718 review - test drove today
Discussion
Sparkyhd said:
Yes it's a bit tacky. Should be in metal not plastic. Won't bother me though because I'll be ordering it without.
It must be a daunting task being a Porsche designer. Basically the brief is bring the car up to date, comply with forthcoming legislation and make it competitive for economy and emissions but your not allowed to change anything because you'll upset all those that seem to know more what defines a true Porsche than Porsche.
I'll have a nice Cayman 981 2.7 PDK 2015 to sell soon for those addicted to the sound of the F6.
According to some US economy figures the new engines are worse... Great work with working to new ligislation!It must be a daunting task being a Porsche designer. Basically the brief is bring the car up to date, comply with forthcoming legislation and make it competitive for economy and emissions but your not allowed to change anything because you'll upset all those that seem to know more what defines a true Porsche than Porsche.
I'll have a nice Cayman 981 2.7 PDK 2015 to sell soon for those addicted to the sound of the F6.
If you tickle them along gently, 981s can be pretty frugal. I've seen high 30s mpg on 80mph motorway cruises in Spain. Mixed sensible driving with the odd squirt gives low to mid 20s. On a charge on the road, mid to high teens. On track, you might as well be pouring super unleaded onto the tarmac and it appeared to use a similar amount to my 7.1 GT3
Mario149 said:
If you tickle them along gently, 981s can be pretty frugal. I've seen high 30s mpg on 80mph motorway cruises in Spain. Mixed sensible driving with the odd squirt gives low to mid 20s. On a charge on the road, mid to high teens. On track, you might as well be pouring super unleaded onto the tarmac and it appeared to use a similar amount to my 7.1 GT3
Much the same in my S - though I think the 2.7s noticeably more frugal, with figures in the 40s quoted, which I can't see mine achieving except on a 50mph motorway stretch.My 2.7 got muich better after 5000 miles. Generally see 30-32mpg, if I stick to speed limits and drive like an OAP then 40mpg. All of these figures were 5-8mpg lower for first 3000 miles.
bTW: The reason I mention this is that there are probably not any run in turbos around yet and at least with my 981 it made a big difference.
bTW: The reason I mention this is that there are probably not any run in turbos around yet and at least with my 981 it made a big difference.
Edited by Krobar on Sunday 5th June 13:36
Sparkyhd said:
Although the 718 economy figures are probably nearer the truth compared to the 981 figures created during VW's fictional period.
Unlikely - that's the whole point of turbo engines, they run off boost at the speeds needed for the tests but then work much harder in normal conditions. Essentially they cheat the tests by the very nature of their configuration - more power and torque doesn't come for free, you still need to burn the fuel to get the power out of it...csmith319 said:
Unlikely - that's the whole point of turbo engines, they run off boost at the speeds needed for the tests but then work much harder in normal conditions. Essentially they cheat the tests by the very nature of their configuration - more power and torque doesn't come for free, you still need to burn the fuel to get the power out of it...
While it's undeniably true that turbos rarely get very close to their gov figures, some do achieve much better figures than their NA counterparts.. My OH is about to replace her Suzuki Swift Sport (NA 136bhp) with a Seat Ibiza 1.4TSI (Turbo 150bhp) and while we would struggle to reach 40mpg in the Swift (35 more typical - ignoring the trip meter which lies like a trooper) most people seem to be getting comfortably over 40 for the Seat, and some managing 50 (driving like grannies). The reason? The Seat has so much torque it pulls (and pulls VERY well) similar gearing to a manual 981 (28mph/1000 in 6th) so frictional losses are less. (It does also cruise on 2 cylinders at up to 75mph or so which helps - but not that much according to VW)
I think it comes down to if you use the power the gains for turbos are not that great, but they can be if you cruise.
Had a standard (PDK) 718 for a few hours today. (Relevant) bits of spec - 20" wheels with N1 (ie new) Pirelli PZeros, standard suspension, Sport Chrono, Power Steering Plus. Standard (not PSE) exhaust.
First the good bits
1) Steering much improved. I didn't expect to like PSP but it makes the steering lighter at roundabout speeds and makes the car feel more agile. Steering feel noticeably better - I'd now go so far as to say good for a power steering system full stop.
2) Handling a bit better - probably aided by the torque of the turbo when wound up which allows more throttle adjustability. Maybe new PZeros are better - impossible to say.
3) PCM improved but personally couldn't get excited about it, may be of more interest if you have an Apple phone.
4) Outright go and torque when the turbo is wound up impressive for the entry level model - certainly a match for my 981S
5) Free revving up to 6500 at least.
The not-so-good bits.
1) Ride on 20" wheels verging on unacceptable to me. From memory (it's a while ago) it actually seems worse than I remember the 981 on standard suspension and 20" wheels. It was so jiggly that I actually checked the tyre pressures - and they weren't too high. To put it in context, my S in PASM Sport mode on 19" wheels is definitely more comfortable, and in a completely different league in Normal. I'd definitely avoid 20" wheels with standard suspension.
2) Turbo lag was far worse than I expected (far worse than a 991.2). Noticeable off the mark, dreadful at 2000 revs and only becoming an non-issue at 3500rpm and above. (That was with PDK in manual mode). While it is possible to circumvent some of it with left foot braking (with PDK) I can't think many are going to do that ( the brakes did seem a little heavier than my own car though, making LFB easier). Drive it in auto and Sport + and the issue largely goes away once rolling since revs are rarely allowed to drop below 3500.
3) Noise. Having enjoyed two Scoobies I wouldn't have minded if it did sound a bit like one. It has different length exhaust manifolds - like the early Scoobies - and which gave them (to me) a rather pleasant off-beat burble. It sounds nothing like them - unfortunately. The exhaust sounds gravelly and harsh, and not to my taste at all. Where the 981 (non_PSE) sounds cultured, the 781 sounds uncouth to me.
Anyone who has read my previous posting will know that I'm not fixated with a NA6 but I have to say overall it is a big disappointment. It's not that it's a flat 4 or a turbo - just it's not a very good example of either imo.
First the good bits
1) Steering much improved. I didn't expect to like PSP but it makes the steering lighter at roundabout speeds and makes the car feel more agile. Steering feel noticeably better - I'd now go so far as to say good for a power steering system full stop.
2) Handling a bit better - probably aided by the torque of the turbo when wound up which allows more throttle adjustability. Maybe new PZeros are better - impossible to say.
3) PCM improved but personally couldn't get excited about it, may be of more interest if you have an Apple phone.
4) Outright go and torque when the turbo is wound up impressive for the entry level model - certainly a match for my 981S
5) Free revving up to 6500 at least.
The not-so-good bits.
1) Ride on 20" wheels verging on unacceptable to me. From memory (it's a while ago) it actually seems worse than I remember the 981 on standard suspension and 20" wheels. It was so jiggly that I actually checked the tyre pressures - and they weren't too high. To put it in context, my S in PASM Sport mode on 19" wheels is definitely more comfortable, and in a completely different league in Normal. I'd definitely avoid 20" wheels with standard suspension.
2) Turbo lag was far worse than I expected (far worse than a 991.2). Noticeable off the mark, dreadful at 2000 revs and only becoming an non-issue at 3500rpm and above. (That was with PDK in manual mode). While it is possible to circumvent some of it with left foot braking (with PDK) I can't think many are going to do that ( the brakes did seem a little heavier than my own car though, making LFB easier). Drive it in auto and Sport + and the issue largely goes away once rolling since revs are rarely allowed to drop below 3500.
3) Noise. Having enjoyed two Scoobies I wouldn't have minded if it did sound a bit like one. It has different length exhaust manifolds - like the early Scoobies - and which gave them (to me) a rather pleasant off-beat burble. It sounds nothing like them - unfortunately. The exhaust sounds gravelly and harsh, and not to my taste at all. Where the 981 (non_PSE) sounds cultured, the 781 sounds uncouth to me.
Anyone who has read my previous posting will know that I'm not fixated with a NA6 but I have to say overall it is a big disappointment. It's not that it's a flat 4 or a turbo - just it's not a very good example of either imo.
Fair summary.
I thought the ride on 20 inches no PASM was better than my 981 20s no PASM. Anyhow I've ordered 19s with PASM.
Didn't notice the turbo lag but I probably didn't drive it as enthusiastically as you.
I quite liked the sound but I also like the noise a Beetle makes so I may not be the best judge.
I thought the ride on 20 inches no PASM was better than my 981 20s no PASM. Anyhow I've ordered 19s with PASM.
Didn't notice the turbo lag but I probably didn't drive it as enthusiastically as you.
I quite liked the sound but I also like the noise a Beetle makes so I may not be the best judge.
bcr5784 said:
review
Well, I suppose some sort of silver lining to take away from all that is at least there's now a concrete difference between the quality of the motor and its delivery in the Cayster compared to the 911 now, so if you stump for the base 911 at least you'll feel like you're properly getting more for your money rather than just an ECU tweak.Gassing Station | Boxster/Cayman | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff