More hype and plain silliness

More hype and plain silliness

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Discussion

IMI A

9,410 posts

200 months

Thursday 23rd October 2014
quotequote all
James B said:
I think this thread adequately demonstrates that the market for aircooled IB cars is reasonably wild at the moment!

In my garage I have a '77 911 Carrera 3.0 Sport Targa (not the easiest of names to get out!!) that my grandfather bought new for my grandmother. Its completely original spec and looks-wise and has covered 39k miles with FPSH but I did get the engine rebuilt last year as it was infuriatingly leaky and had the box done at the same time.

The car is under used these days only getting 500 or so miles per annum so seeing the way the IB cars prices are I'm interested to see what the market would pay. I was offered £35k for it by someone who spotted it at the place it went for the rebuild.





I'm still not sure I could bring myself to let the car go as its been in the family so long but if there are crazy people throwing money at IB cars like the examples earlier in the thread then I may chance my arm! haha!
hold on to it for a few more years and I think you might see really silly prices. Good cars like that with low mileage ultra rare. In todays market I think you'd get £40k - £50k for that

IMI A

9,410 posts

200 months

Saturday 25th October 2014
quotequote all
IMI A said:
Wozy68 said:
IMI A said:
Err Indoors said:
Just ridiculous going to be some serious shirt losing, anybody who would buy a 3.2 for 80k is just plain stupid, and there's nothing more dangerous than a fool with money.
Good luck to them i'll put my mortgage on a serious implosion very soon.
You said that when they were changing hands for £30k smile

I'd pay £50k for this day night long. http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p... In fact if there were 10 in this condition I'd buy them all and tuck them away.

Edited by IMI A on Saturday 11th October 10:00
At 75K its price is 3x the value of my 993, at 50K that 3.2 would still cost nearly double what my 993 manual C2 is worth.
Compared to my 993, they have in common that they both have full OPC history, Certificate of Authenticity and low ownership. What they don't share is mileage, mines over double of this 3.2. I can see the condition will be better on the 3.2, but it can't be 2 or 3x better.

Is a 3.2 really worth two or three times the price of a 993? I've owned both, and IMO not a chance. I really do think this is madness, well either that or the 993 is seriously under priced.

Edited by Wozy68 on Monday 13th October 10:50
A low mileage concourse 993 C2 is now easily worth £50k day night long. You can't compare your car with a low mileage concourse car in amy meaningful way as your coparing apples with oranges. Concourse does not mean its in v.good condition. It generally means the car is in better than new condition. There aren't many concourse used cars for sale.
I went to see this car today http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p...

Its a lovely honest car but certainly not concourse in my book - God knows when it was last winning concourse events but I'd be v.surprised if it was recently. Forget £74,995 even £50,000 would be top top money for it in my book. Having said that as good cars are getting scarce I'd still buy it for £50,000 but not a penny more. Its certainly no better than the 3.2C I have and in some ways less desirable as it has no sports seats, no short shift, and personally I think black is a better colour but thats just personal preference. For an allegedly concourse car the quality of the paint wasn't brilliant IMO but maybe detail would sort it out. Its had a bit of paint here and there too and some odd small nicks and scratches for an allegedly concourse winning car.

griffter

3,981 posts

254 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
quotequote all
Frio3535 said:
I haven't viewed the car in person but the flachbau turbo at the supercar rooms looks better value week after week.
I've been watching that for a while - purely out of interest. It dropped to £45k a week or two ago and then quickly bounced back up to £50k.

If it was a factory flatnose car it would be twice the price. As it is it seems to be the next best thing. Converted in period, using factory parts by a reputable workshop/race team.

Can it really be worth 'only' half what a factory car would? (Apparently yes because I believe it's been on sale for at least 6 months).

It needs a bit of a tidy up, and (another thread on rennlist or somewhere suggests) there's a big hole in the history. But if it was standard would it have sold by now?

http://www.thesupercarrooms.co.uk/car-details/pors...

Koln-RS

3,848 posts

211 months

Sunday 26th October 2014
quotequote all
Fugly Porsche IMO.

This is interesting - late G50 3.2 Carrera for £10k eek

OK, it's a Targa (but they're not that bad), mileage is highish (but less than 6k pa), but just goes to show how much of a stigma Cat C can be.

Must be worth that for the parts - http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p...

Steve Devaney

714 posts

201 months

Wednesday 29th October 2014
quotequote all
In my opinion, its all gone a very big bit silly.
A good condition, average mileage 3.2, 964, 993 is worth £20-£30k and most honest people would agree.
Anyone looking to pay double this will get their fingers burned when the market finds its true level, which it undoubtedly will.

david hockney

1,198 posts

152 months

Wednesday 29th October 2014
quotequote all
The problem is hardly anyone with a good condition average mileage 3.2, 964, 993 is selling for 20 to 30k-
supply and demand !

