How hard / easy to become a Commerical Airline Pilot....
Discussion
Following on from the thread of the 26 year old pilot I'm wondering how difficult would it be to become an employed commercial pilot.
Before anyone says I am dreaming away in the clouds- this is something I genuinely and seriously feel I could do.
Assuming I pass the medical certificate my situation is as follows.
Age- 34
Funds- Have available funding upto £150k without having to take a loan.
Currently in a full time role professional role (finance related) that I would be willing to give up. Currently role already has me travelling every single month over the last 3 years to destinations all over the world.
Location- Greater London.
ETA. Im guessing 34 may be too old to start?
Before anyone says I am dreaming away in the clouds- this is something I genuinely and seriously feel I could do.
Assuming I pass the medical certificate my situation is as follows.
Age- 34
Funds- Have available funding upto £150k without having to take a loan.
Currently in a full time role professional role (finance related) that I would be willing to give up. Currently role already has me travelling every single month over the last 3 years to destinations all over the world.
Location- Greater London.
ETA. Im guessing 34 may be too old to start?
Edited by fizz47 on Wednesday 28th September 11:52
At your age - I'd say pretty close to impossible, without being through a airline training programme.
My cousin financed his lad through commercial licence with training in the USA (he started at age 19) and even after passing all ratings, etc., converting to UK/EU, he couldn't get a job as didn't have enough hours and no airline training background. Spent a number of years as a PPL instructor in UK to build up hours etc., but not a chance of getting an airline slot. Eventually at age 26 he gave up and went into ATC
and flys for fun etc at his local flying club when he can )
I would have thought he could have got a job flying freight maybe, don't know if he tried this option or whether even that was a route with no opening?
My cousin financed his lad through commercial licence with training in the USA (he started at age 19) and even after passing all ratings, etc., converting to UK/EU, he couldn't get a job as didn't have enough hours and no airline training background. Spent a number of years as a PPL instructor in UK to build up hours etc., but not a chance of getting an airline slot. Eventually at age 26 he gave up and went into ATC
and flys for fun etc at his local flying club when he can )I would have thought he could have got a job flying freight maybe, don't know if he tried this option or whether even that was a route with no opening?
aeropilot said:
At your age - I'd say pretty close to impossible, without being through a airline training programme.
My cousin financed his lad through commercial licence with training in the USA (he started at age 19) and even after passing all ratings, etc., converting to UK/EU, he couldn't get a job as didn't have enough hours and no airline training background. Spent a number of years as a PPL instructor in UK to build up hours etc., but not a chance of getting an airline slot. Eventually at age 26 he gave up and went into ATC and flys for fun etc at his local flying club when he can )
I would have thought he could have got a job flying freight maybe, don't know if he tried this option or whether even that was a route with no opening?
I thought the age thing may be too much My cousin financed his lad through commercial licence with training in the USA (he started at age 19) and even after passing all ratings, etc., converting to UK/EU, he couldn't get a job as didn't have enough hours and no airline training background. Spent a number of years as a PPL instructor in UK to build up hours etc., but not a chance of getting an airline slot. Eventually at age 26 he gave up and went into ATC
and flys for fun etc at his local flying club when he can )I would have thought he could have got a job flying freight maybe, don't know if he tried this option or whether even that was a route with no opening?
Oh well - next best thing I suppose is to go down PPL route.
fizz47 said:
I thought the age thing may be too much
Oh well - next best thing I suppose is to go down PPL route.
If you are serious about a career change, you are going to need a lot more determination than getting one reply on a forum and giving up...Oh well - next best thing I suppose is to go down PPL route.
You said commercial pilot.. Do you mean airline or would corporate / business also be an option? I had a career change at your age and have been flying commercially in the business jet sector since (commercial charter & privately for the owners). I absolutely love it.
The airlines have recently been hoovering up a lot of newly qualifieds. Flybe have run out of training capacity to take on the numbers they need. With that said, it wasn't easy to find that first job & you have to expect starting salaries to be terrible whichever route you go down, however it does get better.
BTW - stay off Pprune, its full of bickering / misinformation and some very unhappy people..
There are some university courses in aviation now. The education sector have decided that those who can complete the CPL are worthy of an HND / DipHE
http://www.kingston.ac.uk/undergraduate-course/avi...
could be an option and might offer a better opportunity for a job at the end if the university has links to employers?
http://www.kingston.ac.uk/undergraduate-course/avi...
could be an option and might offer a better opportunity for a job at the end if the university has links to employers?
To answer your question, it's not easy. There are hard bits, but (at the risk of sounding corny), if you really want it you will find a way to overcome the times when you wonder why you ever wanted to embark on this.
34 is most definitely not too late, but you may need to be realistic about your ambitions, coming in to the industry at a relatively late stage.
As mentioned above, a lot of the airlines recruit from the flight schools, who have already been 'sponsored', selected and trained by a third party.
