Discussion
IMI A said:
Wilmslowboy said:
?..
These things have been late teens (for good ones) for the best part of 20 years, so if (when) a price correction occurs I imagine this is the level they will drop back too.
These things have been late teens (for good ones) for the best part of 20 years, so if (when) a price correction occurs I imagine this is the level they will drop back too.
I very much doubt they will become cheaper my friend but here's hoping!
Try and find a really good G50 coupe... And then not in guards red or white which the lions share were.
The brutal fact is that the G50 is the best of the last of the best. I used to smoke around in the mid/late 90's in 915/G50's when the 996 hadn't even been invented. You could get a minter for £18k all day. That was the price for an A1 machine.
Now we have a benchmark to measure against it is clear that the G50 is the last of the original uncorrupted DNA. Some don't like the rawness of the machine. I happen to love it and being an epic luddite would never entertain PAS,traction or coil springs. Nothing wrong with that but not for me.
The 3.2 G50 with SE option and leather was circa £40k new in '89. IMPHO if a 25 year old 911 hasn't eclipsed its new price in a quarter of a century then it's a bargain.
They are not making anymore and most torsion bar 911's are tired rotted/welded up retrimmed abused machines with not the best history loads of owners who had it for a season and flogged it knowing it needed money spending.
They were undervalued and a good proper original machine is like rocking horse dung to locate.
Its rival the 308/328 GTS/B have leapt in price too.
I just bought a G50 3.2 in extremely original unmessed condition on its original paint and immaculate interior.
It wasn't cheap at all but you want the best you pay.
I see no crash for A1 stunning examples of any A/C metal. Never had any problems selling any of my 911's for profit and never will.
The one I have now is a keeper. Many owners think likewise as 1, you can't get good cars 2, better that money in the bank.
A targa 911S (restored) longbonnet RHD just made £180k at auction. Insane but it makes a G50 an utter bargain. The Carrera 3.0's are stupid money for what I think is an inferior car.
Just came back from the PCGB Brands Hatch bash in my 3.2 and it was an utter pleasure to drive. Supply does not equal demand thus prices can only go one way!
How much is a new 991 coupe?!! Most of it is made in Eastern Europe!!
I'll take the original concept ta very much!
Simples!
The brutal fact is that the G50 is the best of the last of the best. I used to smoke around in the mid/late 90's in 915/G50's when the 996 hadn't even been invented. You could get a minter for £18k all day. That was the price for an A1 machine.
Now we have a benchmark to measure against it is clear that the G50 is the last of the original uncorrupted DNA. Some don't like the rawness of the machine. I happen to love it and being an epic luddite would never entertain PAS,traction or coil springs. Nothing wrong with that but not for me.
The 3.2 G50 with SE option and leather was circa £40k new in '89. IMPHO if a 25 year old 911 hasn't eclipsed its new price in a quarter of a century then it's a bargain.
They are not making anymore and most torsion bar 911's are tired rotted/welded up retrimmed abused machines with not the best history loads of owners who had it for a season and flogged it knowing it needed money spending.
They were undervalued and a good proper original machine is like rocking horse dung to locate.
Its rival the 308/328 GTS/B have leapt in price too.
I just bought a G50 3.2 in extremely original unmessed condition on its original paint and immaculate interior.
It wasn't cheap at all but you want the best you pay.
I see no crash for A1 stunning examples of any A/C metal. Never had any problems selling any of my 911's for profit and never will.
The one I have now is a keeper. Many owners think likewise as 1, you can't get good cars 2, better that money in the bank.
A targa 911S (restored) longbonnet RHD just made £180k at auction. Insane but it makes a G50 an utter bargain. The Carrera 3.0's are stupid money for what I think is an inferior car.
Just came back from the PCGB Brands Hatch bash in my 3.2 and it was an utter pleasure to drive. Supply does not equal demand thus prices can only go one way!
How much is a new 991 coupe?!! Most of it is made in Eastern Europe!!
