996 targa V's coupe

996 targa V's coupe

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m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Friday 31st October 2014
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I've somehow talked myself up from a 986 Boxster 3.2S to 911 money and found a car I like the look of. However it's a targa. Looks wise I like them, but how do they drive with a big hole in the roof? Is it something I'm going to notice back to back with a coupe (something that will never happen) and perhaps more importantly does the the roof have a tendency to leak and/or make annoying noises?

I think if I put my sensible hat on Id either not spend this much and go back to 986s (surely they must be less rigid than a 996 targa?) or buy a Cayman S. But the 996 just has some added allure I can't put my finger on.

Edited by m444ttb on Friday 31st October 23:08

Zoin

128 posts

139 months

Saturday 1st November 2014
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I've had my 996 Targa for two and a half years now and wouldn't swap it for a coupe. As Paddy says, the rear hatch adds greatly to practicality and the feeling of airiness you get from the glass roof is wonderful.

It's not without problems though. I bought with my eyes wide shut so the blind doesn't retract neatly. Northway quoted me £300-£400 to fix that (I can't remember the exact amount) and £1500 to replace the roof cables, to fix the slow, squeaky retraction. I do occasionally get squeaks, normally fixed by retracting the roof an inch and then closing it again.
I also had a water leak last year, which Northway fixed by stripping and cleaning for a relatively small outlay.
Bottom line, I bought a car with a slightly dodgy roof and need to spend a bit to get it back to factory-fresh operation again.

There is excessive wind noise roof down at speed. Not a problem when you're on a blast but it does mean you won't want the roof down when cruising comfortably or wanting to talk to a passenger. In such circumstances, you keep the roof closed but still benefit from the feeling of airiness in the cabin.

At lower speeds, opening the roof really allows you to hear the glorious exhaust note. Get a car with sports exhaust or Gundo hack (cheap, effective option) for maximum effect.

Handling-wise, I think most drivers would struggle to tell the difference. I've had it on track (PEC) and it felt taut and responsive. If you're serious enough to need cup tyres and track pads, with driving ability to match, you might notice a difference but for fast road use and occasional track days, I'd doubt it.

As long as you check any prospective purchase properly for leaks and squeaks, and smooth operation of roof and blind, I think it's a much better option than the coupe.

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Saturday 1st November 2014
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Thanks both. That's really very helpful. It will replace an aeroscreen Westfield as my weekend car (only one I actually take out for a drive!) so no 911 is going to feel that sharp in comparison.

The dealer is going to send me the full list of options next week. I don't think it has the sports exhaust but we shall see. Any other must have options? I quite fancy cruise control, which I don't think it has either!

ArcticGT3

977 posts

211 months

Saturday 1st November 2014
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Cruise is easy to add to non cable cars

Zoin

128 posts

139 months

Saturday 1st November 2014
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m444ttb said:
I don't think it has the sports exhaust but we shall see.
Sports exhaust is downright essential, especially for a weekend toy. But Gundo hack is cheap and effective (my car has it, done by previous owner). On other threads, I've seen quotes ranging from £40 to £250, depending on the state of the exhaust.

Zoin

128 posts

139 months

Saturday 1st November 2014
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m444ttb said:
Any other must have options?
I'd also recommend a short-shifter. Doesn't make the gearchange any faster but the standard gearchange is long of throw and a bit vague-feeling. <£20 from ebay, plus fitting (DIY or an hour's labour at a workshop). Just be careful since most of the ebay ones are for lhd so you have to take it apart and flip it over. Otherwise it ends up leaning to the left, which is annoying.

Also, find a good local specialist for all work. I found out the hard way that, even for simple jobs, backstreet garages are a false economy since their lack of model-specific knowledge means they take longer to do simple jobs, thus offsetting their lower hourly rate, and sometimes they miss something that a specialist will know about.

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Saturday 1st November 2014
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ArcticGT3 said:
Cruise is easy to add to non cable cars
What's involved? A friend performed a retrofit on his Audi TT job and that was quite literally a case of plugging in a new stalk and switching the function on in the ecu.

The exhaust modification sounds good. From the limited reading I've done it sounds like the car doesn't change much on a part throttle cruise, which is exactly what you want. Has anyone had a DB reading at a track day?

The car I'm looking at seems to have plenty of audio-type options but a fairly recent figment of a new M030 suspension kit. Is that worth having?

