Alternatives To The 991 Turbo S??
Discussion
I'd say the genuine options against a Turbo S are pretty limited, especially when you factor in the rear seat situation.
Probably repeating some options but:
Bentley Continental GT Speed. I think the 'speed' edition takes the Continental from way out of the ball-park to at least somewhere within the stadium. Not my cup of tea but in a limited options list it seems to come in budget and is more capable than its 2.2tonnes would suggest.
Maserati Quattroporte GTS - Not sure if you drove this model but the 3.8 twin-turbo 500+bhp, I'd say it would be very capable and slightly more charismatic than the Porsche.
Jaguar F-Type R - Would no doubt be cheaper and with 4wd its got plenty of pace. (If not up to Turbo S levels) Maybe a bit of British charm might swing this left of centre choice.
The only other car in the game I guess is the Nissan and that's already been discounted..
Probably repeating some options but:
Bentley Continental GT Speed. I think the 'speed' edition takes the Continental from way out of the ball-park to at least somewhere within the stadium. Not my cup of tea but in a limited options list it seems to come in budget and is more capable than its 2.2tonnes would suggest.
Maserati Quattroporte GTS - Not sure if you drove this model but the 3.8 twin-turbo 500+bhp, I'd say it would be very capable and slightly more charismatic than the Porsche.
Jaguar F-Type R - Would no doubt be cheaper and with 4wd its got plenty of pace. (If not up to Turbo S levels) Maybe a bit of British charm might swing this left of centre choice.
The only other car in the game I guess is the Nissan and that's already been discounted..
I think you've chosen the best car for your requirements. Unless as others have pointed out, you go for 2 cars. An M6 has similar power but is less dynamic and it's big & heavy. The next gen with 4wd will be interesting.
Pity you can't retrofit rear seats to a GT3.
I like the FF too. If I was offered both, heart would say FF, head would say 991 Turbo S.
Aston Martins and Bentleys don't cut it for track work either.
As several have mentioned before, and you'll know yourself from having an M5 and a GTR; it's difficult to exploit that power without going to jail.
Pity you can't retrofit rear seats to a GT3.
I like the FF too. If I was offered both, heart would say FF, head would say 991 Turbo S.
Aston Martins and Bentleys don't cut it for track work either.
As several have mentioned before, and you'll know yourself from having an M5 and a GTR; it's difficult to exploit that power without going to jail.
hornbaek said:
I have had two Porsche Turbo's (Coupe and Cab) in the past and the only time where they truly came into their stride was on de-restricted Autobahns or Alpine Passes - otherwise they were just too powerfull/fast for the average road driving which made them rather dull in the rev band where you can actually drive them (legally). Except for bragging rights i think that they are surplus to requirement these days so i think the real alternative is a "normal" 991 with some nice extras. Now that the revised 991 is turbo equipped as well you really have to ask yourself what the point of the 991 tt is ?
This is precisely the problem of over powerful turbo sports cars... They aren't sporty feeling ever cuz you never get to floor them or run through the gears. Sure they are fast on the stop watch but fun everyday? Not at allIf you want/need a car that is manic fast, practical and can track, IMO the 911TS has no peer.
Porsche also do a roof rack system for it. I regularly have 3 road bikes on the roof, me and my two teenage sons (5'9"), and all our gear in the "boot" and spare seat. It's not hugely comfortable in the back, but it's doable.
As for comments that it's soulless, just bung it in Sport Plus and use the paddles.
On the flipside it's remarkably comfy and laid back with everything dialed down. Hence it's my daily driver. Its versatility never ceases to amaze me.
Porsche also do a roof rack system for it. I regularly have 3 road bikes on the roof, me and my two teenage sons (5'9"), and all our gear in the "boot" and spare seat. It's not hugely comfortable in the back, but it's doable.
As for comments that it's soulless, just bung it in Sport Plus and use the paddles.
On the flipside it's remarkably comfy and laid back with everything dialed down. Hence it's my daily driver. Its versatility never ceases to amaze me.
As a 7.2RS owner and having spent time with a 991T, there is no denying that these are versatile and practical cars. The Turbo is an on-demand warp zone generator.
You'll be happy. For about a year. Then you'll be bored. You'll be sitting in traffic one day looking at an uninspiring and drab interior that frankly isn't that much different to an entry-level Boxster. You will yearn for something a little more interesting that makes you feel a little more special the 90% of the time you're not driving it flat out.
That's why my money would be on an FF, every-time.
The FF makes you smile standing still in traffic. Can you say the same about the Turbo?
The fact that the head says Turbo, but heart says FF, summaries the choice perfectly.
O.
You'll be happy. For about a year. Then you'll be bored. You'll be sitting in traffic one day looking at an uninspiring and drab interior that frankly isn't that much different to an entry-level Boxster. You will yearn for something a little more interesting that makes you feel a little more special the 90% of the time you're not driving it flat out.