Wozy68

5,387 posts

169 months

Wednesday 29th October 2014
quotequote all
IMI A said:
IMI A said:
Wozy68 said:
IMI A said:
Err Indoors said:
Just ridiculous going to be some serious shirt losing, anybody who would buy a 3.2 for 80k is just plain stupid, and there's nothing more dangerous than a fool with money.
Good luck to them i'll put my mortgage on a serious implosion very soon.
You said that when they were changing hands for £30k smile

I'd pay £50k for this day night long. http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p... In fact if there were 10 in this condition I'd buy them all and tuck them away.

Edited by IMI A on Saturday 11th October 10:00
At 75K its price is 3x the value of my 993, at 50K that 3.2 would still cost nearly double what my 993 manual C2 is worth.
Compared to my 993, they have in common that they both have full OPC history, Certificate of Authenticity and low ownership. What they don't share is mileage, mines over double of this 3.2. I can see the condition will be better on the 3.2, but it can't be 2 or 3x better.

Is a 3.2 really worth two or three times the price of a 993? I've owned both, and IMO not a chance. I really do think this is madness, well either that or the 993 is seriously under priced.

Edited by Wozy68 on Monday 13th October 10:50
A low mileage concourse 993 C2 is now easily worth £50k day night long. You can't compare your car with a low mileage concourse car in amy meaningful way as your coparing apples with oranges. Concourse does not mean its in v.good condition. It generally means the car is in better than new condition. There aren't many concourse used cars for sale.
I went to see this car today http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p...

Its a lovely honest car but certainly not concourse in my book - God knows when it was last winning concourse events but I'd be v.surprised if it was recently. Forget £74,995 even £50,000 would be top top money for it in my book. Having said that as good cars are getting scarce I'd still buy it for £50,000 but not a penny more. Its certainly no better than the 3.2C I have and in some ways less desirable as it has no sports seats, no short shift, and personally I think black is a better colour but thats just personal preference. For an allegedly concourse car the quality of the paint wasn't brilliant IMO but maybe detail would sort it out. Its had a bit of paint here and there too and some odd small nicks and scratches for an allegedly concourse winning car.
It was the mileage that made me think it probs wasn't quite as good as it seemed, No actual description of work involved to make it concourse (with the stated mileage) surprised me, hence my comment.
I wasn't trying to compare it to my 993...... indeed at that price it really would be (or is that should be) comparing apples and oranges.

g7jhp

6,958 posts

237 months

Thursday 30th October 2014
quotequote all
Wozy68 said:
It was the mileage that made me think it probs wasn't quite as good as it seemed, No actual description of work involved to make it concourse (with the stated mileage) surprised me, hence my comment.
I wasn't trying to compare it to my 993...... indeed at that price it really would be (or is that should be) comparing apples and oranges.
Not sure you need a description, you should be able to see by the condition and it should be backed up by the service history and bills.

The overall car bubble will burst when economic conditions change and these as well as other marques will find a more realistic price.

Good cars will always command a premium over average ones, but not necessarily at such lofty prices.

IMI A

9,410 posts

200 months

Thursday 30th October 2014
quotequote all
g7jhp said:
Wozy68 said:
It was the mileage that made me think it probs wasn't quite as good as it seemed, No actual description of work involved to make it concourse (with the stated mileage) surprised me, hence my comment.
I wasn't trying to compare it to my 993...... indeed at that price it really would be (or is that should be) comparing apples and oranges.
Not sure you need a description, you should be able to see by the condition and it should be backed up by the service history and bills.

The overall car bubble will burst when economic conditions change and these as well as other marques will find a more realistic price.

Good cars will always command a premium over average ones, but not necessarily at such lofty prices.
Lovetts say the car has won many concourse events hence Wozy correct that they should say when and which events it won as the car is certainly not concourse now. Do not get me wrong their 3.2C is stunning but even at £50k someone would be overpaying IMO even in current market. It will still be there in a year but doubt they care its such a lovely thing to look at parked amongst all those Fezzas.

g7jhp

6,958 posts

237 months

Thursday 30th October 2014
quotequote all
IMI A said:
g7jhp said:
Wozy68 said:
It was the mileage that made me think it probs wasn't quite as good as it seemed, No actual description of work involved to make it concourse (with the stated mileage) surprised me, hence my comment.
I wasn't trying to compare it to my 993...... indeed at that price it really would be (or is that should be) comparing apples and oranges.
Not sure you need a description, you should be able to see by the condition and it should be backed up by the service history and bills.

The overall car bubble will burst when economic conditions change and these as well as other marques will find a more realistic price.

Good cars will always command a premium over average ones, but not necessarily at such lofty prices.
Lovetts say the car has won many concourse events hence Wozy correct that they should say when and which events it won as the car is certainly not concourse now. Do not get me wrong their 3.2C is stunning but even at £50k someone would be overpaying IMO even in current market. It will still be there in a year but doubt they care its such a lovely thing to look at parked amongst all those Fezzas.
I'm also sure this car was in the PH classifieds for circa £35k a month or so ago, so it just shows that independents/OPCs are prepared to hike the price and sit on them until they sell.