I'll take the original concept ta very much!
Simples!
Edited by P50 on Sunday 21st September 23:17
P50 said:
fact is that the G50 is the best of the last of the best.
Edited by P50 on Sunday 21st September 23:17
anonymous said:
[redacted]
Their white 3.2 had a 915 gearbox and I personally think a well maintained 915 is absolutely fine - a poor one is as you describe, As far as engine goes it should certainly have been stronger or at least equal to the 2.5/6 in your Boxster. Performance should also have felt similar albeit in the twists the Boxster has a far more capable/modern chassis. They're old cars now so to the average guy used to modern machinery they will feel agricultural. Acquired taste methinks but very rewarding if you stick at it. Like a gooey pongy french cheese versus an English cheddar for want of a better analogy!anonymous said:
[redacted]
There are no rights or wrongs here. Just personal choice. Now I know the long bonnet cars are hugely revered but they simply do not do it for me. They are too agricultural for my tastes. Heavy fuel consumption on primitive injection. The engines aren’t as bomb proof as the 3.2 which is a magnificent motor. I think the interiors on the early stuff are far too austere for my tastes too. They remind me of a Karmann Ghia! They are epic rot boxes and the odds of finding an original RHD car in factory un-abused condition is pretty much nil. I’m not a fan of restored cars. I shudder at the price of a low mileage long bonnet RHD S. Probably ¼ mil sterling.The G50 in comparison is a much more refined machine. How odd we describe it as raw but compared to a 996 or even a 993 then I concede that’s what it is! But it’s exactly what I want. It’s not a daily driver so it’s character is hugely appealing to me. I see it as a 1974 IB car that had 25 years of evolution to iron out the grotty bits!
As for not being rock solid then if a 3.2 cannot be deemed rock solid then I don’t know what is! I think if there was a nuclear war, alongside the cockroaches would be G50 Carreras going about their business!
To me they are the end of the line. They are all about the sheer joy of motoring. Man and machine. The whine of the fan. The handling. The sheer construction of the thing. The styling and the feeling that it will go on for ever and ever if maintained correctly.
Even at 50K for a good one they are value compared to other classic cars in the hundreds of thousands.
I think familiarity has bread contempt to some degree...
I love mine and couldn't be happier!
anonymous said:
[redacted]
You're right though I think you need a bit of time in a 3.2C before you can make an informed judgement as a few hours with a loaner probably isn't enough time. When I drive more modern cars like my 997 turbo, 991 Turbo S or when I occasionally drive my wife's GL63 I honestly do not like any of them impressive as they are - the older cars remind you what feel and precision really are. 944,968 and 928 all feel like much more modern GTs compared to the 80,90s 911sCmoose strikes me as not from the UK and also to be a fan of more refined cars....his choice of preferred drivers gives this away...and having owned or driven examples of everything he has listed, I feel that I can speak from a position of knowledge. Ergo, I believe he would enjoy a 993 but would still find a 964 a bit rough round the edges.
In terms of the choice between a nice 915 with short shift and grit free rods and a G50, I'd say they are both sweet and you should buy solely on condition. Even at £30k, these cars are still little more expensive than a specked up Golf...and I know what I'd rather have in my garage!
In terms of the choice between a nice 915 with short shift and grit free rods and a G50, I'd say they are both sweet and you should buy solely on condition. Even at £30k, these cars are still little more expensive than a specked up Golf...and I know what I'd rather have in my garage!
I'd agree with that - the pre-impact bumper 911s are probably seen as the true classics, but can see the big appeal of 3.2s, 964s and 993s. However, which is best is a personal choice.
Just saw this though - http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p...
- Wide-body, 915, Targa and nearly £70k
Prefer a narrow body, G50, Coupe any day.
Just saw this though - http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p...
- Wide-body, 915, Targa and nearly £70k
Prefer a narrow body, G50, Coupe any day. BobToc said:
I love my 3.2. I've never driven a modern Porsche and I worry a little bit that it might change my view.