That's why my money would be on an FF, every-time.
The FF makes you smile standing still in traffic. Can you say the same about the Turbo?
The fact that the head says Turbo, but heart says FF, summaries the choice perfectly.
O.
Edited by Oliie on Wednesday 3rd February 08:54
That Ruff looks a legend. First Targa Porsche I've ever seen that I wanted.
I like the Aston idea. This Vanquish is epic
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/a...
The conversation does make me wonder about the 'dream car' idea. I had thought years ago that owning a 911 (1992) was the realisation of all that I would really want in a car, but I didn't own it all that long; somehow what the heart cried for, the head could only justify for a short time. Not unlike that captivating blonde my second year at uni . . . give me a minute here . . .
I think if the Turbo S is the dream there is nothing that will replace it, but many of the suggestions on here may be cars with longer-term value as a mode of travel. I love the FF idea, and the Evora suggestion intrigues.
I like the Aston idea. This Vanquish is epic
http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/a...
The conversation does make me wonder about the 'dream car' idea. I had thought years ago that owning a 911 (1992) was the realisation of all that I would really want in a car, but I didn't own it all that long; somehow what the heart cried for, the head could only justify for a short time. Not unlike that captivating blonde my second year at uni . . . give me a minute here . . .
I think if the Turbo S is the dream there is nothing that will replace it, but many of the suggestions on here may be cars with longer-term value as a mode of travel. I love the FF idea, and the Evora suggestion intrigues.
^^
All of that.
For me the FF or even a masser if it has be newer would take it for the same reasons.
I know the performance difference between the Turbo (S) and the Carrera is vast, but 99.9% of the time, they'll be just the same car. And you've paid 50£k extra for the privilege of sitting in the same car, in the same interior. When you park it, it might as well be either. And you'll see a lot of them on the road. There's loads about already.
There's a reason for that though, in terms of useability/reliability/performance factor it's pretty much unbeaten. It is very, very good at what it does. But so is my fridge.
It's a great car and you'll probably love it. But as a car guy, try to talk about someone's 911 at a petrol station. Most of them have no real interest in cars. That's the way it is, it's a sensible high performance car with a good badge. Now try and do the same with someone driving an FF or a Maserati.
All of that.
For me the FF or even a masser if it has be newer would take it for the same reasons.
I know the performance difference between the Turbo (S) and the Carrera is vast, but 99.9% of the time, they'll be just the same car. And you've paid 50£k extra for the privilege of sitting in the same car, in the same interior. When you park it, it might as well be either. And you'll see a lot of them on the road. There's loads about already.
There's a reason for that though, in terms of useability/reliability/performance factor it's pretty much unbeaten. It is very, very good at what it does. But so is my fridge.
It's a great car and you'll probably love it. But as a car guy, try to talk about someone's 911 at a petrol station. Most of them have no real interest in cars. That's the way it is, it's a sensible high performance car with a good badge. Now try and do the same with someone driving an FF or a Maserati.
ZesPak said:
But as a car guy, try to talk about someone's 911 at a petrol station. Most of them have no real interest in cars. That's the way it is, it's a sensible high performance car with a good badge. Now try and do the same with someone driving an FF or a Maserati.
This is true about many 911 drivers. But it's also true about the drivers of most Ferrari's and Maserati's. They're not car guys. Most recently, I had a longish chat with a Ferrari owner who was extremely reluctant to even consider carbon-ceramic pads in his car on the basis that he'd heard they might squeal... hmmm. On the other hand, the last chat I had with a Turbo owner was about upgrading his intercoolers.
When you mentioned that you'd be getting it 'when your M5 is up for replacement' i'm assuming that means the Turbo S will be on finance?
That's one area that Porsche excel, their finance rates and terms are head and shoulders above the others hence why you see so many.
The Maserati Stradale will feel like a dinosaur compared to the 991.2, in fact there really isn't much around that can compare if you need the rear seats.
The Aston DB11 is launching at Geneva at the end of the month, twin turbo V12, looks that will make every grown man weep. Can imagine it'll be around £150k.
That's one area that Porsche excel, their finance rates and terms are head and shoulders above the others hence why you see so many.
The Maserati Stradale will feel like a dinosaur compared to the 991.2, in fact there really isn't much around that can compare if you need the rear seats.
The Aston DB11 is launching at Geneva at the end of the month, twin turbo V12, looks that will make every grown man weep. Can imagine it'll be around £150k.
Based on your criteria there are 8 answers - 991.1 Turbo, 991.1 Turbo S, 991.2 Turbo & 991.2 Turbo S coupe or convertible. If you want one get one! If you can afford it get a brand new Turbo S (I perfer coupes) - at the weekend I drove the 991.2 Carrera S at the Silverstone Experience Centre, fab car and diffinately an improvement on the 991.1 (the engine is just different and I assume better for daily driving with all the extra torque)
Hi there,
When I think about my dream car I also look for a Swiss army knife type of car like you do and always come to the conclusion the Turbo S must be the one.
