458 Speciale not so special?.
Discussion
I have no strong feelings about Shmee either way, but find a lot of the discussions about him personally and his ownership decisions / history on this forum to be both distasteful and irrelevant. This is meant to be a thread about the Speciale, not financing on a totally different car!
I own a Speciale and its now got 4500 on the clock. have a 675lt on the way and driven a couple of 650 and the 675lt and the Ferrari is more accomplished and refined by a long shot as a road car, maybe racing has taught me a few things about getting the most out of a car but in the short drives I have done, the 650 lacks feel and feedback, having not driven either on track I won't comment on that. Looks are more a personal taste thing but neither are ugly ducklings IMO. Either way, I don't give a monkeys who is looking when I hear the NA V8 at full chat.
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Hollowpockets said:
I own a Speciale and its now got 4500 on the clock. have a 675lt on the way and driven a couple of 650 and the 675lt and the Ferrari is more accomplished and refined by a long shot as a road car, maybe racing has taught me a few things about getting the most out of a car but in the short drives I have done, the 650 lacks feel and feedback, having not driven either on track I won't comment on that. Looks are more a personal taste thing but neither are ugly ducklings IMO. Either way, I don't give a monkeys who is looking when I hear the NA V8 at full chat.
G
Nice response Hollowpockets, speciale is way better than 650s, have driven speciale on track and it's epic, no one would be rushing to get in the 650s after driving both back to back on track, they'd be walking past the Mc guaranteed ! Who gives a flying F... about who's old car and who walked past what. So speciale is special, check the classifieds, those who know, know. ttfn G
RamboLambo said:
Speciale and 650S are both awesome cars but in slightly different ways. I chose a 650S spider over a 458 speciale having extensively test driven both. It was just the more accomplished supercar overall for my personal needs as I do more fast road driving than track days and love to have the roof down.
Do I have any regrets - absolutely not
Am I surprised people look at the McLaren more than the Ferrari - absolutely not
Would I pay £100k more for a Speciale - absolutely not
The tide is turning and in years to come the McLaren 650S will be a very sought after car and its a real steal right now and incredible value for money.
Total production of 2,500 worldwide and circa 200 in the UK means its Ferrari limited edition numbers with a brand that is rapidly growing. Bag a bargain while you can and avoid the prancing horse premium to boot.
Sure Speciale is more fun to drive on the track and will retain its value well but not 50% more than a 650S and at those prices I can see the McLaren performing just as well on future residuals in the medium/long term ( 5 yrs + )
"Having extensively test driven both" would love to know more about this, and which one you bought ? Do I have any regrets - absolutely not
Am I surprised people look at the McLaren more than the Ferrari - absolutely not
Would I pay £100k more for a Speciale - absolutely not
The tide is turning and in years to come the McLaren 650S will be a very sought after car and its a real steal right now and incredible value for money.
Total production of 2,500 worldwide and circa 200 in the UK means its Ferrari limited edition numbers with a brand that is rapidly growing. Bag a bargain while you can and avoid the prancing horse premium to boot.
Sure Speciale is more fun to drive on the track and will retain its value well but not 50% more than a 650S and at those prices I can see the McLaren performing just as well on future residuals in the medium/long term ( 5 yrs + )
d16rr said:
"Having extensively test driven both" would love to know more about this, and which one you bought ?
DONT antagonise him :P He has a 650s and loves it rather a lot in volcano red. As a road car I prefer the 650s spider. Look and sound, but I am sure on track Id have the speciale On the track any day of the week (I have zero experience in either car
).Its horses for courses really, those who have specialees all owners seem to love them - I haven't heard one bad report on them! I personally don't think they suit really dark colours as it hides the lines in my opinion they definitely need a stripe they just look a tad odd without them.
Judging by the values of specials that come for sale they must be special - the romans one had a list price of just under £240k and sold for £300-£305k so they clearly are special to some.
mattf93 said:
DONT antagonise him :P He has a 650s and loves it rather a lot in volcano red.
As a road car I prefer the 650s spider. Look and sound, but I am sure on track Id have the speciale On the track any day of the week (I have zero experience in either car).
Its horses for courses really, those who have specialees all owners seem to love them - I haven't heard one bad report on them! I personally don't think they suit really dark colours as it hides the lines in my opinion they definitely need a stripe they just look a tad odd without them.
Judging by the values of specials that come for sale they must be special - the romans one had a list price of just under £240k and sold for £300-£305k so they clearly are special to some.
Bad choice 650s, not a great car by a long way, each to their own. Spaz is better in every way, as much as Mc rave on about the carbon tub not flexing on the spyder you can feel it when pushing on, turbo's lag also. Come in the spaz with me and you won't be able to stop grinning !As a road car I prefer the 650s spider. Look and sound, but I am sure on track Id have the speciale On the track any day of the week (I have zero experience in either car
).Its horses for courses really, those who have specialees all owners seem to love them - I haven't heard one bad report on them! I personally don't think they suit really dark colours as it hides the lines in my opinion they definitely need a stripe they just look a tad odd without them.
Judging by the values of specials that come for sale they must be special - the romans one had a list price of just under £240k and sold for £300-£305k so they clearly are special to some.
The values probably down to being the last n/a hardcore v8 F, unfortunately Mc have lost the plot and ramblinglambo is going to cop it big time, good job he loves it !
Guys - they're both great cars - fulfilling different roles/purposes.
Just be happy that we can still get them - before they're all fully connected and BigBro is really driving!
McLaren - British, sophisticated, fast, capable, usable.
Fez - Italian, emotional and just so unnecessary - but I'm glad they did!
A
Just be happy that we can still get them - before they're all fully connected and BigBro is really driving!
