Carbon Brakes - walk away or worth it?
Discussion
Hi all,
A friend is looking for a very nearly new Boxster and he has found one with the perfect spec but it has carbon brakes.
His concern is the running costs over standard steel variety, anyone else have experience with them and how long they last/cost?
Any help is appreciated, we are going to look at this particular one on Saturday.
Ed.
A friend is looking for a very nearly new Boxster and he has found one with the perfect spec but it has carbon brakes.
His concern is the running costs over standard steel variety, anyone else have experience with them and how long they last/cost?
Any help is appreciated, we are going to look at this particular one on Saturday.
Ed.
50K Miles on my Cayman, discs look as new to me.
Pads are more expensive than normal for Cayman / Boxster as the PCCB calipers are 6 pot. I think the front pads alone are around £300 from Porsche + fitting ( and new shims / caliper repair kit etc ). My front pads needed replacing as they had separated from the backing plate ( not sure why / how ), although they weren't actually worn down, the rear pads are still original.
You also need to be careful when changing wheels to ensure the discs don't get chipped.
They work well and you get very little brake dust.
If you did ever need to replace the discs there are options for steel replacements. OEM replacement discs are around £3K EACH!
Pads are more expensive than normal for Cayman / Boxster as the PCCB calipers are 6 pot. I think the front pads alone are around £300 from Porsche + fitting ( and new shims / caliper repair kit etc ). My front pads needed replacing as they had separated from the backing plate ( not sure why / how ), although they weren't actually worn down, the rear pads are still original.
You also need to be careful when changing wheels to ensure the discs don't get chipped.
They work well and you get very little brake dust.
If you did ever need to replace the discs there are options for steel replacements. OEM replacement discs are around £3K EACH!
Edited by cay on Tuesday 20th May 16:01
They are superb on the road and as others have said , last for ages and give off very little dust keeping the side of the car cleaner for longer. They are more "fragile" than steel when it comes to things like taking the wheels off and potentially having a visit to the gravel trap if trackdays are his bag.
Use the two guide posts that should be in the tool kit when removing wheels as a dropped wheel on the edge of the rotor can split or chip it and thats bad.
I didnt find the replacement costs of PCCB pads that bad comparing to the price of normal steel pads but dont buy into the whole, "you need this sensor and that backplate aswell". Once the pads need replacing it is possible to just replace the pads and reuse all the other bits to keep cost down.
Also be aware that they will taper in the caliper. Dare I say it that the warning light should come on way before the brass rivets start touching the carbon rotor but worth noting and being aware of.
Trackdays are a whole new ball game and the pads will wear at an accelerated rate which needs to be managed.
Use the two guide posts that should be in the tool kit when removing wheels as a dropped wheel on the edge of the rotor can split or chip it and thats bad.
I didnt find the replacement costs of PCCB pads that bad comparing to the price of normal steel pads but dont buy into the whole, "you need this sensor and that backplate aswell". Once the pads need replacing it is possible to just replace the pads and reuse all the other bits to keep cost down.
Also be aware that they will taper in the caliper. Dare I say it that the warning light should come on way before the brass rivets start touching the carbon rotor but worth noting and being aware of.
Trackdays are a whole new ball game and the pads will wear at an accelerated rate which needs to be managed.
I wouldn't buy another car without them, they are superb on a Boxster if you do a search on here you will find all the info you need as the subject has come up a lot. They keep the wheels clean with very little if any dust and once you get used to them other performance cars without them seem a little under-braked.
If you do land up doing a lot of track days and do ruin them in the kitty litter you can buy the excellent steel replacements and if you don't mind the additional unsprung weight of the steel replacements you will still have 6 pots upfront and four to the rear which is real stopping power.
If you do land up doing a lot of track days and do ruin them in the kitty litter you can buy the excellent steel replacements and if you don't mind the additional unsprung weight of the steel replacements you will still have 6 pots upfront and four to the rear which is real stopping power.
