Vantage V12 Corsa tyre discussion: your thoughts.

Vantage V12 Corsa tyre discussion: your thoughts.

Author
Discussion

Grant3

Original Poster:

3,635 posts

254 months

Monday 14th February 2011
quotequote all
Hi Fellow VV12 owners,
Much as I'm loving this awesome car, after a few months of using it I'm not happy with the Pirelli Corsa's and I'm interested in your opinions.

Frankly their cold weather performance is "crap" and while my 997GT3 was fine in all conditions on Michelin Cup tyres (no doubt the rear weight bias aids traction)the V12 can on occasion lack traction everywhere on a cold-ish (dry) day and let's not talk about cold wet conditions!

I know you can buy a set of winter tyres, but I don't see why you should need to spend another £4k on wheels/tyres (and the wheels are V8 N420 style!) in addition to the high retail price unless (like Clorenzen) you use it in Scandinavia (or similar)or snow!

Ok once fully warmed up on a warmish day they are simply awesome and they do have a great dynamic feel (better than the Bridgestones), and I'm sure I will love them for the 6 months between April and September. But for much of the year they spoil the cars potential and without DSC could even be dangerous on occasion.

Personally I feel A.M. should have given people a choice of tyre options on purchase.

Your honest thoughts?




lady topaz

3,855 posts

253 months

Monday 14th February 2011
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Using mine daily I find I have to agree. Roundabouts or incline take offs on a damp cold morning are a leap of faith. No "I can make that gap" moments.

I find I am being very cautious with the accelerator, but a tad too much enthusiasm and things do get interesting.

Like you say, after warming everything settles down and I can drive with confidence.

Not being as experienced as some on here I am still getting used to the power, I do, however find the V12V a very forgiving car to drive. In my Tuscan it was a case of always expect the unexpected.

Roll on my PDC.

Not that I can afford it, but it would be good to see if there was a noticeable difference with alternative tyres, doing a copycat journey under the same conditions.

Di

V12PJN

44 posts

158 months

Monday 14th February 2011
quotequote all
I had the dealer change my tyres when I bought my car. I had driven a car fitted with the Corsa's but felt that the extra grip in the right conditions was not worth the loss of all round performance.
I have p zero rosso's and must say they have been great so far.

clorenzen

3,670 posts

234 months

Monday 14th February 2011
quotequote all
I agree with your comments on the P Zero Corsas when they are cold - hence my decision to get a set of Pirelli Soto Zeros for the winter months. I can only say that the Soto's are excellent and even on snow covered roads inspire a lot of confidence and make the dynamics of the car stand out even when everybody else is struggling for grip.
Your question comes back to whether there is a kind of middle ground but as always you will be compromising at both end of the temperature scale. I went for the big expense up front but also have two sets of tyres that best suit the car at various conditions and once you haven taken the plunge you actually get value for your investment through a longer lifespan. The dealer cleans and stores my wheels when not used so it is very little hassle to swap over when Spring comes - can't wait.

Just picked this up from the Q & A on the McLaren (herein lies the answer I guess):

Q13. What tyres are going to be standard fitment (on the McLaren)?

PB: Pirelli PZero tyres are the standard tyre, and Pirelli PZero Corsa tyres as an option. There is also a winter tyre option available (Pirelli Sottozero)

Edited by clorenzen on Monday 14th February 21:27

Adam2S

4,987 posts

176 months

Tuesday 15th February 2011
quotequote all
I'm with Grant on this one - Im still pootling around every day in my V12V on the Pzero Corsas but anything other than a very very gentle right foot results in wheel spin in just about any gear and I am going around all corners with good deal of caution. As amazing as the Corsas are in few weeks of summer that we have I feel they really are too compromised fo the UK market and I will almost certainly fit tyres that have better all year round performance when these have worn out. Im glad to read above that the std P zero rossos are a big step up in this area.

Given the Corsas are not really supposed to be used below 9C then, according to the bbc avg weather stats that is 5 months of the year that they are unsuitable http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/world/city_guides/res... (and thats in the relative warmth of London - so its even worse up north where I live!). I really cant be bothered with the expense and pfaff of swapping over two sets of wheels/tyres twice a year.

Such a shame that these are std fit, they add a small benefit during a few months on those few rare occasions when you can drive the car hard enought to exploit their benefit but you loose a significant amount for realistically >70% of the year when you take rain into consideration, and to top it off they have a much shorter lifespan as they have softer and less deep tread. Owners on the Porsche GT3 forum seem to be reporting only 4000miles from a full set! There ought to be a no cost option when buying the car to allow those who wish to track their car to have them fitted and for those of us who drive the car normally to go with a more useable and cost effective tyre.

Guycord

744 posts

172 months

Tuesday 15th February 2011
quotequote all
Hey, when you guys (and gal) all go down to NP on the 17th April, cause a stink. Maybe with 18 V12V's in the parking lot, they may listen.

