718 review - test drove today

[cowboyengineer]

I'd ike spmepne who is running it daily to let me know if it is more efficient then the 6.

My GTS was more efficient then my golf r estate, which was a twin clutch 4cyl turbo

[Nimerino]

ORD said:

Yep.

You cannot be near the top of the rev range at all times given the stupid gearing, so more torque at mid revs will make a big difference. The rest will be worth maybe a second or two here or there. Minor chassis changes compared to the engine.

I would also bet my house on the car being very far from stock for the record run. Porsche needed a special time and got one.

I don't really see the force of the argument that one should put the engine to one side and discuss the car aside from the engine. That's like saying 'ignore the steak and tell me about the side salad. I'll buy the steak if the side salad is nice'. If you like nice engines, there is nothing that will make the 718 even close to a competitor for a 981. It's a worse car. Aside from people who need to get a new car because they are locked into a lease cycle, there's extremely little reason to buy a 718 over a 981 (unless, as I say, you are not into engines).

This is a discussion being had over in another thread re the 991.2 S vs. the 991.1 GT3 having run nearly identical Ring times in the hands of Sport Auto. I'd think we're all looking at the effect of the area under the curve, as even though the GT4 has more peak power, it has significantly less power available as you run up the rev range. So the engine likely contributes massively to the fast times the 718 is putting out.

I don't know if I buy the argument about the engine. There are things it does that are quantifiably better than the old car (more torque, more power, relaxed delivery), but none of those things appeal to me (or you, from the quote above). To make a daft analogy, an expensive SLR camera doesn't produce better pictures than a cheapo Kodak if you keep sticking it in manual and pointing it at the background, and as I've said before, there is a huge selection bias on PH that means we represent a niche fraction of the buying customers. Most people simply want their camera to find there kid and fire off an ok image when pointed in their kid's general direction. Most Boxster owners likely do too, and for them the F6 will have felt gutless and slow in comparison to the new engine.

[Mario149]

I've not run my BGTS as a daily, but i did do a couple of thousand mile road trip in Spain I the Autumn. Mixture of motorways, hoons, pottering etc saw high 20s. Motorway runs were an easy low 30s at 80mph with the roof up, did see 38mpg a couple of times. Conversely, a proper hoon will easily only see 10mpg. In terms of spread of possible mpg, the BGTS has the largest of any car I've ever owned, that 3.4 will guzzle fuel if you provoke it!

[bcr5784]

ORD said:

I don't really see the force of the argument that one should put the engine to one side and discuss the car aside from the engine. That's like saying 'ignore the steak and tell me about the side salad. I'll buy the steak if the side salad is nice'. If you like nice engines, there is nothing that will make the 718 even close to a competitor for a 981. It's a worse car. Aside from people who need to get a new car because they are locked into a lease cycle, there's extremely little reason to buy a 718 over a 981 (unless, as I say, you are not into engines).

Yes but neither can you disregard the gearing and torque curve on the NA engine. The combination of the high gearing and mid range torque hole SERIOUSLY compromise the driving experience (especially on the manual 2.7). The torque of the turbo makes the high gearing a non issue and the torque hole has gone. Whether that compensates for the other things (particularly aurally) is a matter of opinion - which is best judged when you have driven the car.

[HighwayStar]

Sparkyhd said:

dreamcar said:

It's just the way the performance is delivered ruins it for me.

But don't you think in everyday driving the power is delivered better by the 718?

There's a 1 mile stretch of dual carriageway near me which is always empty and no cameras so I roll up there occasionally, floor the throttle, enjoy the sound and acceleration and then go back to ordinary driving. Realistically should I be buying the car for that or for fighting my way round the M25 and short trips cross country to Waitrose?

Someone above mentioned the TT and save loads of money. Trouble is I prefer the look of the Porsche. I probably spend more time looking at it than driving it and I know it’s frivolous but looks take precedent over engine noise.

Not to pick on you in particular but this is a clear example of the other type of buyer. Not bothered about the noise, wringing the engine out to get at the good stuff. Too much like hard work. The preference here is easily accessible speed and 'looks takes precedence over engine noise.' Sparkyhd knows what he wants and likes. And that is the way it is. There'll be plenty of new Porsche customers who have no idea or interest of the F6, the company's sporting history... Nothing. They just want a Porsche... 3 of my friends have got Pork within 3 weeks of me getting my 981. 2 just wanted Boxsters simply because it's what they wanted, 987's. Neither of them have know idea how good their cars are, not car guys. They just feel good having them. The other, a Cayman R. He shares my love of cars and knew exactly what he wanted.
There you have it, 2, maybe 3 examples of your Porsche buyer... Not everyone a hardcore enthusiast. I guess I'm kinda defending you there Spark, though you may see it differently

[pete.g]

Most Porsche buyers choose diesel SUVs.

l own a 981 and had a 987 before that and consider myself a genuine enthusiast - if I buy a 718 do I cease to be one?

