Why have 964's grown in popularity?
Discussion
Magna said:
You could pick up a really nice c2/c4 manual with 80k+ miles for £15k back in 2009/2010. Now that same car is going to be £30k+
Still not impossible to them for £15k if you dont mind a tip cab with high miles on original engine but you may still have to spend another £5-£10k sorting out issues in the future if you want a rust free, non leaking engine car.
Thank you for the help. I'll have a budget of approx £15k so hoping to find one for around that. I don't mind spending a little less and taking it in for maintenance after so long because I want to keep it for a very long time. There's a 964 cab on eBay right now which looks very nice, cat C unfortunately, though. Still not impossible to them for £15k if you dont mind a tip cab with high miles on original engine but you may still have to spend another £5-£10k sorting out issues in the future if you want a rust free, non leaking engine car.
Have prices really increased significantly in the last 4/5 years? Anything £30k + should have had some money spent on it -engine rebuild, maybe some interior and paint etc. When added to the £15k prices in 2010, what is the actual level of appreciation when you account for cost of maintenance-less than the £15k that you would assume purely looking at advertised prices.
SidewaysSi said:
Have prices really increased significantly in the last 4/5 years? Anything £30k + should have had some money spent on it -engine rebuild, maybe some interior and paint etc. When added to the £15k prices in 2010, what is the actual level of appreciation when you account for cost of maintenance-less than the £15k that you would assume purely looking at advertised prices.
It depends which way you want to look at it. Man maths and all that.If someone has spent 15k on maintenance on a car and then recoups that at resale, are you saying that this isnt amazing?
Ive just spent a not inconsiderable amount of money on my 993, and the thing that tipped my decision making process was that I will probably get it back.
Whats not to like?
mollytherocker said:
SidewaysSi said:
Have prices really increased significantly in the last 4/5 years? Anything £30k + should have had some money spent on it -engine rebuild, maybe some interior and paint etc. When added to the £15k prices in 2010, what is the actual level of appreciation when you account for cost of maintenance-less than the £15k that you would assume purely looking at advertised prices.
It depends which way you want to look at it. Man maths and all that.If someone has spent 15k on maintenance on a car and then recoups that at resale, are you saying that this isnt amazing?
Ive just spent a not inconsiderable amount of money on my 993, and the thing that tipped my decision making process was that I will probably get it back.
Whats not to like?
SidewaysSi said:
Absolutely agree. But in this flurry of rising prices, it does seem that those who buy now are not necessarily worse off than if they bought 5 years ago. I was just saying that the £30k cars have had a lot of work in most cases which ain't cheap.
They are expensive cars to maintain in reality. Unless you are very good a flipping cars, most are not truly investments.The point is that my 993 has a far lower ownership cost than my diesel Insignia. If thats not a win, I dont know what is.
mollytherocker said:
SidewaysSi said:
Absolutely agree. But in this flurry of rising prices, it does seem that those who buy now are not necessarily worse off than if they bought 5 years ago. I was just saying that the £30k cars have had a lot of work in most cases which ain't cheap.
They are expensive cars to maintain in reality. Unless you are very good a flipping cars, most are not truly investments.The point is that my 993 has a far lower ownership cost than my diesel Insignia. If thats not a win, I dont know what is.
As you say, a good position to be in but a different story in reality to when one is purely looking at sticker prices.
PSame people never see the lineage from 993 to 996 mind you.
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Must admit I'm one of them. To me they are so far apart in terms of looks and feel they could almost be made by different manufacturers. OK I suppose if I really concentrate I can just about make out the lineage.
As for the 964 / 993 comparsons well I love both types. Looks wise the 964 has nice front wings however the 993s arse is the prettiest of them all IMO.
[/quote]
Must admit I'm one of them. To me they are so far apart in terms of looks and feel they could almost be made by different manufacturers. OK I suppose if I really concentrate I can just about make out the lineage.
As for the 964 / 993 comparsons well I love both types. Looks wise the 964 has nice front wings however the 993s arse is the prettiest of them all IMO.
Lucas1997 said:
Thank you for the help. I'll have a budget of approx £15k so hoping to find one for around that. I don't mind spending a little less and taking it in for maintenance after so long because I want to keep it for a very long time. There's a 964 cab on eBay right now which looks very nice, cat C unfortunately, though.
C4 coupe on ebay for you:http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Porsche-911-964-Garage-F...
boxsey said:
Not exactly cheap. Bidding currently at £16.6k for a car with 120k on the clock that hasn't moved in 8 years.Factor in at least 3k (ideally £6k+) for some new tyres, major service minimum preferable engine refresh. Then you will probably want to overhaul the suspension etc. Actually you're probably not going to end up far off £30k all in.
boxsey said:
Thank you! There's a 964 targa on ebay right now, £13,750 but it's a cat c with a very high mileage (180,000 or so) he says it will come with a brand new MOT, though. After a year or less Id take it for a full engine rebuild, clean up, service which Id estimate at around £8k? Is this particular car worth it? If this is in the wrong section apologies, a bit new to this forum.
Lucas1997 said:
Thank you! There's a 964 targa on ebay right now, £13,750 but it's a cat c with a very high mileage (180,000 or so) he says it will come with a brand new MOT, though. After a year or less Id take it for a full engine rebuild, clean up, service which Id estimate at around £8k? Is this particular car worth it?