McLaren - British, sophisticated, fast, capable, usable.
Fez - Italian, emotional and just so unnecessary - but I'm glad they did!
A
mattf93 said:
mikewood said:
Despite the crappy weather, I think there was plenty of love for all the cars at Oulton Park on Monday! And the green 650S was certainly eye-catching...
That 650s is shmee's old car I do believe, and apparently people were walking straight past the speciales to go and look at that 650s spider There is no doubt the speciale is a special/great car that's why it was on my shopping list a year ago, but overall it was just too hardcore for my more regularly used supercar.
At the time the scuderia served that adrenalin rush purpose but was rarely used in reality. When I can afford/justify a 3rd supercar that's rarely used again I will probably add a Speciale but not at £300k
At the time the scuderia served that adrenalin rush purpose but was rarely used in reality. When I can afford/justify a 3rd supercar that's rarely used again I will probably add a Speciale but not at £300k
I have sat on the sideline for sometime now reading all the posts regarding the 650S. Firstly I would like to point out what I have gained from doing so, its all money related from you guys that own a Speciale, everything you discuss is all relating to the values of your precious car. I thought you bought a supercar to drive it? You bang on about the 650S and how much it has lost, so show me a 650S that has lost the figures you are quoting? If you look on Autotrader at the cheapest 650S you will find that's it is for sale at £190000.00, the car only cost £220000.00 new so where do you get your ridiculous figures from. So, based on that figure the car has lost 30k, now go and take a look how much you can buy a Ferrari 458 spider for of the same age and mileage. All you throw back at anyone that brings up the Mclaren is the residual values, surely you can do better than that, like, let's discuss the performance figures?, no you don't want to because the 650S leaves the Speciale for dust. No you dont want to discuss anything other than "oh my car has gone up by 60k you know", what's that you say, " why dont you drive it", " dont be so silly, i cant drive it as it the most mileage affected car you can buy". You don't buy them to drive, you buy them for the bragging power, if you want your £225000.00 to increase go and buy a painting that you can keep in the house. I look forward to your response.
Edited by greenbandit641 on Friday 18th September 16:54
Rocco1 said:
I was never a big fan of the 12C yet i have taken a shine to the 650S,what a car!
I cant understand what all the fuss is about with the Speciale
Will be joining the McLaren camp soon with a 675LT :-)
Yes, this is what I like to here... although Im not sure whether you'll be happy a 675lt Spider is pretty much been confirmed with allocation at a total of 300 units.I cant understand what all the fuss is about with the Speciale
Will be joining the McLaren camp soon with a 675LT :-)
Edited by Rocco1 on Friday 18th September 17:10
Edited by mattf93 on Friday 18th September 21:36
greenbandit641 said:
I have sat on the sideline for sometime now reading all the posts regarding the 650S. Firstly I would like to point out what I have gained from doing so, its all money related from you guys that own a Speciale, everything you discuss is all relating to the values of your precious car. I thought you bought a supercar to drive it?
... snipped ...
let's discuss the performance figures?, no you don't want to because the 650S leaves the Speciale for dust. No you dont want to discuss anything other than "oh my car has gone up by 60k you know", what's that you say, " why dont you drive it"
... snipped ...
No doubt there are Speciale owners such as you describe.... snipped ...
let's discuss the performance figures?, no you don't want to because the 650S leaves the Speciale for dust. No you dont want to discuss anything other than "oh my car has gone up by 60k you know", what's that you say, " why dont you drive it"
... snipped ...
I own a Speciale but would rather its price dropped rather than rose! Its a keeper until I can't drive anymore, but I might wear it out before then, so might need to buy a second one prices permitting ...
The numbers don't lie, the 650S is quicker in a straight line than the Speciale. I haven't driven a 650S so can't compare any of its other qualities. The Speciale certainly behaves beautifully at and beyond the limit, a lurid 100 mph slide at Silverstone after entering Copse far too hot has taught me that!
Has the Speciale any failings? Yes, the gear ratios are too short at the bottom and too far apart at the top. I understand this is a constraint imposed by the Getrag 7DCL750 gearbox they use. As for the 650S, I like that its even quicker than the Speciale, but don't like that its turbocharged. I like the hydraulic suspension concept, being able to set bump and roll rates independently is inherently superior, but I think the lack of a limited slip diff is a mistake.
Would I buy a McLaren? ... a naturally aspirated 675 would be hugely tempting.
boxerTen said:
No doubt there are Speciale owners such as you describe.
I own a Speciale but would rather its price dropped rather than rose! Its a keeper until I can't drive anymore, but I might wear it out before then, so might need to buy a second one prices permitting ...
The numbers don't lie, the 650S is I like the hydraulic suspension concept, being able to set bump and roll rates independently is inherently superior, but I think the lack of a limited slip diff is a mistake.
Would I buy a McLaren? ... a naturally aspirated 675 would be hugely tempting.
The Diff is open, rather than having an LSD.I own a Speciale but would rather its price dropped rather than rose! Its a keeper until I can't drive anymore, but I might wear it out before then, so might need to buy a second one prices permitting ...
The numbers don't lie, the 650S is I like the hydraulic suspension concept, being able to set bump and roll rates independently is inherently superior, but I think the lack of a limited slip diff is a mistake.
Would I buy a McLaren? ... a naturally aspirated 675 would be hugely tempting.
650s is quicker in a straight line, but round a track I'm sure a speciale would run rings around a 650s on track.
I will be interested to see what chris harris long term video on the 650s spider reveals. I saw a white 650 spider in Melton Mowbray today in, amongst the normal traffic looked incredible and had great presence and sounded great at idle.
650 just a different car to speciale - as a road car to some it will be a better car as it'll be more comfortable, more torque, quicker etc.
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