I probably would also buy the Turbo S coupe if I was in the same position, but I agree with what a lot of people are saying and that is that the Turbo will probably will loose it's appeal after some time and might even get boring (I hoe I don't go to hell for saying that).
If you don't mind a 2-seater what about a Lambo Huracan / Audi R8 or McLaren 650/570. Those are all pretty serious sportscars with great performance, great build quality and unlimited appeal.
Happy choosings!
When I think about my dream car I also look for a Swiss army knife type of car like you do and always come to the conclusion the Turbo S must be the one.
I probably would also buy the Turbo S coupe if I was in the same position, but I agree with what a lot of people are saying and that is that the Turbo will probably will loose it's appeal after some time and might even get boring (I hoe I don't go to hell for saying that).
If you don't mind a 2-seater what about a Lambo Huracan / Audi R8 or McLaren 650/570. Those are all pretty serious sportscars with great performance, great build quality and unlimited appeal.
Happy choosings!
If you want one car to do everything then there is not another car that does it as well.
Apart from the obvious amazing performance it is so practical.
What other car has a sub 3.0 seconds to 60, a 200 mph top speed and has enough space to get all the stuff you need for a 2 week ski trip into it (including skis), a badge that has a racing history and prestige and costs less than £150K? It comes with so much kit as standard it is very difficult to get it over £150K.
I have a 458 Speciale and we also have a 997.2 TT that gets used for Ski trips and trips we do not want to use the Speciale for and it is brilliant. We will probably replace the 997.1 TT with a 991.2 TTS as there is nothing that does everything as well. But then I am lucky to have the Speciale for the ultimate driving experience. However I would not want that as an only car as it is not really practical for daily use.
R8? Totally impractical, no storage space, no ski rack available and can easily be specced over £150K and slower that the Turbo S.
McLaren? All the above but even more expensive and impractical as an all round daily user.
As regard too fast the biggest issue in the UK is the 45 to 50 mph brigade. Overtaking is the most dangerous activity and I want to be past as quickly as possible. Every extra second on the wrong side of the road you are in danger. With a 50 to 70 time of less than 2 seconds the Turbo S is perfect for this. Your perfect road is no fun driving stuck behind a member of the 45mph brigade braking to less than 30mph for the slightest bend! I once had a Cayman and it was great fun on an empty road but stuck behind another car it was that gutless mid range it could never safely get past. By the time it built up revs to get any semblance of power the overtaking opportunity had gone.
I agree that top speed is irrelevant in the UK but in Germany a 200mph car is far more relaxing to drive in the 120 to 140 band than a car that maxes out at 150.
Apart from the obvious amazing performance it is so practical.
What other car has a sub 3.0 seconds to 60, a 200 mph top speed and has enough space to get all the stuff you need for a 2 week ski trip into it (including skis), a badge that has a racing history and prestige and costs less than £150K? It comes with so much kit as standard it is very difficult to get it over £150K.
I have a 458 Speciale and we also have a 997.2 TT that gets used for Ski trips and trips we do not want to use the Speciale for and it is brilliant. We will probably replace the 997.1 TT with a 991.2 TTS as there is nothing that does everything as well. But then I am lucky to have the Speciale for the ultimate driving experience. However I would not want that as an only car as it is not really practical for daily use.
R8? Totally impractical, no storage space, no ski rack available and can easily be specced over £150K and slower that the Turbo S.
McLaren? All the above but even more expensive and impractical as an all round daily user.
As regard too fast the biggest issue in the UK is the 45 to 50 mph brigade. Overtaking is the most dangerous activity and I want to be past as quickly as possible. Every extra second on the wrong side of the road you are in danger. With a 50 to 70 time of less than 2 seconds the Turbo S is perfect for this. Your perfect road is no fun driving stuck behind a member of the 45mph brigade braking to less than 30mph for the slightest bend! I once had a Cayman and it was great fun on an empty road but stuck behind another car it was that gutless mid range it could never safely get past. By the time it built up revs to get any semblance of power the overtaking opportunity had gone.
I agree that top speed is irrelevant in the UK but in Germany a 200mph car is far more relaxing to drive in the 120 to 140 band than a car that maxes out at 150.
W8PMC said:
MaxA said:
Oh, I forgot the New Mercedes (non Benz) GTS - if sound was your measure of pleasure, then that would be The One. It went quite well around the Dubai 24hrs recently too: the Black Falcon GTS started in 98th, came 2nd. Good effort.