I wouldn't worry too much, they are completely different. They are quick but completely dead compared to a 3.2, the 991 isn't just like driving an Audi but quicker.I came very close to being worried by a new Cayman, but then I got out of that back into the 3.2, and just no competition, the smell sound and sensations are just not there in the modern cars, and of course no depreciation, the perfect combination for a summer weekend car.
Would be nice to have modern ventilation and air con though, would also be nice to actually hear the radio from time to time.
P50 said:
Try and find a really good G50 coupe... And then not in guards red or white which the lions share were.
fully agree to that - I actually was looking for a good WHITE one for a year...and nothing came up! so much for a popular big number color apparentlyEdited by P50 on Sunday 21st September 23:17
old vs newer , of course the newer cars is going to be more refined, more grip , quicker etc etc
Everyone has their own opinion of what they want out of a daily driver or out of a toy ..... For me the only car that I've kept over all the years is my 1973 911. It's cost me an arm and a leg to keep in top condition and at times ownership can be frustrating, but there is nothing that thrills me more or that I've enjoyed more than a good seat of the pants drive through the Yorkshire dales
My modded 996 turbo was 'better' in so many ways, but ultimately just wasn't as much fun to drive ..... The same sort of applied to my CSL ,
Not driven anything newer than a 997, but even that felt like a quick Audi .
Porsche 968 ... Drove quite a few some years ago when I thought about buying one .... Did nothing for me and with hindsight I think an M3 is a better choice for no other reason than you get a better sound track
Everyone has their own opinion of what they want out of a daily driver or out of a toy ..... For me the only car that I've kept over all the years is my 1973 911. It's cost me an arm and a leg to keep in top condition and at times ownership can be frustrating, but there is nothing that thrills me more or that I've enjoyed more than a good seat of the pants drive through the Yorkshire dales
My modded 996 turbo was 'better' in so many ways, but ultimately just wasn't as much fun to drive ..... The same sort of applied to my CSL ,
Not driven anything newer than a 997, but even that felt like a quick Audi .
Porsche 968 ... Drove quite a few some years ago when I thought about buying one .... Did nothing for me and with hindsight I think an M3 is a better choice for no other reason than you get a better sound track
I liken late water cooled Porsches to disposible white goods.
They lack soul to drive and appear to be engineered poorly (IMS..) I concede the 991 GT3 and 997 gen 2 RS are magnificent but they are again a hard core beast.
However lets take two 1998 C4S's. One's a 993 and one's a 996.
The former appears to have a value of circa 50k plus depending on miles/condition etc. The 996 is worthwh at? mid teens?
So there you go. The 996 is not rated as an enthusiasts machine for the hard core type of owner...
The reason I acquired an old Porsche is because it feels alive and tactile. The newer stuff is much like any muted modern. OK for Mr Ordinary who craves refinement and all the other tat a new car comes with.
But not for me..
They lack soul to drive and appear to be engineered poorly (IMS..) I concede the 991 GT3 and 997 gen 2 RS are magnificent but they are again a hard core beast.
However lets take two 1998 C4S's. One's a 993 and one's a 996.
The former appears to have a value of circa 50k plus depending on miles/condition etc. The 996 is worthwh at? mid teens?
So there you go. The 996 is not rated as an enthusiasts machine for the hard core type of owner...
The reason I acquired an old Porsche is because it feels alive and tactile. The newer stuff is much like any muted modern. OK for Mr Ordinary who craves refinement and all the other tat a new car comes with.
But not for me..
Edited by P50 on Wednesday 24th September 11:42
anonymous said:
[redacted]
The 3.2 you mention has a terrible 915 box and isn't the nicest example to drive. However don't dismiss the 915 - these cars need to be bought on condition and a good 915 box is better than a poor G50 (I've owned both). I couldn't agree more with previous comments that you really more than a quick drive in a 3.2 to appreciate it. The SC's engine is a more revvy unit. I've only driven an early 1978 model (180hp) but it was lovely despite feeling quite slow compared to the 3.2. The 964 is a great compromise if you still find the 3.2 or SC too agricultural. 915 v G50 -- it could be a topic in it's own right !