MrC986

3,481 posts

190 months

Sunday 2nd November 2014
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m444ttb said:
What's involved? A friend performed a retrofit on his Audi TT job and that was quite literally a case of plugging in a new stalk and switching the function on in the ecu.

The exhaust modification sounds good. From the limited reading I've done it sounds like the car doesn't change much on a part throttle cruise, which is exactly what you want. Has anyone had a DB reading at a track day?

The car I'm looking at seems to have plenty of audio-type options but a fairly recent figment of a new M030 suspension kit. Is that worth having?
if it's recently had an M030 kit fitted, it's hopefully had a full suspension refresh which makes a massive difference when these cars are now 10+ yrs old - it's a sign possibly of a diligent owner & the kit does apparently make a difference (an OEM kit fitted will be well over £1k before suspension bushes et ). A friend has a 996 targa & it's a great car with nice character (I've had 2x 996 coupes) & being able to have open top motoring without the buffeting/wind noise you can get with a cabrio.

My friend has also had a Carnewal exhaust upgrade which makes it sound more like an air cooled 911 though not overly intrusive & which would probably pass a track day noise test without too much difficulty - on mine I had the bypass hack & because I'm slightly bonkers I then had a Fabspeed muffler bypass system (if you really don't like your neighbours this is the way to go!) Exhausts on 996s are susceptible to rotting on the seams of the boxes after a few years if they are driven all year round so have a good look underneath!

As has been said there are some good examples in the market though look at a few first before buying & try & buy from a hood indie or specialist sports car agent as they need more than just an oil service as part of the . ...my friend bought the 3rd he looked at (I put him off the first 2 having looked at them & the history, or lack of, that didn't give the reassurance of a series of enthusiastic owners).


m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Sunday 2nd November 2014
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Paddy_N_Murphy said:
Just a thought - and reading about all of the Audio works - it doesn't sound very 'stock' ?
How is the service history ? And by whom ?

Have the 'fatal' Seals and / or bearings been done ?
(You've read up on the doomsayers and the explodiveness of the water cooled engines ??)
It has had a rebuild 20k miles / 3 years ago with new modified IMS bearing with uprated spindle apparently. Included in that we're a new alternator and clutch.

The suspension work seems very thorough with the M030 kit fitted along with drop links, mounts, coffin arms & geometry done. Also had brake discs and pads, check over + lubrication of the roof, new mats from Porsche (£65 to fit lol), a coilpack heat shield and sorting some issue with the PCM (not 100% sure what that is). This was all done at RPM.

MrC986

3,481 posts

190 months

Sunday 2nd November 2014
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^ it seems like the car has had a load of money spent on it at a respected indie to update many important parts....I'd say given the time of year, that if it doesn't sell within the next few weeks, whoever is selling it might have it until the Spring unless they get lucky? it might be worthy a slightly cheeky offer if it drives well wink

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Sunday 2nd November 2014
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Well it's advertised at c£16k while at car in the same colour with 15k less on the clock is up at c£14.5k. That car has had a new clutch in the last 12 miles but that's all I know. If that is the difference the higher mileage car is possibly worth the extra given all the work carried out. Worth using to help my position though.

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Thursday 6th November 2014
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Going to see a car Sunday having spent the last week debating whether I care that it'll be a bit heavier, a little less rigid and have another expensive component to go wrong vs a coupe. Tons of work undertaken on it that all says enthusiast owner so expecting good things. I'll probably have www.porscheinspections.com go over it too if I like it.

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Sunday 9th November 2014
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I went to view the car today and it seemed very nice. Mileage is just over 102k and lots of work done in the last 70k all supported by receipts and service stamps from RPM plus the Hartech rebuild with the previous owner. The only reason I've not put a deposit down is I wanted to check opinions here as having not seen any other cars I'm not sure if 'they all do that' or it need some attention.

1. Clutch seems pretty heavy to me but I was driving my wife's Focus ST before it and that clutch is very light. There is a receipt for a (non-genuine I think) clutch in the last few years.

2. The targa roof seemed quite slow to me. Partixularly as it came back up and got level with my head. RPM had lubricated it recently though. The roof was quite noisy on Bedford's crappy roads, but I was expecting this from posts on here.