Grant3

Original Poster:

3,635 posts

254 months

Tuesday 15th February 2011
quotequote all
Thanks all for the replies so far, I hope we can get opinions from all owners, looking at the roll call we have about 17 or 18 Piston-headers with VV12's.

Maybe we should have a VV12 sideways challenge, we should beat everyone...easily! biggrinbiggrin

I would also be interested to know how the DBS with the same power output handles in cold dry weather on their non-Corsa (but still special compound) tyres

jus

529 posts

208 months

Tuesday 15th February 2011
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Grant3 said:
I would also be interested to know how the DBS with the same power output handles in cold dry weather on their non-Corsa (but still special compound) tyres
Grant, I would say they work very well. The tyres on the DBS are excellent and seem to offer a good all round solution for the car in my year odd of ownership, whether wet, dry, hot or cold. As the DBS is a bit less hardcore oriented and a bit more GT-ish than the V12V I guess this choice of tyre makes sense. We don't get snow here or anything, just loads of rain, so I can't comment on extremely cold conditions, but it can get down to single digits and in some cases 3 degrees C or less on occasion.

Edited by jus on Tuesday 15th February 16:18

MichaelV8V

650 posts

260 months

Tuesday 15th February 2011
quotequote all
I think the McLaren MP4-12C numbers explain why AM fit Corsas:

0 - 200kph (124mph) in 9.1s (8.9s on optional Corsa tyres)
0 - 100kph (62mph) in 3.3s (3.1s with optional Corsa tyres)

Grant3

Original Poster:

3,635 posts

254 months

Tuesday 15th February 2011
quotequote all
Thanks for the DBS feedback Jus.

Michael..... Yes but the word is "optional" ... there is no doubting their ultimate warm weather grip and performance, but as Adam says in the UK between rain and cold weather for 60-70% of the time they are worse than standard tyres!

Aston should have given us a choice of a standard sports tyre with Corsa's as an option IMO.

Captain Beaky

1,389 posts

283 months

Wednesday 16th February 2011
quotequote all
Adam2S said:
Given the Corsas are not really supposed to be used below 9C then, according to the bbc avg weather stats that is 5 months of the year that they are unsuitable http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/world/city_guides/res... (and thats in the relative warmth of London - so its even worse up north where I live!). I really cant be bothered with the expense and pfaff of swapping over two sets of wheels/tyres twice a year.
That's a little pessimistic. The magic temperature for the Corsas is 7C and even in Leeds the average daily low temperature is above 6C for April to November inclusive.

I do agree that it would be good to have the choice though.

Adam2S

4,987 posts

176 months

Wednesday 16th February 2011
quotequote all
Captain Beaky said:
That's a little pessimistic. The magic temperature for the Corsas is 7C and even in Leeds the average daily low temperature is above 6C for April to November inclusive.

I do agree that it would be good to have the choice though.
Well ok those stats do look a little more optimistic, but as well we both know it rains in Leeds 364 days a year! biggrinbiggrinbiggrin

Captain Beaky

1,389 posts

283 months

Wednesday 16th February 2011
quotequote all
Adam2S said:
Well ok those stats do look a little more optimistic, but as well we both know it rains in Leeds 364 days a year! biggrinbiggrinbiggrin
365 in a leap year biggrin

bogie

16,342 posts

271 months

Wednesday 16th February 2011
quotequote all
if you buy a Lotus Exige, its the same, you get A048 trackday rubber thats not recommended for winter use ...there are always a few accidents each year with novice owners trying to commute in bad weather on them frown

the problem is more and more manufacturers are doing it on their extreme cars; the way to get the performance figures and postive mag reviews, is to fit trackday tyres ...usually giving a couple of secs per lap and better 0-60 etc

As pointed out already on this thead; trackday tyres might give you the edge on a warm day, on track, but on the road I doubt most people get near the limit of them ...then for the other 70% of the year, they offer worse performance than regular sports tyres...especially in rain, where they aquaplane a lot earlier than regular tyres frown

I used to have 2 sets of wheels n tyres on my Elise, trackday ones like the Corsas and regular tyres for the rest of the time, its the only way if you want to use the car all year around

I know Aston do winter tyre pack...if (maybe when!) I get a V12 Vantage, Id be quite happy having some regular Vantage sportpack wheels n tyres for daily use and keep the Corsa shod wheels for trackdays...I think that would be the best option

so I agree, maybe Aston should have it as a no-cost option when you buy; choice of wheel n tyre package

Pugsey

5,813 posts

213 months

Wednesday 16th February 2011
quotequote all
I had no probs with Corsas IF I was prepared to treat the first 5 miles as an 'adventure'. 'Working' them (cough) through the first few corners/roundabouts and under braking seems to get them working well after those first few miles. However they do 'cool down' fairly fast. So I guess I'm saying they're fine for me on a 'going for it' type trip. Having changed to normal Zeros I'm much happier with the overall security of the car from the get go and to be honest at this time of year don't feel short changed near the limit. Given it's my 'other 'alf's' car I'm happier with this route for her safety too.