If you are self-funding, then all you will end up with having forked out a lot of money, time and effort, is a commercial pilot's licence. The hard bit, is getting a job, and there are many, many stories of people being sold the dream by flight schools, only to find them on the same heap of aspiring jet jockeys, with a licence, but no experience.
It's all about timing, which unfortunately, you will be unable to predict, due to the fact that the aviation industry ebbs and flows on a regular basis, thus affecting recruitment.
Do your research. Get an idea for the market. Pprune is a terrible website, particularly for wannabes, but it tells it like it is. You'll read stories of success, but also plenty of examples of the other end of the spectrum.
You mention travelling all over the world in your current role, so if long haul is your goal, you can expect a long wait, as generally airlines require a lot of hours (a few thousand at least) in your logbook, before you'll be eligible to get on a heavier aircraft.
34 is most definitely not too late, but you may need to be realistic about your ambitions, coming in to the industry at a relatively late stage.
As mentioned above, a lot of the airlines recruit from the flight schools, who have already been 'sponsored', selected and trained by a third party.
If you are self-funding, then all you will end up with having forked out a lot of money, time and effort, is a commercial pilot's licence. The hard bit, is getting a job, and there are many, many stories of people being sold the dream by flight schools, only to find them on the same heap of aspiring jet jockeys, with a licence, but no experience.
It's all about timing, which unfortunately, you will be unable to predict, due to the fact that the aviation industry ebbs and flows on a regular basis, thus affecting recruitment.
Do your research. Get an idea for the market. Pprune is a terrible website, particularly for wannabes, but it tells it like it is. You'll read stories of success, but also plenty of examples of the other end of the spectrum.
You mention travelling all over the world in your current role, so if long haul is your goal, you can expect a long wait, as generally airlines require a lot of hours (a few thousand at least) in your logbook, before you'll be eligible to get on a heavier aircraft.
fizz47 said:
Following on from the thread of the 26 year old pilot I'm wondering how difficult would it be to become an employed commercial pilot.
Before anyone says I am dreaming away in the clouds- this is something I genuinely and seriously feel I could do.
Assuming I pass the medical certificate my situation is as follows.
Age- 34
Funds- Have available funding upto £150k without having to take a loan.
Currently in a full time role professional role (finance related) that I would be willing to give up. Currently role already has me travelling every single month over the last 3 years to destinations all over the world.
Location- Greater London.
ETA. Im guessing 34 may be too old to start?
I flew with a captain during training who had exactly your background and started at a similar age. I've flown with captains since who have come from IT, radio, and other professions that I don't remember, and changed career in their mid thirties. Anyone who says you've missed the boat is talking nonsense. In my group of trainees there was a 36-year-old guy who did finance IT. He made it work (with a family) and continued his job to some extent on the side during training. Before anyone says I am dreaming away in the clouds- this is something I genuinely and seriously feel I could do.
Assuming I pass the medical certificate my situation is as follows.
Age- 34
Funds- Have available funding upto £150k without having to take a loan.
Currently in a full time role professional role (finance related) that I would be willing to give up. Currently role already has me travelling every single month over the last 3 years to destinations all over the world.
Location- Greater London.
ETA. Im guessing 34 may be too old to start?
It does depend what you want though. If you want to be at the top of BA's long haul command seniority list one day, then yes, you may have left it too late. You will see some realism and cautionary tales on Pprune. You will also see plenty of bitterness, uninformed b
ks, moaning... Don't give a random web opinion any more authority just because it was written on a pilot forum.Good luck.
A few years ago, I had a crack at the BA program, which would effectively pay your fees (c£85k) at the time, and dock it from your wages at £1k a month until you'd paid them back.
I went to the assessment at Oxford, aged 32, and wasn't selected by BA, although I was offered the chance to self-fund, and take a risk on getting a job at the end. I declined this at the time, but wouldn't rule it out in the future.
I have no other useful information to give, but the age shouldn't be a barrier.
I went to the assessment at Oxford, aged 32, and wasn't selected by BA, although I was offered the chance to self-fund, and take a risk on getting a job at the end. I declined this at the time, but wouldn't rule it out in the future.
I have no other useful information to give, but the age shouldn't be a barrier.
Or just move to Russia: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshir...
carreauchompeur said:
Interesting thread, Easyjet seem to be advertising their training program in conjunction with CTC aviation at the moment, thought I might give it a crack... Any experiences here?
First thing is get your medical done. If you pass that - then probably the easiest way into flying would be via CTC who basically provide all the entry level pilots to Easyjet (and others). I know a few that have gone down this route, including some older guys closer to your age. One thing I like about CTC is that they aren't there to take your money regardless (I know one guy that failed the CTC interview).However is this just a general enquiry? How much flying experience do you have to date? Also, are you able to survive on the salary if you do eventually get a seat? People can be shocked at how little the pay is intially unless you get into a major carrier. In the US a FO on a low cost carrier you'd likely be eligible for food-stamps... https://www.glassdoor.com/Hourly-Pay/Spirit-Airlin...