If this is in the wrong section apologies, a bit new to this forum.
Has the car been regularly maintained, engine rebuilt in the past? Does the owner have details on how is became a Cat C? most will shy away from Cat cars but and it's a Big BUT if you have photos of the damage and it was repaired properly then it could be a good buy at that price. However if its going to need £8k of work in 12 months time then find some extra cash and buy a sorted one for £30k if you can.If this is in the wrong section apologies, a bit new to this forum.
Magna said:
boxsey said:
Not exactly cheap. Bidding currently at £16.6k for a car with 120k on the clock that hasn't moved in 8 years.Factor in at least 3k (ideally £6k+) for some new tyres, major service minimum preferable engine refresh. Then you will probably want to overhaul the suspension etc. Actually you're probably not going to end up far off £30k all in.
Lucas1997 said:
Thank you! There's a 964 targa on ebay right now, £13,750 but it's a cat c with a very high mileage (180,000 or so) he says it will come with a brand new MOT, though. After a year or less Id take it for a full engine rebuild, clean up, service which Id estimate at around £8k? Is this particular car worth it?
If this is in the wrong section apologies, a bit new to this forum.
Too much money for a cat C targa in my opinion, considering that should be able to get a good straight one for less than £20K.If this is in the wrong section apologies, a bit new to this forum.
boxsey said:
Lucas1997 said:
Thank you! There's a 964 targa on ebay right now, £13,750 but it's a cat c with a very high mileage (180,000 or so) he says it will come with a brand new MOT, though. After a year or less Id take it for a full engine rebuild, clean up, service which Id estimate at around £8k? Is this particular car worth it?
If this is in the wrong section apologies, a bit new to this forum.
Too much money for a cat C targa in my opinion, considering that should be able to get a good straight one for less than £20K.If this is in the wrong section apologies, a bit new to this forum.
Though, Peter did tell me that in his opinion I'd 'nicked it'.
boxsey said:
I'm watching it to see how much it will go for. There have been a lot of bids so far. With the popularity of the 964 at the moment I'm expecting it to be close to £20K by the time it finishes. If bought as a project someone can take their time and spread the cost. There's no need to jump into an engine refresh straight away. A careful recommission before firing up for the first time shouldn't cost much more than a thousand. Brakes will likely need freeing up and refreshing plus new fluid. Add the tyres and the total should be less than £3K. Suspension and other stuff can then be done later on.
Love the way this is positioned as a 'Garage find' anyone else would have classed it as an unloved 964.The bidding is currently £16,666 for a red C4 coupe with 118 miles on the clock. If it's been sitting for 8 years I suspect it'll have a fair few niggles to sort even before you think about longer term engine rebuilds. Having to tow it away would set alarm bells ringing!
The majority would be better looking at something like this!
g7jhp said:
The majority would be better looking at something like this!
Thing is, you do not know that is a better car do you? Have you inspected both? That one might be rotten, he certainly mentions rust.Thats the thing with old cars, until you really assess what you have in front of you, its all guesswork.
What we can be certain of is that both cars probably need work. The question is, what exactly!
g7jhp said:
Love the way this is positioned as a 'Garage find' anyone else would have classed it as an unloved 964.
The bidding is currently £16,666 for a red C4 coupe with 118 miles on the clock. If it's been sitting for 8 years I suspect it'll have a fair few niggles to sort even before you think about longer term engine rebuilds. Having to tow it away would set alarm bells ringing!
The majority would be better looking at something like this!
They all have niggles even when they're not sitting for ages! The bidding is currently £16,666 for a red C4 coupe with 118 miles on the clock. If it's been sitting for 8 years I suspect it'll have a fair few niggles to sort even before you think about longer term engine rebuilds. Having to tow it away would set alarm bells ringing!
The majority would be better looking at something like this!
Good spot on the white one. Does look cheap compared to most that go up for sale these days. At least the seller is honest about that interior needing some attention.
g7jhp said:
The bidding is currently £16,666 for a red C4 coupe with 118 miles on the clock. If it's been sitting for 8 years I suspect it'll have a fair few niggles to sort even before you think about longer term engine rebuilds.
Its perfect for someone who wants to do a 'Singer', which is the sort of person who will have it. Some odd thinking here to try and deny the fact the value of good aircooled 911s has increased by a factor of 2 or 3 in the last decade and there's very little sign of the 'correction' that some predict. I suspect if the OP really wants a 964 he'll have to treat his budget as a deposit and finance the balance needed to buy a good car.
As a wise man once said to me; "There's no such thing as a cheap Porsche*'.
SS7
*There is; buy a good 924 or 944
mollytherocker said:
g7jhp said:
The majority would be better looking at something like this!
Thing is, you do not know that is a better car do you? Have you inspected both? That one might be rotten, he certainly mentions rust.Thats the thing with old cars, until you really assess what you have in front of you, its all guesswork.
What we can be certain of is that both cars probably need work. The question is, what exactly!
boxsey said:
Magna said:
boxsey said:
Not exactly cheap. Bidding currently at £16.6k for a car with 120k on the clock that hasn't moved in 8 years.Factor in at least 3k (ideally £6k+) for some new tyres, major service minimum preferable engine refresh. Then you will probably want to overhaul the suspension etc. Actually you're probably not going to end up far off £30k all in.
With my dodgy lamps it looks like it ran out 08/06.
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