3. Gear stick: this seemed quite loose (not sure if that's the right word), as in there wasn't much resistance, when in neutral. Gear change was nice though.

4. The exhaust (inc. clamps) had been flagged as rusty by RPM. Doesn't mean it will let me down come MoT time but I'm guessing a replacement will be expensive when it's due.

Otherwise the only things worth mentioning are knackered engine cover has struts, a slightly creaky clutch pedal (pedal bushes I presume) and the interior reflects the mileage so a little wear on the drivers seat.

One final thing - should any of the switches for the roof or windows be one touch? None of them were in either direction.

Edited by m444ttb on Sunday 9th November 15:20

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Sunday 9th November 2014
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This is the local Carrera4 I'm going to enquire about, despite not liking the aerokit:
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2014...

I'm also going to look at this although it's toppy budget wise:
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2014...

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Sunday 9th November 2014
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This was definitely a heavy clutch Id say. This aside the clutch it felt nice to drive. The engine felt very healthy to me, although I've not experienced a 911 from the drivers seat before.

The roof noise, which sounded like it was from the rear, was a creaking. It was at it's worst when the road was potholed and awful (which was quite a lot!).

This is the car btw:
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/2014...


Edited by m444ttb on Sunday 9th November 19:07

Pilch23

1 posts

113 months

Sunday 9th November 2014
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Hi

I own a 2002 Targa with 71k and full history and I love it....but like others have said they are marmite but was most practical for me, easy access for storage/shopping with open top driving in the summer months. Puts a smile on my face every time I drive it smile

Both blind and roof are not one touch, only the windows are.

Bad roads will cause creaking and squeaking but rubber lube and some well placed tape will reduce significantly.

Clutch and gear stick I must say I have never overly noticed and obviously car specific.

If interested, I maybe moving on to a 997 C2S

Good luck with your purchase.

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Sunday 9th November 2014
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While I wasn't looking for a targa I do like them. I could live with a bit of noise for the added benefit of the rear hatch. The one concern is a major issue with the roof. Although if it's just the motor I see they are 'only' c£350 so it may not be too bad if it's a DIYable job. Preference is still a coupe though.

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Sunday 9th November 2014
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Im Swindon so Newbury and Reading aren't far. Here's the receipts the dealer sent over for the targa (he left off RPM's advisories):












MattB

EDIT: Sorry these haven't come out overly readable due to the resizing etc. the original was an emailed PDF on my phone.

Edited by m444ttb on Sunday 9th November 21:18

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Monday 10th November 2014
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I've been to see a 52-plate Carrera4 with aerokit today. The car was taken in part-ex on a 997 having been previously sold by this garage to the same customer. Originally supplied by Dick Lovett Porsche Swindon and exclusively services there it seems pretty decent. The clutch was heavy but nowhere near the targa from yesterday. The car hadn't yet been prepped for sale and needed a few bits sorting:
- Stereo (awful tape head unit) was away being fixed
- N/S wing mirror wasn't fully mobile. Not sure they had spotted this
- Bodywork had clearly been regularly washed by a car wash as it ws very very swirl marked. Front end had also taken a proper stone peppering with one chip having a tiny spot of rust in on the wing.
- Tyres are all being replaced

Compared to the targa, which has clearly seen a machine mop and probably paint, it didn't look so hot from the outside but inside it was much nicer. Perhaps the difference of 12k miles or perhaps the previous lady owner of the targa simply didn't treat it that well! The dark blue did look great (despite the swirls) when the sun came out briefly. Almost purple. I even liked the aerokit rear spoiler more in the metal.

Options wise it lacked the heated seats Id like but did have the switchable sports exhaust. No cruise like most in my price range but sounds an easy retrofit. I'd like rear parking sensors also, which it also doesn't have. Oddly the original owner had specced some of the carbon interior options instead of the better cd head unit.

The only other thing missing for was all the paperwork, which was being kept at the business owners house. If I want to give a little more notice he'll bring it. Then we can see what work has been done. I'm not going to pay £15k for something missing options I want, needing a bodywork tidy up, and not showing any IMS beating work or suspension components replaced.

m444ttb

Original Poster:

3,160 posts

228 months

Monday 10th November 2014
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You'd think so but I'm struggling at the moment. Need to view the local car again to see what I missed, how the paperwork stacks up and what sort of deal could be done.