Tuthill 911K

[Slippydiff]

Yellow491 said:

Kind of
Short stroke engines had there troubles and vibrations to.

More carbon than steel

What did the short stroke ST motors rev to Paul ? 8K rpm ?

[993rsr]

Slippydiff said:

993rsr said:

I think comparing Swindon Powertrains to Cosworth is a bit of a stretch under the 'Mighty oaks' line.

My point was, a small, unknown company in the Porsche sphere, developing a 911 engine that revs to 11k RPM reliably with excellent drivability that will naturally be expected at the price, is a challenge.

I don't think you can dispute that.

I wasn’t comparing them JC, I merely stated that even the most highly regarded automotive consultancy businesses such as Cosworth, Ricardo etc, came from incredibly humble and small roots.
And I don’t think you can dispute that.

Coming from humble beginnings is one thing, however delivering on such a significant and high profile project for SP, based on their lack of experience with the 911 motors, and what the deliverables are, it's certainly a left field choice.

[marine boy]

Had a look at Tuthill's launch car, very clean, was really impressed with the weight

Think the Singer weighs in at least 200kgs heavier than the 911K

[thegreenhell]

No Porsche content shown here, but Jonny Smith made a video about Swindon Powertrains, if you want to see more about who they are and what they can do.

[Filibuster]

I really am astonished at the negativity here …

This is an epic build by one of the very best outfit in the business. I’m not an engineer myself, but I trust that Tuthill know what they are doing and who they go to for this task.
Then the owner, a fellow PHer, starts a thread about the build of his car and the thread turns into a sleuthing about wether the engine builder is up to the task without any real evidence other than they are not Cosworth…..

Come on chaps, I want to see more about this fantastic car!!! With people bashing his car, Andrew might loose interest in posting about the build.

[Yellow491]

Slippydiff said:

Yellow491 said:

Kind of
Short stroke engines had there troubles and vibrations to.

More carbon than steel

What did the short stroke ST motors rev to Paul ? 8K rpm ?

My 906 engine built in the usa ,shift was at 8200,the 901 shop build some great engines,i believe some rev to 9 and 10k,but the are not 4 cam etc.The vibration in the engines was a real issue especially with fly wheels flying off on the short strokers.

I dont think any one is knocking this great project,tutts are a great company and i hope andrew puts more info up,healthy critique is always to be expected on here

[isaldiri]

Filibuster said:

I really am astonished at the negativity here …

This is an epic build by one of the very best outfit in the business. I’m not an engineer myself, but I trust that Tuthill know what they are doing and who they go to for this task.
Then the owner, a fellow PHer, starts a thread about the build of his car and the thread turns into a sleuthing about wether the engine builder is up to the task without any real evidence other than they are not Cosworth…..

Come on chaps, I want to see more about this fantastic car!!! With people bashing his car, Andrew might loose interest in posting about the build.

Do you think people are only supposed to be uniformly singing the praises of something like this then such that the OP wouldn't lose interest posting about his car....?

Noting that the engine does have some pretty punchy deliverables without a solid track record by the engine builder imo anyway certainly isn't a case of people being negative or bashing the car.

[993rsr]

isaldiri said:

Filibuster said:

I really am astonished at the negativity here …

This is an epic build by one of the very best outfit in the business. I’m not an engineer myself, but I trust that Tuthill know what they are doing and who they go to for this task.
Then the owner, a fellow PHer, starts a thread about the build of his car and the thread turns into a sleuthing about wether the engine builder is up to the task without any real evidence other than they are not Cosworth…..

Come on chaps, I want to see more about this fantastic car!!! With people bashing his car, Andrew might loose interest in posting about the build.

Do you think people are only supposed to be uniformly singing the praises of something like this then such that the OP wouldn't lose interest posting about his car....?

Noting that the engine does have some pretty punchy deliverables without a solid track record by the engine builder imo anyway certainly isn't a case of people being negative or bashing the car.

Quite.

And Andrew's skin is thicker than an elderly rhino's gluteus maximus.

[993rsr]

Taffy66 said:

Perhaps Andrew D will kindly oblige ?

He'll oblige most things after a couple of Negroni's.

[Filibuster]

isaldiri said:

Filibuster said:

I really am astonished at the negativity here …

This is an epic build by one of the very best outfit in the business. I’m not an engineer myself, but I trust that Tuthill know what they are doing and who they go to for this task.
Then the owner, a fellow PHer, starts a thread about the build of his car and the thread turns into a sleuthing about wether the engine builder is up to the task without any real evidence other than they are not Cosworth…..

Come on chaps, I want to see more about this fantastic car!!! With people bashing his car, Andrew might loose interest in posting about the build.

Do you think people are only supposed to be uniformly singing the praises of something like this then such that the OP wouldn't lose interest posting about his car....?

Noting that the engine does have some pretty punchy deliverables without a solid track record by the engine builder imo anyway certainly isn't a case of people being negative or bashing the car.