And at the end of the day, perhaps the end of the thread, I'd go with the Turbo. It's just practical enough, it's ridiculously fast, and it's definitely trackable. And I'm a 911 fan, so the debate in my head is between a Turbo and a GT3, where I think the T is the better road car, and the 3 is the one I'd buy.
If it wasn't a case of being mugged off by some speculator for £50k i'd agree with you & would be drawn to the GT3, but even the enthusiast in me isn't stupid enough to pay £150k for a used example of a £100k new car.And at the end of the day, perhaps the end of the thread, I'd go with the Turbo. It's just practical enough, it's ridiculously fast, and it's definitely trackable. And I'm a 911 fan, so the debate in my head is between a Turbo and a GT3, where I think the T is the better road car, and the 3 is the one I'd buy.
Never considered the GTS so good shout & will have a look, however the child in me still feels the Turbo S will top trump the GTS in everything other than sound.
By the way, i've owned 4 911 turbos so please don't think i'm against them. I'm not!!
I'd go Ferrari FF as mentioned early in the posts. £150k for a main dealer car with seats for 4, all wheel drive, rear seat entertainment for the kids, mega noise and wow factor and very likely to depreciate less than the Turbo S.
I'm really enjoying the discussion here, especially those contributing from the 'I already own X car [I won't be affording]'.
To the OP, just buy the Turbo S.
If it were me, I think the imminently sensible comments here have confirmed me as a future 3-car guy: the SO's practical car, my quite a bit faster car, and my track car. Probably go hyper estate like RS6 and Atom, sneak the whole load in there for under £120,000.
To the OP, just buy the Turbo S.
If it were me, I think the imminently sensible comments here have confirmed me as a future 3-car guy: the SO's practical car, my quite a bit faster car, and my track car. Probably go hyper estate like RS6 and Atom, sneak the whole load in there for under £120,000.
Not wanting to derail the thread as been interesting and I'm buying a Turbo S shortly..... cant wait!!
When do you think the depreciation levels off for the Turbo S? Im thinking of buying a 3 year old one for circa £100-110k (new I think its what £145-150k?). Surely if I sold 2 years later it wouldn't carry on dropping?
When do you think the depreciation levels off for the Turbo S? Im thinking of buying a 3 year old one for circa £100-110k (new I think its what £145-150k?). Surely if I sold 2 years later it wouldn't carry on dropping?
Good discussion thread this without much b*llox being spoken too! Now some will no doubt say my post is adding some but here goes.
OP, as you know I've been wrestling with similar thoughts. Like you coming from a well tuned R35 GTR.
The GTR ended up staying in the garage too for some of the reasons people here have said that eventually their Turbo's did - ie not enough times that you can enjoy the balls out performance and commuting is ...well commuting and unlike some that say they'd be happy sitting in an FF - beleive me on the M25 car park you'd be extra p*ssed.
My lad had his Cayman R in the garage, which too stays in there for similar reasons and given he has a company snotter.
So we decided to chop both the GTR and the R in and spec up a new Turbo S which is on order and share it as the Garage car. We can live with the depreciation and make no bones about it we will be using it in a similar fashion to the OP, whenever we fancy taking it out of the garage for an occasion, track, peacock moment, daily blast, 3-4 short distance transporter somewhere special or an event, very rare DD, or general adrenalin fix.
I've bought a DD snotter for the sh*te commute too so won't be using the Porker routinely. We also have access to a Cayman S, but that's for Girls
A .2 Turbo S will destroy an FF on track and in a straight line even well into the 100+. All fezza's (except maybe the Challenge/Scud variants)are really peacock cars. Yes the roar is a nice sound....but get's you kicked off a lot of tracks too!
OP, as you know I've been wrestling with similar thoughts. Like you coming from a well tuned R35 GTR.
The GTR ended up staying in the garage too for some of the reasons people here have said that eventually their Turbo's did - ie not enough times that you can enjoy the balls out performance and commuting is ...well commuting and unlike some that say they'd be happy sitting in an FF - beleive me on the M25 car park you'd be extra p*ssed.
My lad had his Cayman R in the garage, which too stays in there for similar reasons and given he has a company snotter.
So we decided to chop both the GTR and the R in and spec up a new Turbo S which is on order and share it as the Garage car. We can live with the depreciation and make no bones about it we will be using it in a similar fashion to the OP, whenever we fancy taking it out of the garage for an occasion, track, peacock moment, daily blast, 3-4 short distance transporter somewhere special or an event, very rare DD, or general adrenalin fix.
I've bought a DD snotter for the sh*te commute too so won't be using the Porker routinely. We also have access to a Cayman S, but that's for Girls
A .2 Turbo S will destroy an FF on track and in a straight line even well into the 100+. All fezza's (except maybe the Challenge/Scud variants)are really peacock cars. Yes the roar is a nice sound....but get's you kicked off a lot of tracks too!
Edited by OldBob on Wednesday 3rd February 17:40
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