an M135i - looks like I need to work harder!

[Phateuk]

Gibbo205 said:

Phateuk said:

I'm not after the fastest car A to B, I'm after a car that feels special on the road when driven for pleasure (not commuting) and also fairly competent on track (I realise it will always be compromised due to being a road car).

The M135i does everything so well I'm concerned I'll miss the all round capability. As a road car I don't think I'd want for any more, on track you do notice it lacking above 100-110+ and as mentioned you look down and you're going slower than you realise - the acceleration really drops off over 120.

Maybe I should leave the porsche for now and keep the 135i for daily use and buy a vx220/elise

I you want truly epic feel, something that is a challenge then yes a 996 C2S or 997 C2S is absolutely spot on and will excel on both road and track. The 997 variant has more power and is a far nicer place to be. My C2S is the longest car I've owned, nearly 4 years now, I've also got an E46 M3 car as well which is a track project. To compare the two my 997.1 C2S out the box was doing around 1:25-1:26 lap times, out the box on PS2 tyres. With GT3 ARB's, front arms, aggressive road/track geo and some Supersport tyres, I was down to 1:23 driving smoothly and not at the limit, it was no slouch. My M3 in comparison was around 1:28, but it was setup wrong, now its in the 1:20ish lap time ability at Donnington, so the M3 is now quicker, with slicks it goes even quicker again.

But which do I prefer driving on the road? 911 the feel, communication and just the enjoyment of driving the thing is on another level, don't get me wrong the M3 is huge fun too, it should be its on KW Clubsports, Alcons and weighs 1300kg, but the 911 which its rear engine and immense amounts of rear traction is simply more fun to drive and the grip is unreal even in the wet.

I love the Boxster and Cayman too, but I can jump in a Cayman or Boxster and drive it pretty much flat out, sliding around and though its great fun it just does not seem the same challenge or as engaging as the 911.

A 911 is a tick box in life, do it and you won't be disappointed.

I am really swayed towards the RWD models like you point out. It's interesting about lap times in your 997 and E46, I was at donington in mine last month, was my first time there and managed a 1:31 (although I'm no race-driver, I'm sure the car could be taken round several seconds faster in the right hands ).

The real drawback of the track performance in the 135i is the brakes - it just doesn't give any confidence after a couple of laps, plus the dropoff in acceleration above 100. As it's not going to be a keeper I'm a little reluctant to sink any money into upgrades.

How would a 996/7 c2 perform on track running standard hardware, maybe with upgraded brake fluid and pads?

Edited by Phateuk on Thursday 24th July 08:42

[Arenki]

@OP - regardless of what you choose, a 911 will feel more special than a 135. only driven one briefly and they're fun, but not as amazing as everyone makes them out to be (IMO).

I'd say save a little longer and get a 996 turbo. The pace outstrips but 996/997 carreras and the Metzger is vastly superior to the M96/m97 reliability wise. Definately get any potential purchase inspected thorough, carrera engine problems are well documented. On the flipside, 74k on my 997C4S and nothing has exploded.

EDIT: my grammar is terribad.

[T25UFO]

997 would be brilliant on standard hardware - PCCB even better but the normal brakes outperform every other car in the price bracket. Oh, and don't get obsessed with lap times - there will always be someone quicker - just enjoy the poise and the balance as you link up the corners.