Thanks to the posters on this thread who have driven the cars and posted an honest review - it's helpful to read about first hand experience from a variety of experienced drivers.

Edited by pete.g on Monday 23 May 23:33

Edited by pete.g on Monday 23 May 23:33

[ORD]

pete.g said:

Most Porsche buyers choose diesel SUVs.

l own a 981 and had a 987 before that and consider myself a genuine enthusiast - if I buy a 718 do I cease to be one?

Thanks to the posters on this thread who have driven the cars and posted an honest review - it's helpful to read about first hand experience from a variety of experienced drivers.

Edited by pete.g on Monday 23 May 23:33

Edited by pete.g on Monday 23 May 23:33

I think I would doubt that you're much of a driving enthusiast. Maybe wrongly. But that's just my honest reaction to choosing a very similar car with a much worse engine (for a sports car) that is also more expensive. It would make me think you put newness above a lot of more important things. I may well be wrong. Just telling you straight what impression it would create for me. I doubt you care

[FrankCayman]

ORD said:

pete.g said:

Most Porsche buyers choose diesel SUVs.

l own a 981 and had a 987 before that and consider myself a genuine enthusiast - if I buy a 718 do I cease to be one?

Thanks to the posters on this thread who have driven the cars and posted an honest review - it's helpful to read about first hand experience from a variety of experienced drivers.

Edited by pete.g on Monday 23 May 23:33

Edited by pete.g on Monday 23 May 23:33

I think I would doubt that you're much of a driving enthusiast. Maybe wrongly. But that's just my honest reaction to choosing a very similar car with a much worse engine (for a sports car) that is also more expensive. It would make me think you put newness above a lot of more important things. I may well be wrong. Just telling you straight what impression it would create for me. I doubt you care

My Dad is a life long driving enthusiast - good driver too. He doesn't like Porsches full stop. So how does that work in your world ORDer ?

[FrankCayman]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

He's back!!!

[nimmo12]

A dull place without the Moose.

[FrankCayman]

nimmo12 said:

A dull place without the Moose.

Indeed! Even has to have the last word with 'The Mods'! Surprised it took so long.....or was that to ensure they didn't see his reply?!

Good old Moose - nice to have you back

[ORD]

FrankCayman said:

My Dad is a life long driving enthusiast - good driver too. He doesn't like Porsches full stop. So how does that work in your world ORDer ?

I doubt he likes 4 cylinder turbos with peak torque from 1900 revs. If he does, he's a weird kind of driving enthusiast.

[ORD]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

True. The mods always take a 'plague on all your houses' approach and sanction the people who are actually contributing worthwhile content but get irritated by the trolls. A more sensible system of moderation would be to either bother to read and understand the thread or just chill out. We are all grown ups. This should emphatically not be a safe space.

I've been told off before for insulting morons that respond to any disagreement with ad hom attacks and nasty little remarks. I got sanctioned because I was blunt rather than being a sarky little smart arse prick.

If someone like Cmoose were banned, that would see me leave, too. On second thoughts, I may not be doing him any favours by making that promise

[Porsche911R]

FrankCayman said:

My Dad is a life long driving enthusiast - good driver too. He doesn't like Porsches full stop.

why not ?

I am not brand loyal and have run 66 cars, but if you like cars you have to like Porsche !! I don't dislike any brand.

[HighwayStar]

FrankCayman said:

nimmo12 said:

A dull place without the Moose.

Indeed! Even has to have the last word with 'The Mods'! Surprised it took so long.....or was that to ensure they didn't see his reply?!

Good old Moose - nice to have you back

The thing is, Moose didn't deserve the mods slap down... what he said was spot on. A few totally missed/maybe didn't understand the point he was making.....

anonymous said:

[redacted]

and so it began.

[bcr5784]

Porsche911R said:

why not ?

I am not brand loyal and have run 66 cars, but if you like cars you have to like Porsche !! I don't dislike any brand.

I've bought lots of cars too and am not loyal to any BUT brands - at least some of them - have a genuine ethos which you can like or dislike. Personally I like the Lotus ethos - unfortunately they have lost their way in recent years. I used to like the Porsche ethos - sensible, no nonsense everyday supercars (which unfortunately were inclined to send their owners backwards through hedges) - but they have rather become rather bloated designer items of late - and if they weren't, by some margin, the best cars in their class, I probably wouldn't have bought one. So I can see why some might not fancy a Porsche.