1. The 915 is lighter.
2. The 915 even working well, needs time to change gear. It is a measured experience in which heel and toeing is a decided advantage and a well measured pleasure.
3. A bad 915 is horrid.
4. I have never driven a bad G50 car.
5. The G50 box is a faster change, will take immense torque, but it is heavier.
6. The last of the '73 911s had the 915 gearbox in favour of the dog-leg 1st 901 -- a big step up to a "conventional" gear-change
7. The last of the 3.2's got the G50 box -- for most, a big step up from the 915.
But if you want a light, tactile and involving gear-change -- a good 915 is still a lovely thing
And the top of the range early cars are truly delicate and delicious to drive fast ...
1. The 915 is lighter.
2. The 915 even working well, needs time to change gear. It is a measured experience in which heel and toeing is a decided advantage and a well measured pleasure.
3. A bad 915 is horrid.
4. I have never driven a bad G50 car.
5. The G50 box is a faster change, will take immense torque, but it is heavier.
6. The last of the '73 911s had the 915 gearbox in favour of the dog-leg 1st 901 -- a big step up to a "conventional" gear-change
7. The last of the 3.2's got the G50 box -- for most, a big step up from the 915.
But if you want a light, tactile and involving gear-change -- a good 915 is still a lovely thing
And the top of the range early cars are truly delicate and delicious to drive fast ...
I love my g50 sport, it's such a rewarding car to drive and takes time to be able to drive it quickly. I always feel that at high speetds I'm constantly having to manage the car, all inputs have to be considered to get the most out of the car, but it's worth it. I love driving it, it's so easy to live with in day to day conditions, the light clutch and excellent g50 transmission make town driving a breeze. It's also quite a small car so negotiating small villages is no hassle, my brother's 360 feels like a leviathan in comparison. Having a decent tyre wall is very handy as well. Mine is a 37000 mile example and is very sorted, so it does feel quick, it's easly as fast as the focus st four pot in terms of acceleration, but it needs revs. The bosch fuel injection isn't the most sophisticated, and would benefit from a remap. It has got to the point though where my relatively cheap 911 has become, for me a very expensive 911. I could sell it now and wouldn't have this amazing car, but what else would I buy? This is the car I have always lusted after, so replacing it would be hard. I love Caterhams and could afford a r500 and get change. It's a difficult decision but the change in value has stopped some of the enjoyment of driving, I never wanted a garage queen, but it is becoming that.
glosaircool said:
I love my g50 sport, it's such a rewarding car to drive and takes time to be able to drive it quickly. I always feel that at high speetds I'm constantly having to manage the car, all inputs have to be considered to get the most out of the car, but it's worth it. I love driving it, it's so easy to live with in day to day conditions, the light clutch and excellent g50 transmission make town driving a breeze. It's also quite a small car so negotiating small villages is no hassle, my brother's 360 feels like a leviathan in comparison. Having a decent tyre wall is very handy as well. Mine is a 37000 mile example and is very sorted, so it does feel quick, it's easly as fast as the focus st four pot in terms of acceleration, but it needs revs. The bosch fuel injection isn't the most sophisticated, and would benefit from a remap. It has got to the point though where my relatively cheap 911 has become, for me a very expensive 911. I could sell it now and wouldn't have this amazing car, but what else would I buy? This is the car I have always lusted after, so replacing it would be hard. I love Caterhams and could afford a r500 and get change. It's a difficult decision but the change in value has stopped some of the enjoyment of driving, I never wanted a garage queen, but it is becoming that.
Good post.Go down the GT3 route a good compromise and you'll wonder why you have wasted so much time with a 3.2, much as I like them.
Alternatively get a good 996 Turbo and get a good remap exhaust etc and the suspension sorted and you'll have an epic useable supercar.
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