Autocar : 458S v 650S vs 991 GT3 (non R S ;) )
Discussion
my 2ps worth. I currently own a 996 rs and a scud and ran a 997.1 gt3 as a daily drive for 2 years. I genuinely don't think one is better than the other. Yes you have to work harder in the gt3 to get it right, but when you do it's one of the best feelings you'll get in any car. The scud is spine tingling in its delivery and it's so precise but doesn't require the same amount of driver talent to unlock it. In all honesty the scud would destroy both the 997 gt3 and 996 rs on track but I think the gt3 driver would have a bigger grin on his face as it requires so much input to get the best out of the car.
Carl_Docklands said:
It's more like being a Man Utd fan, looking at Real Madrid and saying 'how can we improve?'
I remember a time when it was tough to write negative things about Porsche sports cars. Someone needs to say something, might as well be a petrol head and someone who owns and tracks his own p car.
You don't get discussion of change without speaking up.
Ferrari are coming out tops and we don't want to see that, do we?
Fair comment about the football analogy, however if Ferrari had listened to D, they'd still be offering a manual I remember a time when it was tough to write negative things about Porsche sports cars. Someone needs to say something, might as well be a petrol head and someone who owns and tracks his own p car.
You don't get discussion of change without speaking up.
Ferrari are coming out tops and we don't want to see that, do we?
Don't agree with you Ferrari coming out on top,they operate at different price points. It's flattering that Porsche can produce a car that competes at half the price of a 458S.
Ravi355 said:
my 2ps worth. I currently own a 996 rs and a scud and ran a 997.1 gt3 as a daily drive for 2 years. I genuinely don't think one is better than the other. Yes you have to work harder in the gt3 to get it right, but when you do it's one of the best feelings you'll get in any car. The scud is spine tingling in its delivery and it's so precise but doesn't require the same amount of driver talent to unlock it. In all honesty the scud would destroy both the 997 gt3 and 996 rs on track but I think the gt3 driver would have a bigger grin on his face as it requires so much input to get the best out of the car.
6RS is king and we know it 
Ravi355 said:
keep it lit said:
6RS is king and we know it
Yup there good but broaden your horizons and drive some f cars. You'll be very pleasantly surprised. I come from an F car family inc many factory Modena collections.. many recent years in race conditions have shown me the truth
Slickhillsy said:
keep it lit said:
Carl_Docklands said:
Close but no cigars for the scud from the major mags. That's a whole new topic
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=vjYAajb1p8cAre you seriously saying a 997 GT3 (RS or otherwise) would perform better than a Scud?? I've owned both back to back, where as the GT3 is brilliant and I loved it the Scud just operates at another level - across the board... First car I would class as 'bike quick' with handling to match...
http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/News/newsresults...
Ravi355 said:
my 2ps worth. I currently own a 996 rs and a scud and ran a 997.1 gt3 as a daily drive for 2 years. I genuinely don't think one is better than the other. Yes you have to work harder in the gt3 to get it right, but when you do it's one of the best feelings you'll get in any car. The scud is spine tingling in its delivery and it's so precise but doesn't require the same amount of driver talent to unlock it. In all honesty the scud would destroy both the 997 gt3 and 996 rs on track but I think the gt3 driver would have a bigger grin on his face as it requires so much input to get the best out of the car.
Think you may be on to something here... 
. TBH. I'm still getting my head in to the whole paddle shift thing having loved the manual GT3 interaction... But as a tool, the Scud is shocking good...
Slickhillsy said:
Hmmmm... Evo must have their numbers wrong here then... Apparently quicker than an Enzo's (knew that anyway) and at least 1.5 sec a lap quicker than both CGT and 997 GT2...
That to me is a big fat Cuban rolled on the thighs of smoking hot virgins!
http://www.evo.co.uk/trackdays/trackdaycars/234178...
Evo do have their numbers wrong then as i am sure in the group test with the enzo/cgt/flemke's F1 the cgt at least was near the west circuit lap record and definitely not 1.5s off the scuderia.That to me is a big fat Cuban rolled on the thighs of smoking hot virgins!
http://www.evo.co.uk/trackdays/trackdaycars/234178...
And yes i do actually think in the hands of a very good driver the 3.8 RS would definitely be at minimum competitive with the scuderia. For the average driver (or below average like myself!) though the scud would definitely be the faster car.