Considering that the engine builder in question in fact has a very solid track record, as well as Tuthill, I think there is simply no substance in the questions that arose.
As a summary, Tuthill works together with a engine builder that has been around for 50 years and has experience in F1 and BTCC. According to their website, they developed and manufactured the cylinder head for the BMW/Mini JCW.

Building an aircooled flat-6 that revs to 11k rpm sure is a challenge, but I'd feel pretty confident if this was done by Tuthill and Swindon. Certain comments above implicated that the engine would be developed and built by a spanner monkey in the garage of his mother.

[993rsr]

Filibuster said:

Building an aircooled flat-6 that revs to 11k rpm sure is a challenge, but I'd feel pretty confident if this was done by Tuthill and Swindon. Certain comments above implicated that the engine would be developed and built by a spanner monkey in the garage of his mother.

Nothing of the sort. The very fact that you use the word 'challenge' echo the other comments. No one is saying that SP are 'a spanner monkey in the garage of this mother', however they are breaking new ground in creating a 911 engine that revs to 11k RPM, and are a left field choice.

[Filibuster]

993rsr said:

Nothing of the sort. The very fact that you use the word 'challenge' echo the other comments. No one is saying that SP are 'a spanner monkey in the garage of this mother', however they are breaking new ground in creating a 911 engine that revs to 11k RPM, and are a left field choice.

I think you made your point very clear now. Me on the other hand pointed out that Tuthill and Swindon are no fools and certainly now what they do.
With projects like this, there is always an amount of uncertainty, but why stating over and over that how difficult this is and how Swindon (again: a company that was chosen by Tuthill, is around for 50 years and has in depth racing experience) apparently lack former experience with Porsche?

Lets say we agree on it being a challenge and lets watch this thread with great interest.
I can't wait for the first video of this

[993rsr]

Filibuster said:

993rsr said:

Nothing of the sort. The very fact that you use the word 'challenge' echo the other comments. No one is saying that SP are 'a spanner monkey in the garage of this mother', however they are breaking new ground in creating a 911 engine that revs to 11k RPM, and are a left field choice.

I think you made your point very clear now. Me on the other hand pointed out that Tuthill and Swindon are no fools and certainly now what they do.
With projects like this, there is always an amount of uncertainty, but why stating over and over that how difficult this is and how Swindon (again: a company that was chosen by Tuthill, is around for 50 years and has in depth racing experience) apparently lack former experience with Porsche?

Lets say we agree on it being a challenge and lets watch this thread with great interest.
I can't wait for the first video of this

I think you have made your point clear now.

SP may have been around for 50 years and have in depth racing experience - they also make EV powertrains - but what they have not done is build a Porsche engine that revs to 11k RPM - in fact no-one has, not even the well regarded companies operating in that sphere.

You agree it's a challenge, it certainly is, however I'm sure we also agree that the fortunate owners have an exciting and unique project which will be fantastic to see unfold.

[braddo]

Does anyone know why Tuthill have gone with a 11k rpm limit?

For example was it a specific target and if so why (for headlines / kudos, or sound etc)? Or perhaps the engine testing was so successful that it was discovered that it could cope with a far higher redline than originally planned?

I totally get the appeal of 9k rpm but beyond that I'm less sure of the point. A stratospheric redline also makes gearing a little tricky for balancing the fun stuff with the long distance stuff (the latter often being necessary to get to the former!).

[Filibuster]

This is the only video I have found of the car with the engine running:

https://www.tiktok.com/@tuthill_porsche/video/7161...

sounds mighty

ETA an other clip!

https://www.tiktok.com/@colleen365gtb4c/video/7137...

[TDT]

Had anybody questioned why GMA has gone with 12k rpm or AM with the Valkyrie?

Why? Because they want to. It’s exotic, it’s emotional, it’s fun, and because they think they can.

The point of the 911K is lightweight, short gear, reasonable power and high revs for ultimate road driving fun. Just like a Sports/Super motorbike.

I’d rather have this than one of the GMA cars… as brilliant as they are from an engineering pov.

Looking forward to seeing more updates on the thread.

The SCRS recreations are very very cool also imo.

Edited by TDT on Friday 21st April 14:16

[braddo]

TDT said:

Had anybody questioned why GMA has gone with 12k rpm or AM with the Valkyrie?

Yes.

And they're not variations of old engines that are being redesigned to have redlines increased by 50%.

[Tripe Bypass]

isaldiri said:

it'd have to be producing more than 310hp I'd have thought? 3.1l engine that revs to 11k - the raw specs would suggest something that should be a lot more than 300-ish hp surely otherwise it means the torque is relatively very low.

That's what's confusing me as well. So, it's a 3.1 litre engine producing 310 ish horsepower but revs to 11,000rpm? Unless it's been made deliberately gutless in it's midrange it should be making loads more power than that. It should be making Cosworth DFV/DFY power.

Or am I missing something?

[thegreenhell]

This is an interesting little interview with Richard Tuthill about the car. He says the engine could easily make 400 but that that would be far too much for the type of car he wants it to be. Worth a listen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TqqT59_A-0

[Taffy66]

If the peak power of 310hp is at approx 10k revs then this translates to a torque figure of 163lbs/ft at the same revs.