IMI A

9,410 posts

200 months

Thursday 30th October 2014
quotequote all
g7jhp said:
IMI A said:
g7jhp said:
Wozy68 said:
It was the mileage that made me think it probs wasn't quite as good as it seemed, No actual description of work involved to make it concourse (with the stated mileage) surprised me, hence my comment.
I wasn't trying to compare it to my 993...... indeed at that price it really would be (or is that should be) comparing apples and oranges.
Not sure you need a description, you should be able to see by the condition and it should be backed up by the service history and bills.

The overall car bubble will burst when economic conditions change and these as well as other marques will find a more realistic price.

Good cars will always command a premium over average ones, but not necessarily at such lofty prices.
Lovetts say the car has won many concourse events hence Wozy correct that they should say when and which events it won as the car is certainly not concourse now. Do not get me wrong their 3.2C is stunning but even at £50k someone would be overpaying IMO even in current market. It will still be there in a year but doubt they care its such a lovely thing to look at parked amongst all those Fezzas.
I'm also sure this car was in the PH classifieds for circa £35k a month or so ago, so it just shows that independents/OPCs are prepared to hike the price and sit on them until they sell.
there was one with similar mileage for sale privately at £54,000. Pics had all the trophies it had won on bonnet in the advert - not sure if its the same car but may well be.

g7jhp

6,958 posts

237 months

Thursday 30th October 2014
quotequote all
IMI A said:
g7jhp said:
IMI A said:
g7jhp said:
Wozy68 said:
It was the mileage that made me think it probs wasn't quite as good as it seemed, No actual description of work involved to make it concourse (with the stated mileage) surprised me, hence my comment.
I wasn't trying to compare it to my 993...... indeed at that price it really would be (or is that should be) comparing apples and oranges.
Not sure you need a description, you should be able to see by the condition and it should be backed up by the service history and bills.

The overall car bubble will burst when economic conditions change and these as well as other marques will find a more realistic price.

Good cars will always command a premium over average ones, but not necessarily at such lofty prices.
Lovetts say the car has won many concourse events hence Wozy correct that they should say when and which events it won as the car is certainly not concourse now. Do not get me wrong their 3.2C is stunning but even at £50k someone would be overpaying IMO even in current market. It will still be there in a year but doubt they care its such a lovely thing to look at parked amongst all those Fezzas.
I'm also sure this car was in the PH classifieds for circa £35k a month or so ago, so it just shows that independents/OPCs are prepared to hike the price and sit on them until they sell.
there was one with similar mileage for sale privately at £54,000. Pics had all the trophies it had won on bonnet in the advert - not sure if its the same car but may well be.
Yes it may well have been £54k. smile

P50

Original Poster:

1,029 posts

162 months

Thursday 30th October 2014
quotequote all
david hockney said:
The problem is hardly anyone with a good condition average mileage 3.2, 964, 993 is selling for 20 to 30k-
supply and demand !
Totally agree.

I was holding the folding for at least a year to get into a proper A1 G50 coupe.

The really good stuff is simply not coming up. Sellers market bubble or not.

When I picked mine up the seller offered me a number of a desperate chap who would give me a meaty profit on mine.

I didn't buy it to flip so declined. I bought it to keep.

So if everyone who owns a corker is on my wavelength you do the math...

Err Indoors

909 posts

186 months

Thursday 30th October 2014
quotequote all
Whats the story on this then?

Must be well over priced??

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/p...

Mind you couldn't live with that dash board

Scooty100

1,469 posts

115 months

Thursday 30th October 2014
quotequote all

Err Indoors

909 posts

186 months

Thursday 30th October 2014
quotequote all
Scooty100 said:
There's only one thing worse than an idiot.

An idiot with money.

Madness

dugsud

1,125 posts

262 months

Friday 31st October 2014
quotequote all
Scooty100 said:
Almost looks like a new car that.....crazy money though!

IMI A

9,410 posts

200 months

Friday 31st October 2014
quotequote all
dugsud said:
Scooty100 said:
Almost looks like a new car that.....crazy money though!
As others have said the finishing and quality of the leather on the seats look awful.

brembo

31 posts

166 months

Friday 31st October 2014
quotequote all
IMI A said:
dugsud said:
Scooty100 said:
Almost looks like a new car that.....crazy money though!
As others have said the finishing and quality of the leather on the seats look awful.
Restoration thread here - http://www.ddk-online.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=2...
Carried out to a very high standard,imho.
Regards,
Dougie.

IMI A

9,410 posts

200 months

Friday 31st October 2014
quotequote all
brembo said:
IMI A said:
dugsud said:
Scooty100 said:
Almost looks like a new car that.....crazy money though!
As others have said the finishing and quality of the leather on the seats look awful.
Restoration thread here - http://www.ddk-online.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?f=2...
Carried out to a very high standard,imho.
Regards,
Dougie.
I've seen this thread. Still stand by my comments re poor finishing on seats.