Edited to add - the friend that failed - he did EASA (previously JAA) in Florida, then built up hours back in UK (CabAir), got his multi-rating and the first job for a small UK outfit flying a Saab turboprop. Couple of years later moved to ME and flys for one of the low-cost airlines and is now captain.
Worked out a cheaper route than via CTC for the multi, but a bit longer time-frame. Also I *think with CTC you are bonded for a certain time-frame - (someone will correct me if that's wrong or if it's no longer the case).
Edited by Brother D on Wednesday 28th September 18:30
Edited by Brother D on Wednesday 28th September 18:32
Isnt the issue a bit like XFactor, everyone wants to do it but really there are only a finite amount of Pilots seats despite many being capable like there is only so many singers needed in the country despite a lot of folk that can hold a tune ? it is possible but the odds of a career are pretty low.
louiebaby said:
I went to the assessment at Oxford, aged 32, and wasn't selected by BA, although I was offered the chance to self-fund, and take a risk on getting a job at the end. I declined this at the time, but wouldn't rule it out in the future.
.
Jeeeeeze, that's a shocker... The self funded route offer, were Oxford trying to get you to sign on the fitted line .
We used to employ a girl whose other half had self-funded training up to type certified on 737 and I believe 757 as well, through a desire to fly and an decent inheritance. Third choice of career, having previously done pharmacy and medicine degrees without ever using either of them.
As posted above, he couldn't get a job flying commercial, all the airlines wanted cadets to train or ex-military to convert rather than someone with zero hours but a sheaf of tickets from simulator time, and he ended up at a flying school teaching PPL to keep his flying hours up. Last I heard though he had finally got a job with a budget airline in Spain, but that was several years after qualifying, much of which he spent on zero-hours contract with the flying school.
As posted above, he couldn't get a job flying commercial, all the airlines wanted cadets to train or ex-military to convert rather than someone with zero hours but a sheaf of tickets from simulator time, and he ended up at a flying school teaching PPL to keep his flying hours up. Last I heard though he had finally got a job with a budget airline in Spain, but that was several years after qualifying, much of which he spent on zero-hours contract with the flying school.
I will 3rd and 4th everyone who said square away class 1 medical first.
right now, CTC and OATS appear to have the stranglehold on people going into the airlines. a word of warning, CTC, etc will happily relieve you of your cash onto a scheme.....
the ye olde world route of hours building as an instructor looks to be very much out of fashion.
BA cadet scheme looks in doubt due to brexit.
Flybe I think have been looking.
Easyjet have been recruiting heavily due to the pilot losses they suffer to the long haul fleets but you maybe too late to apply for their current scheme (my flying buddy has his final interview in a week!)
otherwise, a career with NATS looks as enjoyable, as well paid and you get your own bed every night. and they are recruiting. result!
right now, CTC and OATS appear to have the stranglehold on people going into the airlines. a word of warning, CTC, etc will happily relieve you of your cash onto a scheme.....
the ye olde world route of hours building as an instructor looks to be very much out of fashion.
BA cadet scheme looks in doubt due to brexit.
Flybe I think have been looking.
Easyjet have been recruiting heavily due to the pilot losses they suffer to the long haul fleets but you maybe too late to apply for their current scheme (my flying buddy has his final interview in a week!)
otherwise, a career with NATS looks as enjoyable, as well paid and you get your own bed every night. and they are recruiting. result!
34 isn't too old but a few years ago, I know for sure that Ryanair would only take new pilots below the age of 35.
Although everybody is leaving Ryanair and Flybe in their droves, so might be opportunities there, I have a feeling there is a big pilot shortage on its way worldwide.
Do you know any commercial pilots to talk to as the career is not as good as it used to be and if you are earning £60k plus, happy in your job, not too stressed or fatigued and have a family, I would not bother.
Although everybody is leaving Ryanair and Flybe in their droves, so might be opportunities there, I have a feeling there is a big pilot shortage on its way worldwide.
Do you know any commercial pilots to talk to as the career is not as good as it used to be and if you are earning £60k plus, happy in your job, not too stressed or fatigued and have a family, I would not bother.
Medical is a good place to start. Class 1's are harder to achieve and a limiting factor.
Age of 34 is not a problem. I fly A380's and a number of our pilots didn't fly until their 30's.
Age of 34 is not a problem. I fly A380's and a number of our pilots didn't fly until their 30's.
kurt535 said:
BA cadet scheme looks in doubt due to brexit.
The above is nonsense. The BA scheme and BREXIT are totally unrelated. Gassing Station | Boats, Planes & Trains | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff