Why did the Panamera Sport Turismo die?

[reddiesel]

Discombobulate said:

That's it different to yours I can live with that.
And I have driven both. Neither is a sports car, obviously, but I much prefer the Taycan as a daily lugger. Quiet, refined and very fast. And, to my eyes, better looking. But good thing we are not all the same.

That's fair comment . Can I ask if you think the Taycan can be pretty colour sensitive ?

[RDMcG]

Discombobulate said:

Charlie_1 said:

Well the fact you actually want a Taycan says a great deal about your taste , Panamera everyday

That's it different to yours I can live with that.
And I have driven both. Neither is a sports car, obviously, but I much prefer the Taycan as a daily lugger. Quiet, refined and very fast. And, to my eyes, better looking. But good thing we are not all the same.

I certainly agree that the Tacan is a better-looking car and it is indeed quick and quiet. My bias is for a V8 personally but understand your preference.

[Discombobulate]

RDMcG said:

I certainly agree that the Tacan is a better-looking car and it is indeed quick and quiet. My bias is for a V8 personally but understand your preference.

And I very much understand yours (used to have a RS6)

[Discombobulate]

reddiesel said:

That's fair comment . Can I ask if you think the Taycan can be pretty colour sensitive ?

For me darker colour and filthy
I live in the sticks and like my cars to fit in.

[SkinnyPete]

I have never understood the criticism of the Panamera.

Looks are subjective, I get that. But the build quality and drive a far superior to a Macan, Cayenne or Taycan.

I’m reasonably confident I will own a Panamera turbo at some point. Definitely the best road car I’ve ever driven.

[braddo]

Mosdef said:

I’m not sure they’re miles apart from a 5 series or A6, let alone the RS6, which is one of the closer competitors. Width wise they’re:

Porsche - 1,937mm
BMW - 1,868mm
Audi - 1,866mm
RS6 - 1,936mm

Lengthwise they are:

Porsche - 5,049mm
BMW - 4,963mm
Audi - 4, 939mm
RS6 - 4,979mm

The Panamera is definitely big but not materially bigger than the M, AMG, RS cars most would compare them with.

Compared to a normal A6 then, it's 7cm narrower and 11cm shorter. That's enough to make a difference in urban environments and/or narrow roads. A bit like Cayenne to Macan I guess, or A8 to A6. A Porsche based roughly on the A6 estate platform with RWD and the 4.8L V8, without huge wheels...

[Mosdef]

braddo said:

Mosdef said:

I’m not sure they’re miles apart from a 5 series or A6, let alone the RS6, which is one of the closer competitors. Width wise they’re:

Porsche - 1,937mm
BMW - 1,868mm
Audi - 1,866mm
RS6 - 1,936mm

Lengthwise they are:

Porsche - 5,049mm
BMW - 4,963mm
Audi - 4, 939mm
RS6 - 4,979mm

The Panamera is definitely big but not materially bigger than the M, AMG, RS cars most would compare them with.

Compared to a normal A6 then, it's 7cm narrower and 11cm shorter. That's enough to make a difference in urban environments and/or narrow roads. A bit like Cayenne to Macan I guess, or A8 to A6. A Porsche based roughly on the A6 estate platform with RWD and the 4.8L V8, without huge wheels...

I can’t really speak for the A6 but have spent a lot of time in E Classes and 5 series and the smaller dimensions didn’t make a noticeable difference for me in general driving (an inch or so either side isn’t much, especially if the Panamera has rear axle steering). That said, older multi-storey car parks aren’t great for any of them.

As for the 4.8 engine in older units, that was a gem, albeit a bit low on grunt for such a heavy car. All the reports at the time were full of praise for the RWD S with that engine. I’ve never been lucky enough to try one.

[sasha320]

The only people that bought an ST were people who liked the shape AND were happy to part with extra money for it OR they needed 5 seats.

I bought an ST for the seats as the additional liggage space is negligible.

I have a feeling the new Panamera can be specced with 4+1 seats meaning the ST would have been a minority sport.

[stuckmojo]

Fantastic cars.

I had one as a courtesy vehicle and didn't want to give it back.

But they're enormous.

Perfect for the US market, but they don't buy estates there

[Leithen]

£40-50K Ultra comfortable, practical mile muncher. Only negative is the fuel economy. Fun choice though against the more dull alternatives.

[MasterofMuppets]

I can't believe the Panamera ST is based on a concept from 2012 - https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/porsche/panam...

I thought it was stunning when it finally got round to production in 2017 (perhaps a year after the 2nd gen hatch) and I think it's aged/aging well. It is quite big though - it was closer to contemporary 7-series/S-class proportions. Of course by this point those have become even larger still and it's probably a bit closer to 5-series/E-class size now.

[Milemuncher]

Just shows how different we all are. I think the Taycan is hideous but quite like the Panamera ST. And as others have said I definitely didn’t find it slow and heavy - if anything I thought the pace and handling was physics-defying for such a big car.

But each to their own!

