BMW425D or BMW 430D Auto?
Discussion
Hi guys,
I have a dilemma, I plan on upgrading my loved E92 320D for a 425D or a 430D (auto only), here is my question as I haven't driven them yet (want your opinion first), I'm a manual guy, I have driven autos before and as quick as they are on track on a daily basis I find them boring. Should I get a 425d and remap it and get 430d performance (same engine after all) or suck it up and go for 430D (easier to sell and everyone is going auto anyway so better get used to it now)? Can an auto be engaging?
Has anyone driven them both yet and are they very different in terms of performance?
Cheers
I have a dilemma, I plan on upgrading my loved E92 320D for a 425D or a 430D (auto only), here is my question as I haven't driven them yet (want your opinion first), I'm a manual guy, I have driven autos before and as quick as they are on track on a daily basis I find them boring. Should I get a 425d and remap it and get 430d performance (same engine after all) or suck it up and go for 430D (easier to sell and everyone is going auto anyway so better get used to it now)? Can an auto be engaging?
Has anyone driven them both yet and are they very different in terms of performance?
Cheers
For me an Auto can never be engaging but they are excellent at what they do and the ZF8 Auto gearbox does really suit the torque filled nature of a diesel engine well for sure.
If you love a manual gearbox you will always miss it overall but for me a diesel engine suits an Auto gearbox better.
Got a 640d mated to an Auto and its a good combo and also had a 330d that was mated to an Auto and that was a nice combo too.
If you love a manual gearbox you will always miss it overall but for me a diesel engine suits an Auto gearbox better.
Got a 640d mated to an Auto and its a good combo and also had a 330d that was mated to an Auto and that was a nice combo too.
The 425 doesn't have the same engine as the 430. Ones a 4 cylinder, one has the right number of cylinders.
The 430 will be streets ahead regardless of the gearbox but, as said, the 8 speed auto's as good as they get and I wouldn't give a second thought to a manual. Probably not even a first thought.
The 430 will be streets ahead regardless of the gearbox but, as said, the 8 speed auto's as good as they get and I wouldn't give a second thought to a manual. Probably not even a first thought.
I think if you're a keen manual driver you'll struggle to adapt and will miss the sensation and involvement.
That said, if it's only a choice between those 2, I'd go for the faster engine (430) even more so now I've learnt that the other isn't 6 cylinders On the bright side, the ZF8 speed is a good auto.
But to corroborate my first point I went from a manual gearbox in my old E46 to a E92 335i with DCT which I always drove in manual mode and it was good, much better than the ZF8 in manual mode,but after less than 18 months it's being swapped for a manual and I'm very happy about that
Is there not a petrol manual you can have?
That said, if it's only a choice between those 2, I'd go for the faster engine (430) even more so now I've learnt that the other isn't 6 cylinders On the bright side, the ZF8 speed is a good auto.
But to corroborate my first point I went from a manual gearbox in my old E46 to a E92 335i with DCT which I always drove in manual mode and it was good, much better than the ZF8 in manual mode,but after less than 18 months it's being swapped for a manual and I'm very happy about that
Is there not a petrol manual you can have?
Hi Smuler,
I guess I could consider a 335i but I do 12000 miles a year so I prefer a diesel, plus I love the extra torque diesel engines offer. If only an M4 was economical
I guess I could consider a 335i but I do 12000 miles a year so I prefer a diesel, plus I love the extra torque diesel engines offer. If only an M4 was economical
Smuler said:
I think if you're a keen manual driver you'll struggle to adapt and will miss the sensation and involvement.
That said, if it's only a choice between those 2, I'd go for the faster engine (430) even more so now I've learnt that the other isn't 6 cylinders On the bright side, the ZF8 speed is a good auto.
But to corroborate my first point I went from a manual gearbox in my old E46 to a E92 335i with DCT which I always drove in manual mode and it was good, much better than the ZF8 in manual mode,but after less than 18 months it's being swapped for a manual and I'm very happy about that
Is there not a petrol manual you can have?
That said, if it's only a choice between those 2, I'd go for the faster engine (430) even more so now I've learnt that the other isn't 6 cylinders On the bright side, the ZF8 speed is a good auto.
But to corroborate my first point I went from a manual gearbox in my old E46 to a E92 335i with DCT which I always drove in manual mode and it was good, much better than the ZF8 in manual mode,but after less than 18 months it's being swapped for a manual and I'm very happy about that
Is there not a petrol manual you can have?
