RE: TVR to offer carbon construction
Sunday 24th January 2016
Given it's now 2016, that means the new TVR sports car should be only two years away. In the latest preview of the much anticipated sports car, TVR has said it will offer a carbon fibre chassis.
The official line is that "TVR will produce an exciting Launch Edition model with a carbon fibre chassis and offer it as a cost-effective option for subsequent orders", which bodes well for rigidity, weight and handling. The flexibility between the carbon and regular composite construction is made possible by Gordon Murray's iStream manufacturing process, now expanded to iStream Carbon. TVR has said it allows "a revolutionary standalone tub and shell made from carbon fibre composite at a fraction of the cost that other methods allow." Sounds like quite the engineering feat if it can be pulled off.
TVR to offer carbon construction
Carbon chassis option confirmed in the latest preview of its new sports car
Following our news that 250 orders had been received last year, there are currently said to be more than 300 orders. There are just a few build slots for the Launch Edition remaining, so get in there fast if you're interested.
Naturally Gordon Murray is optimistic about the expansion of his iStream process, remarking on how the high volume but affordable carbon "sets new standards in the automotive industry for chassis lightweighting, rigidity and safety". It will certainly help towards the 1,100kg target weight.
Finally, expect to see how the new TVR looks sometime in 2016. Les Edgar has said that it will be unveiled at a public event "in the coming months". Hopefully some exciting times ahead for TVR then!
Discussion
As for names, I was wondering whether there's a Greek creature or God of new birth...
Obviously PHOENIX is too obvious.
Closest I could find is: EILEITHYIA / ILITHYIA (goddess of childbirth and labour pains), which I think sounds rather good.
But given it's historically male dominated purchasers, maybe PRIAPUS is more relevant (Greek god of fertility, gardens and male genitalia).
Probably not SIREN - mermaid like women whose irresistible song lured sailors to their deaths.
Or if we don't stick to the Greeks how about a Roman God, JANUS, the Roman god of the crossroads. Obviously would be great if the car was huge...
I know, slow day at work...
Obviously PHOENIX is too obvious.
Closest I could find is: EILEITHYIA / ILITHYIA (goddess of childbirth and labour pains), which I think sounds rather good.
But given it's historically male dominated purchasers, maybe PRIAPUS is more relevant (Greek god of fertility, gardens and male genitalia).
Probably not SIREN - mermaid like women whose irresistible song lured sailors to their deaths.
Or if we don't stick to the Greeks how about a Roman God, JANUS, the Roman god of the crossroads. Obviously would be great if the car was huge...
I know, slow day at work...
This article reads a bit differently to the one in Autocar: http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/new-cars/new-tvr...
"The system, which is an evolution of Murray's earlier iStream process, features carbonfibre panels bonded to a tubular steel frame."
"The standard car will still be constructed using the iStream process, but will feature glass-reinforced plastic panels."
As I read it, both versions will be steel tubular construction, one with bonded glass fibre panels, the other with bonded carbon fibre panels.
"The system, which is an evolution of Murray's earlier iStream process, features carbonfibre panels bonded to a tubular steel frame."
"The standard car will still be constructed using the iStream process, but will feature glass-reinforced plastic panels."
As I read it, both versions will be steel tubular construction, one with bonded glass fibre panels, the other with bonded carbon fibre panels.
er, i don't think 300 orders really counts as "high volume"........
BMW spent 100's of millions on the i3 / i8 high volume carbon tech, i don't really see TVR challenging that tbh...
It also seems that in every press release they promise more amazing stuff, but i suspect, that people don't actually want all this "amazing" stuff. What people want, (i think) is a fantastic looking, brilliant to drive, and reasonably civilised sports car. The (little) money they have needs to be spent on getting the basics right (see Zenos for details ;-) ) not chasing a ridiculous and un-necessary specification........
BMW spent 100's of millions on the i3 / i8 high volume carbon tech, i don't really see TVR challenging that tbh...
It also seems that in every press release they promise more amazing stuff, but i suspect, that people don't actually want all this "amazing" stuff. What people want, (i think) is a fantastic looking, brilliant to drive, and reasonably civilised sports car. The (little) money they have needs to be spent on getting the basics right (see Zenos for details ;-) ) not chasing a ridiculous and un-necessary specification........