Edited by BIRMA on Tuesday 20th May 21:31
What he said above, I completed the Porsche experience day in a Boxster with Carbon Brakes, questioned the price of them so had a go in a Boxster without and I thought the brakes had failed that’s how good the Carbons are.
No good to my bank balance as now a must have option on a Boxster GTS.
No good to my bank balance as now a must have option on a Boxster GTS.
I also agree, PCCB's would always be my preference.
Change the pads at half worn to minimise heat transfer, on a damp morning just warm the discs through to get them going --- and if you do wear them out you can either fit larger steel or alternative Carbon discs.
If you are buying secondhand, just get them checked. But I asked my OPC to check mine at two years old and quite a few track days, and they said that they still had more material on them than the minimum thickness for a set of new carbon discs !
Now done 25k and they are just polished ...
Change the pads at half worn to minimise heat transfer, on a damp morning just warm the discs through to get them going --- and if you do wear them out you can either fit larger steel or alternative Carbon discs.
If you are buying secondhand, just get them checked. But I asked my OPC to check mine at two years old and quite a few track days, and they said that they still had more material on them than the minimum thickness for a set of new carbon discs !
Now done 25k and they are just polished ...
Another thing that struck me when I checked out a new Cayman at my OPC with PCCB's and 20 inch wheels next to one with standard brakes and 20 inch wheels was that the standard braked models discs at the rear looked a bit out of proportion dare I say weedy. This is purely aesthetics and nothing to do with braking ability but on a high performance car overall looks do play a part.
Thanks for all the responses, I showed my mate and he decided it was well worth a look so called them and unfortunately it has just had a deposit but on it.. bugger.
This is the car - About the right price I thought.
http://www.bhpmsport.com/2012_porsche_boxster_s_fo...
This is the car - About the right price I thought.
http://www.bhpmsport.com/2012_porsche_boxster_s_fo...
I've never driven a car with carbon brakes and the price frankly put me off spec'ing them on my Boxster as I was impressed by the performance of the standard steel brakes when they were "demonstrated" to / by me at Porsche Silverstone Experience center, but why / how are they that much better under normal road driving conditions? I'm not interested in being able to brake 15m or whatever later or brake dust reduction, I'd genuinely like to understand why folks would choose carbon over steels if you are being asked to pay X thousand for them.
Is it feel? Road use only, no track work
Is it feel? Road use only, no track work
Moog72 said:
I've never driven a car with carbon brakes and the price frankly put me off spec'ing them on my Boxster as I was impressed by the performance of the standard steel brakes when they were "demonstrated" to / by me at Porsche Silverstone Experience center, but why / how are they that much better under normal road driving conditions? I'm not interested in being able to brake 15m or whatever later or brake dust reduction, I'd genuinely like to understand why folks would choose carbon over steels if you are being asked to pay X thousand for them.
Is it feel? Road use only, no track work
you just said it, braking much much later, less wear, no dust, better handling, lighter weight, 100,000 miles life, 6 pots over 4 potsIs it feel? Road use only, no track work
hugh rears over tiny steel rears.
they are a bargin as an option as you could never fit them after market.
if you drove one then you would know.
mrdemon said:
you just said it, braking much much later, less wear, no dust, better handling, lighter weight, 100,000 miles life, 6 pots over 4 pots
hugh rears over tiny steel rears.
they are a bargin as an option as you could never fit them after market.
if you drove one then you would know.
Cheers, but braking later makes zero difference on the road, wear really isn't really an issue unless you are doing big miles and the cost for carbon even as an option pays for many steel replacements in any case. I get the handling / weight benefit, but a Boxster drives better than the majority of other cars out there now, so for strictly road use only do you really get the benefit in that regard?hugh rears over tiny steel rears.
they are a bargin as an option as you could never fit them after market.
if you drove one then you would know.
If were buying a car with them already fitted it certainly wouldn't put me off, but I couldn't (and didn't) justify the cost to stick 'em on a new Boxster. I'm not sure nearly 5k or over 10% of the base cost of the car constitutes a bargain
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