Lambodrift said:
Hi Smuler,
I guess I could consider a 335i but I do 12000 miles a year so I prefer a diesel, plus I love the extra torque diesel engines offer. If only an M4 was economical
At only 12k miles a year I wouldn't be going anywhere near a diesel to be fair and my money would be on a 335i for sure, because you still get plenty of low end and mid range shove and strong performance but you don't have to put up with the short comings of a noisy and unrewarding diesel engine. I guess I could consider a 335i but I do 12000 miles a year so I prefer a diesel, plus I love the extra torque diesel engines offer. If only an M4 was economical
Diesel engines are very boring and one dimensional to sit behind and just don't offer the reward for me that a petrol engine does because there isn't any depth to them...not to mention that they sound pants.
cerb4.5lee said:
Lambodrift said:
Hi Smuler,
I guess I could consider a 335i but I do 12000 miles a year so I prefer a diesel, plus I love the extra torque diesel engines offer. If only an M4 was economical
At only 12k miles a year I wouldn't be going anywhere near a diesel to be fair and my money would be on a 335i for sure, because you still get plenty of low end and mid range shove and strong performance but you don't have to put up with the short comings of a noisy and unrewarding diesel engine. I guess I could consider a 335i but I do 12000 miles a year so I prefer a diesel, plus I love the extra torque diesel engines offer. If only an M4 was economical
Diesel engines are very boring and one dimensional to sit behind and just don't offer the reward for me that a petrol engine does because there isn't any depth to them...not to mention that they sound pants.
[quote=Wills2]
Indeed Lee, 12k is bks all mileage and no way does it justify the need for a diesel. At that mileage the difference between 25mpg and 35mpg is about a £10 a week.
The 435i does 37.7 combined and the 430d - 52.3 according to auto trader, I don't how much that translates in the wallet but it sounds quite a bit. The 35i has a manual option on the plus side and sounds better etc but the diesel is more torquey. I thought that was a decent amount of mileage to justify a diesel. Decision decisions.
Indeed Lee, 12k is bks all mileage and no way does it justify the need for a diesel. At that mileage the difference between 25mpg and 35mpg is about a £10 a week.
The 435i does 37.7 combined and the 430d - 52.3 according to auto trader, I don't how much that translates in the wallet but it sounds quite a bit. The 35i has a manual option on the plus side and sounds better etc but the diesel is more torquey. I thought that was a decent amount of mileage to justify a diesel. Decision decisions.
Lambodrift said:
Wills2 said:
Indeed Lee, 12k is bks all mileage and no way does it justify the need for a diesel. At that mileage the difference between 25mpg and 35mpg is about a £10 a week.
The 435i does 37.7 combined and the 430d - 52.3 according to auto trader, I don't how much that translates in the wallet but it sounds quite a bit. The 35i has a manual option on the plus side and sounds better etc but the diesel is more torquey. I thought that was a decent amount of mileage to justify a diesel. Decision decisions.
Petrol engine cars in my experience tend to get nearer the official numbers but are still about 20% off in terms of a real world average.
On 12k a year unless you drive down a motorway for 30 miles everyday will be mainly short urban/mixed driving (but only you know your journey profile) so factor that in, plus they are doing great deals on the 340i at the moment £399 a month and £1500 in.
I was doing 18k p/a in my 335i and I really can't see 12k as being diesel mileage at all.
My 335i (so logically 435i too) has the low rev torquey feel if that's what you like.
I don't pay too much heed to to official figures; but on my last two cars I hit 70% of the combined figure, but my journeys are shortish and fast so I guess most can beat that.
But I really think you need to look at the fuel savings of the diesel over petrol.
My 335i was 22.6 p a mile to fuel.
The average low engined (say 1.2 Corsa) hire car my girlfriend had in the same period cost us 10p a mile to fuel
Over 12,000 miles (your mileage) the difference between these radically different cars would be £1512
Do the maths, but logic says to me that the gap (saving) between two comparable fast BMWs (430d and 435i) isn't going to be much, surely??
My 335i (so logically 435i too) has the low rev torquey feel if that's what you like.
I don't pay too much heed to to official figures; but on my last two cars I hit 70% of the combined figure, but my journeys are shortish and fast so I guess most can beat that.