[RDMcG]

Milemuncher said:

Just shows how different we all are. I think the Taycan is hideous but quite like the Panamera ST. And as others have said I definitely didn’t find it slow and heavy - if anything I thought the pace and handling was physics-defying for such a big car.

But each to their own!

Of course I agree with you. However , there is a bit of variation on engine choice. I chose the Turbo at 550BHP though there was a Hybrid with 680bhp as well as some smaller engines too. For me personally the Turbo was enough and have no idea why it would have seemed slow and heavy.

Not meant to be a sports car or an off-roader though I have tracked it at Spa and the NS where it was not as nimble as my GT cars but surprised me how well it handled. Would have been better with ceramics I expect. Hit over 300km/h on the autobahn.

Have driven plenty of desert trails and again it is no Jeep but good as most road-oriented SUVs. It is much lower than a Cayenne or the like so OH much prefers the Cayenne for sitting up higher, a very common reason why people buy SUVs apparently.

Clearly those who did not fancy it vastly outnumbered those who did, so the market has spoken. Fair enough.

[dimots]

I was initially convinced I would be buying a new Panamera Sport Turismo as soon as they became available, but once I actually saw it at the dealership it was a no from me. Good looking, nice interior, but huge and the deal-breaker...a tiny impractical boot.

I had imagined a useful four seat tourer with estate levels of space. It's not that at all. It's a reverse tardis with a very cramped rear and token estate styling. I was pretty disappointed.

A few years later and they did the same thing with the Taycan. I don't get it, there's barely any functional upgrade over the saloon.

EDIT: Reading through comments I see someone else mentioned the 'inverse tardis'. Can't agree more, it is a genuine head scratcher when you go from the outside to the inside, like...how have they done this?

Edited by dimots on Thursday 7th December 15:12

[RDMcG]

dimots said:

I was initially convinced I would be buying a new Panamera Sport Turismo as soon as they became available, but once I actually saw it at the dealership it was a no from me. Good looking, nice interior, but huge and the deal-breaker...a tiny impractical boot.

I had imagined a useful four seat tourer with estate levels of space. It's not that at all. It's a reverse tardis with a very cramped rear and token estate styling. I was pretty disappointed.

A few years later and they did the same thing with the Taycan. I don't get it, there's barely any functional upgrade over the saloon.

EDIT: Reading through comments I see someone else mentioned the 'inverse tardis'. Can't agree more, it is a genuine head scratcher when you go from the outside to the inside, like...how have they done this?

Edited by dimots on Thursday 7th December 15:12

Absolutely the weak point which is why I also have a Cayenne. It is fine for a weekend for two, but not really a family hauler.
Before I bought it I actually asked my dealer of the height of the rear deck as I was not sure my Great Dane would find.
I suppose I should have bought a Dachshund. Still fun to drive.

[andyeds1234]

RDMcG said:

dimots said:

I was initially convinced I would be buying a new Panamera Sport Turismo as soon as they became available, but once I actually saw it at the dealership it was a no from me. Good looking, nice interior, but huge and the deal-breaker...a tiny impractical boot.

I had imagined a useful four seat tourer with estate levels of space. It's not that at all. It's a reverse tardis with a very cramped rear and token estate styling. I was pretty disappointed.

A few years later and they did the same thing with the Taycan. I don't get it, there's barely any functional upgrade over the saloon.

EDIT: Reading through comments I see someone else mentioned the 'inverse tardis'. Can't agree more, it is a genuine head scratcher when you go from the outside to the inside, like...how have they done this?

Edited by dimots on Thursday 7th December 15:12

Absolutely the weak point which is why I also have a Cayenne. It is fine for a weekend for two, but not really a family hauler.
Before I bought it I actually asked my dealer of the height of the rear deck as I was not sure my Great Dane would find.
I suppose I should have bought a Dachshund. Still fun to drive.

Spec a sunroof and a warm hat for the hound!

[dimots]

RDMcG said:

Absolutely the weak point which is why I also have a Cayenne. It is fine for a weekend for two, but not really a family hauler.
Before I bought it I actually asked my dealer of the height of the rear deck as I was not sure my Great Dane would find.
I suppose I should have bought a Dachshund. Still fun to drive.

Yes that's the thing, it's a great looking car and interesting, but I was looking for a direct replacement for a CLS Shooting Brake.

[Nick981]

Interesting comments about boot size. I bought one because I could fit a dog crate AND a few decent size bags in the back - looked at the Cayenne and the Macan and couldn’t do either with them - and I did try.
(also thought the variations of the Macan I tried - T, S and GTS were efficient but mind numbingly boring!)

[Terry Winks]

It's a shame the ST never got the opportunity to be married to that V8 Diesel that was in the earlier Panamera's. That would have been a mile munching monster.

[garypotter]

kenofkens said:

Why? Doesn't that picture make you go 'ahh yes that's why' it does me. I really want to go Clarkson on this car, i hate every part of this lardy overweight hideous people carrier. Imagine a 4 seater Countach or other iconic car. No. It deserves to go in the bin yesterday.

Agreed but that is why i want one!!