WantanewV12V

580 posts

201 months

Wednesday 16th February 2011
quotequote all
Pugsey said:
I had no probs with Corsas IF I was prepared to treat the first 5 miles as an 'adventure'. 'Working' them (cough) through the first few corners/roundabouts and under braking seems to get them working well after those first few miles. However they do 'cool down' fairly fast. So I guess I'm saying they're fine for me on a 'going for it' type trip. Having changed to normal Zeros I'm much happier with the overall security of the car from the get go and to be honest at this time of year don't feel short changed near the limit. Given it's my 'other 'alf's' car I'm happier with this route for her safety too.
Are the normal zero's compatible with the V12V wheels ?

WantanewV12V

580 posts

201 months

Wednesday 16th February 2011
quotequote all
Adam2S said:
I'm with Grant on this one - Im still pootling around every day in my V12V on the Pzero Corsas but anything other than a very very gentle right foot results in wheel spin in just about any gear and I am going around all corners with good deal of caution. As amazing as the Corsas are in few weeks of summer that we have I feel they really are too compromised fo the UK market and I will almost certainly fit tyres that have better all year round performance when these have worn out. Im glad to read above that the std P zero rossos are a big step up in this area.

Given the Corsas are not really supposed to be used below 9C then, according to the bbc avg weather stats that is 5 months of the year that they are unsuitable http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/world/city_guides/res... (and thats in the relative warmth of London - so its even worse up north where I live!). I really cant be bothered with the expense and pfaff of swapping over two sets of wheels/tyres twice a year.

Such a shame that these are std fit, they add a small benefit during a few months on those few rare occasions when you can drive the car hard enought to exploit their benefit but you loose a significant amount for realistically >70% of the year when you take rain into consideration, and to top it off they have a much shorter lifespan as they have softer and less deep tread. Owners on the Porsche GT3 forum seem to be reporting only 4000miles from a full set! There ought to be a no cost option when buying the car to allow those who wish to track their car to have them fitted and for those of us who drive the car normally to go with a more useable and cost effective tyre.
My GT3 tyres went at about 4500 miles (I think that they are quoted as good for between 3000 and 5000 (clearly subject to use). My V12V has seen over 10000 miles and the tyres are still fine. Neither car has been tracked obviously but the V12V holds up better in wet conditions (in my experience). I would be interested in a better road option but would prefer not to change those lovely wheels or affect the ride height or handling in normal uk road conditions (there is considerably more time above 7C than below). As said before the land rover can cope with the very worst of UK weather but otherwise I consider the V12V a vehicle to be enjoyed in any conditions.

Adam2S

4,987 posts

176 months

Wednesday 16th February 2011
quotequote all
WantanewV12V said:
Are the normal zero's compatible with the V12V wheels ?
Ive just checked on the Pirelli website for the various types of the P-Zero range of tyres against the sizes fitted to the V12V. i.e. :
Front : 255/35/19 Directional
Rear : 295/30/19 Asymmetric

The P Zero Nero - Not available in the correct sizes.
http://www.pirelli.com/tyre/gb/en/car/sheet/pzero_...

The P Zero - Both front and rear are available, however these tyres are not Directional / Asymmetric.
http://www.pirelli.com/tyre/gb/en/car/sheet/pzero....

The P Zero System - Not available in the correct sizes / type.
http://www.pirelli.com/tyre/gb/en/car/sheet/pzero_...

The P Zero Rosso - Both front and rears are available!
http://www.pirelli.com/tyre/gb/en/car/sheet/pzero_...


So it looks like the only viable alternative all year high performance tyre from Pirelli is the P Zero Rosso range.

A quick check of the Michelin website seems to show that the Pilot Super Sport http://www.michelin.co.uk/tyres/michelin-pilot-sup...
seems to be the equivalent tyre of choice and is availble in the right sizes. However both front and rear are Asyemmetric and not a mixed Directional/Asymmetric system - not that it would matter as this would be the recommended setup by Michelin on these tyres.

Grant3

Original Poster:

3,635 posts

254 months

Wednesday 16th February 2011
quotequote all
Nice one Adam, very thorough as usual thumbup

So why if the P-Zero Rosso is available in the right size (and used on the DBS) and two out of six owners on this small thread have them fitted and find them fine - don't Aston offer them as an option on the VV12 confused


AMArchie

269 posts

169 months

Sunday 20th February 2011
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I have read the thread comments with interest. I have got to drive my V12V somewhat infrequently over the winter as am often away for extended periods on business, but when home I have taken it out - often in temperatures between 3C and 7C (below 2 or 3C seems to risky to me). I have not found the grip to be not too bad...but I must admit I have been a little nervous about the P zero Corsa's reputation, as expressed on here so I don't push it really hard. I still enjoy some spirited driving though, and it is such an amazing drive.
Looking forward to the spring....