But I really think you need to look at the fuel savings of the diesel over petrol.
My 335i was 22.6 p a mile to fuel.
The average low engined (say 1.2 Corsa) hire car my girlfriend had in the same period cost us 10p a mile to fuel
Over 12,000 miles (your mileage) the difference between these radically different cars would be £1512
Do the maths, but logic says to me that the gap (saving) between two comparable fast BMWs (430d and 435i) isn't going to be much, surely??
Depending on your type of journey the difference could be big or small diesel vs petrol, for example the Alpina D3 has averaged 47.6mpg over the last 5000 miles which is 5mpg off of it's official figures if you take that as an average for the official figures it would be 32.7 vs 48.3mpg over 12k that's £1713.76 vs 1160.24 that's not a small sum of money to put towards running costs.
I know it's a 4 pot petrol but shouldn't we be comparing the 430d to a 430i?
I know it's a 4 pot petrol but shouldn't we be comparing the 430d to a 430i?
ZX10R NIN said:
Depending on your type of journey the difference could be big or small diesel vs petrol, for example the Alpina D3 has averaged 47.6mpg over the last 5000 miles which is 5mpg off of it's official figures if you take that as an average for the official figures it would be 32.7 vs 48.3mpg over 12k that's £1713.76 vs 1160.24 that's not a small sum of money to put towards running costs.
I know it's a 4 pot petrol but shouldn't we be comparing the 430d to a 430i?
So £10.60 a week for a car that is depreciating at what? I know it's a 4 pot petrol but shouldn't we be comparing the 430d to a 430i?
£6-800 a month? I don't know whether you bought it new or not?
I would say that is a perfect example of why MPG is nothing to do with the choice of petrol vs diesel.
gizlaroc said:
So £10.60 a week for a car that is depreciating at what?
£6-800 a month? I don't know whether you bought it new or not?
I would say that is a perfect example of why MPG is nothing to do with the choice of petrol vs diesel.
It's not depreciating badly compared to a 335D/M3 also they tend to hold their value you better long term (I tend to keep my cars for 5 years or more) than mainstream BMW models (I lost a fair bit on my F80 M3) also my M3 only averaged 28.6mpg £1959.44 over 12k plus the higher running costs for the M3 & the D3 makes a very good case for itself.£6-800 a month? I don't know whether you bought it new or not?
I would say that is a perfect example of why MPG is nothing to do with the choice of petrol vs diesel.
The handling & ride is better than any M Sport F80 not quite as sharp as the M3 when pushing on but for the other 29 days in the Month the Alpina feels more special inside to, I never gelled with the M3 hence the reason for me trying to palm it off to her which she wasn't having any of it she'd have rather kept the C63 due to her longer journeys that wasn't possible & the Alpina ticked the right boxes the fact it was a diesel was a bonus, sound wise it's okay the Akrapovic exhaust helps performance wise there's not a lot in it compared to the M3 but a different league compared to the 335d it's a more complete package, when you compare the price of Alpinas to the regular models there's normally a fair difference in price, as is always the case with these things it'll come down to each individual's circumstances & preferences.
I'm not knocking the Alpina at all, I love them, and it is the only brand that I genuinely want to own that I have not yet, and I did enquire about the F31 D3 that is currently for sale. So I am a fan.
But for someone who wants a manual, I do think the 430i is a far better choice than the 425d when only doing 12k miles a year.
But for someone who wants a manual, I do think the 430i is a far better choice than the 425d when only doing 12k miles a year.
When I was looking at swapping the X3 a few weeks back I considered going back to a 3 series touring again, new X3 is not out for another 12 months and thought it would make a change.
The 340i was only coming in at around £30 a month more than a 320d, bigger discounts, better residuals etc. all help.
I didn't consider the 330i at the time, I had sort of written it off if I am honest. But I was lent one for 2 days (328i actually) a couple of weeks back when BMW did my first MOT and 3 year service plus a couple of warranty issues before the warranty expired and I fell for it big time.
The 340i was only coming in at around £30 a month more than a 320d, bigger discounts, better residuals etc. all help.
I didn't consider the 330i at the time, I had sort of written it off if I am honest. But I was lent one for 2 days (328i actually) a couple of weeks back when BMW did my first MOT and 3 year service plus a couple of warranty issues before the warranty expired and I fell for it big time.
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