Although I am a fan of Gordon Murray I can't help thinking the I stream system is nothing more than what kit car manufacturers have done for years am I missing something ? No doubt his designs will be able to pass crash tests but making steel frames and bonding body panels is hardly hi tech now if he was printing cars I,d think yes you are doing something very different but how has he managed to kid major car manufacturers that this is a new technology ? .
This new TVR is taking a long time to surface. As a veteran of the Peter Wheeler era, carbon fibre bodies are all very well, but smack of a way to ramp up the price. Stick to the basics Mr Edgar - an elegant beast with an outrageous power to weight ratio, an uncompromising attitude in set-up to 'poseur' drivers, who's mindset quite often ends up with their TVR in a salvage yard, and just enough creature comforts on offer to escape the label of Caterham-type austerity.
Edited by MCR on Thursday 21st January 23:38
Edited by MCR on Thursday 21st January 23:39
MCR said:
This new TVR is taking a long time to surface.
It's only been 6 months since GMD and TVR partnership was announced. MCR said:
As a veteran of the Peter Wheeler era, carbon fibre bodies are all very well, but smack of a way to ramp up the price.
Think more classical steel tube with basic composite infill panels.http://www.gordonmurraydesign.com/news-articles/go...
delta0 said:
I hope they have done their research as steel suffers horrendous corrosion when in contact with carbon fibre.
Ah, that scaremongering old chestnut once again.Here's a pic of some steel bobbins and brackets that had spent a dozen years bonded directly to carbon fibre on one side, and exposed to the environment on the other:
Ekona said:
£200K launch cost confirmed :P
^^ Precisely this.It will leave Noble and TVR scrabbling to find punters with huge amounts of cash to splash on "specials" while you can hop in a fully engineered McLaren from about £125k. In both cases punters can be sure that after-sales servicing will be .....
Equus said:
Ah, that scaremongering old chestnut once again.
Here's a pic of some steel bobbins and brackets that had spent a dozen years bonded directly to carbon fibre on one side, and exposed to the environment on the other:
It is far from an "old chestnut". Galvanic corrosion of steel in contact with CF is a huge issue.Here's a pic of some steel bobbins and brackets that had spent a dozen years bonded directly to carbon fibre on one side, and exposed to the environment on the other:
delta0 said:
It is far from an "old chestnut". Galvanic corrosion of steel in contact with CF is a huge issue.
It's an issue to be aware of - not a 'huge' one (as the above photo shows) - and easily dealt with.To quote from the Gordon Murray Design's own website, "the tubes used in the iFrame are coated internally and externally with an organic autophoretic material to provide exceptional corrosion resistance". The composite panels are then bonded on using structural adhesive. Any form of corrosion-resistant paint or coating, OR the structural adhesive on its own would isolate the CF from the steel frame sufficiently to prevent any galvanic corrosion.
I think you can probably rely on Gordon Murray and his team to have the necessary experience.
Edited by Equus on Friday 22 January 12:41
The issues,
1. You can build a cheap car...
2. ...but most major world markets won't let you sell it.
3. And without access to global customers you can't sell enough cars....
4. ... which means the car must be properly engineered and crash tested for global markets.
5. Which means the car is expensive to design and build.
6. But at that level of cost the car has to be expensive to cover the costs...
7. ... unless it can sell at high volumes
8. But it's a specialist car intended to sell on its special qualities at low volumes
9. So the car has to be very expensive
10. Otherwise the company can never generate enough income to cover its costs.
This conundrum has been a huge issue for every sportscar builder.
1. You can build a cheap car...
2. ...but most major world markets won't let you sell it.
3. And without access to global customers you can't sell enough cars....
4. ... which means the car must be properly engineered and crash tested for global markets.
5. Which means the car is expensive to design and build.
6. But at that level of cost the car has to be expensive to cover the costs...
7. ... unless it can sell at high volumes
8. But it's a specialist car intended to sell on its special qualities at low volumes
9. So the car has to be very expensive
10. Otherwise the company can never generate enough income to cover its costs.
This conundrum has been a huge issue for every sportscar builder.
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