Edit evo link added, odd in the scud article the cgt times were so different!
http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/cargrouptests/2047...
Edited by isaldiri on Sunday 26th October 18:58
isaldiri said:
Slickhillsy said:
Hmmmm... Evo must have their numbers wrong here then... Apparently quicker than an Enzo's (knew that anyway) and at least 1.5 sec a lap quicker than both CGT and 997 GT2...
That to me is a big fat Cuban rolled on the thighs of smoking hot virgins!
http://www.evo.co.uk/trackdays/trackdaycars/234178...
Evo do have their numbers wrong then as i am sure in the group test with the enzo/cgt/flemke's F1 the cgt at least was near the west circuit lap record and definitely not 1.5s off the scuderia.That to me is a big fat Cuban rolled on the thighs of smoking hot virgins!
http://www.evo.co.uk/trackdays/trackdaycars/234178...
And yes i do actually think in the hands of a very good driver the 3.8 RS would definitely be at minimum competitive with the scuderia. For the average driver (or below average like myself!) though the scud would definitely be the faster car.
Edit evo link added, odd in the scud article the cgt times were so different!
http://www.evo.co.uk/carreviews/cargrouptests/2047...
Edited by isaldiri on Sunday 26th October 18:58
If you can show me something where the 3.8RS beats an Enzo then I'll doff my cap sir...
Slickhillsy said:
Scud isn't even in the article...? Also (I mentioned something earlier about monkey in one and driver in another) this isn't as scientific (if these things ever are) as a range of drivers were used so consistency is missing...
If you can show me something where the 3.8RS beats an Enzo then I'll doff my cap sir...
Not the enzo but in the sportauto supertest (same driver) the 3.8 rs proved faster than the scuderia both around the ring and hockenheim if i remember correctly.If you can show me something where the 3.8RS beats an Enzo then I'll doff my cap sir...
Not that all this laptime guff matters anyway, the scuderia is a car i really like (a good bit more than the 458) to be honest but i just don't agree that it necesarily blows the 3.8rs away as you suggested both in absolute performance or general enjoyment purely as a drivers car.
For me, finding the limits of any of these cars is frankly beyond my ability as a driver, so it ends up being as much personal preference as anything else. I have a 991RS coning hopefully, and have another one, plus others in the past. However, having driven them to the safe limits of my own ability I have also seen how they can be driven by a professional driver, in one case by a DTM driver and another by Sabine. Whole different world...
I personally love the 458S, but in all honesty its just a bit out of my comfort zone price wise. For this who want to spend the money, I suspect it is an amazing car. The 650 seems to be a sort of generic,anonymous car styling-wise, without much external sense of brand identity. So, price no object I would be seriously tempted by the Ferrari.
I personally love the 458S, but in all honesty its just a bit out of my comfort zone price wise. For this who want to spend the money, I suspect it is an amazing car. The 650 seems to be a sort of generic,anonymous car styling-wise, without much external sense of brand identity. So, price no object I would be seriously tempted by the Ferrari.
mrdemon said:
it's gets better every model but never really excels in that dept, trail braking just slows you down and you should not need to have to do it.
Porsche know this and have made sure the car can corner better with real wheel steering and that seems to make the car.
I am not knocking the product it's 100k cheaper and knocks out amazing times, but the 458S spanks it.
No it's 1.2s faster on a 1:20 lap.Porsche know this and have made sure the car can corner better with real wheel steering and that seems to make the car.
I am not knocking the product it's 100k cheaper and knocks out amazing times, but the 458S spanks it.
I've had Pirelli Corsa, Michelin SuperSports and Michelin cups on my 911 and the Corsas at Donnington improved my lap times by nearly 2s over the SuperSports.
I'd be willing to bet if the 911 was on cup 2's or Corsas it would match if not beat the Ferrari, I must also comment that adding the stickier tyre also dialled out the understeer on my 911 too.
The above is based on if the 911 was truly only on MPSS when the other two cars were running semi slicks. But I will agree the 458 is a lot more special, to me the new GT3 is just numbers, the highlight of GT3's was the 4.0 RS and I'd take a 997 GT3 personally myself just more special than the new 991 even though the 991 is amazing.
But for these test why don't they try a 991 turbo S on cup 2's ok it won't be as fun as the GT3 but would it be faster?
Edited by Gibbo205 on Thursday 30th October 21:49
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