[Porsche911R]

bcr5784 said:

I've bought lots of cars too and am not loyal to any BUT brands - at least some of them - have a genuine ethos which you can like or dislike. Personally I like the Lotus ethos - unfortunately they have lost their way in recent years. I used to like the Porsche ethos - sensible, no nonsense everyday supercars (which unfortunately were inclined to send their owners backwards through hedges) - but they have rather become rather bloated designer items of late - and if they weren't, by some margin, the best cars in their class, I probably wouldn't have bought one. So I can see why some might not fancy a Porsche.

as a life long driving enthusiast you don't have to have the new cars, I see Lotus owners who will NOT buy a Porsche ever !! It's odd
I have owned 2 Lotus and had Lotus in my life for 5 years of driving. As you have said they have lost there way and it's just a frustrating company atm and has been for years, Porsche again, all getting abit fat.

But at some point all these brands bring out a good car and to rule it off because of the badge seems daft.

I find it odd a brand will make some one NOT buy a car even if it's the best car at the time.

[pete.g]

ORD said:

pete.g said:

Most Porsche buyers choose diesel SUVs.

l own a 981 and had a 987 before that and consider myself a genuine enthusiast - if I buy a 718 do I cease to be one?

Thanks to the posters on this thread who have driven the cars and posted an honest review - it's helpful to read about first hand experience from a variety of experienced drivers.

Edited by pete.g on Monday 23 May 23:33

Edited by pete.g on Monday 23 May 23:33

I think I would doubt that you're much of a driving enthusiast. Maybe wrongly. But that's just my honest reaction to choosing a very similar car with a much worse engine (for a sports car) that is also more expensive. It would make me think you put newness above a lot of more important things. I may well be wrong. Just telling you straight what impression it would create for me. I doubt you care

I think people should make the choices they make to suit what they want, need or desire, rather than the impression it creates for others. As I and others on here have noted in the past, people who routinely drive different cars create very different impressions and get very different reactions, despite being exactly the same person.

The fact that we are now hearing from some people who have driven the 718 is useful to me. While I will wait and see what I think when I eventually do get to drive one myself, I do like to hear the opinions of others, especially when they voice these views rationally and objectively.

What I don't like is the portentous "Tablets. Of. Stone." type of poster that dismisses all contrary views as the moronic outpourings of idiots who only want the supposed admiration and respect that driving a Porsche will bring. However, if I'm going to be on a forum like this I'll just have to put up with it!

There's a very small chance that I will buy a 718 - this doesn't stop me from thinking about it, but if you're a driving enthusiast like me you do think about buying a lot of cars that never end up in the garage.

Edited by pete.g on Tuesday 24th May 10:45

[Sparkyhd]

HighwayStar said:

Not to pick on you in particular but this is a clear example of the other type of buyer. Not bothered about the noise, wringing the engine out to get at the good stuff. Too much like hard work. The preference here is easily accessible speed and 'looks takes precedence over engine noise.' Sparkyhd knows what he wants and likes. And that is the way it is. There'll be plenty of new Porsche customers who have no idea or interest of the F6, the company's sporting history... Nothing. They just want a Porsche... 3 of my friends have got Pork within 3 weeks of me getting my 981. 2 just wanted Boxsters simply because it's what they wanted, 987's. Neither of them have know idea how good their cars are, not car guys. They just feel good having them. The other, a Cayman R. He shares my love of cars and knew exactly what he wanted.
There you have it, 2, maybe 3 examples of your Porsche buyer... Not everyone a hardcore enthusiast. I guess I'm kinda defending you there Spark, though you may see it differently

Can't say I'm not entirely bothered about noise. Back in the day I loved sitting in the back of my dad's Stag, roof down and a V8 burble out the exhaust. I didn't find the 718 noise unpleasant. I've had a lifelong interest in cars but I'm not a fanatic or a purist otherwise I'd be driving a Morgan and heading a political party seeking to ban monocoque body shells.

Now I’ve switched the Cayman back to summer tyres on 20inch rims I’m hating it, the suspension is too jiggly and irritating. Might just switch back to the winter 18’s. PASM was one reason to change but it’ll probably be cheaper to pay for extra wear on my all year winter tyres. Or maybe stick with the summer tyres and when my wife next complains about the ride tell her to stop complaining, wind down the window and enjoy the sound of the flat six. I can’t make up my mind.

[JasonSteel]

Sparkyhd said:

Now I’ve switched the Cayman back to summer tyres on 20inch rims I’m hating it, the suspension is too jiggly and irritating. Might just switch back to the winter 18’s.

i only got to try the 718 with 20 inchers and have got 20 inch on my order too. should i be considering something different? the 718C doesn't even have the option of 18 inch wheels and only one 19 inch option. the rest are all 20 inch.