Stock 488 v stock 12C

[Jules360]

RamboLambo said:

Jules360 said:

You've had a 355, a 430 Spider and briefly a Scud. We know this since every one has been the best car on the planet during your ownership. As was the PET, and doubtless the next thing you buy. So i have to take your constant talking up of the 650 with a huge lump of salt since you are so fickle.

Thank you once again for your useful sorry useless comments. Talk about fickle - Now as all good trolls do please crawl back under your bridge for another 3 months and dream about owning a McLaren.
If I had a £1 for every constructive comment you had every made I would have a bigger debt than the GDP

Edited by RamboLambo on Wednesday 28th September 11:19

Calm down dear, it's only a car forum.

Dream of owning a McLaren ? I had my heart set on an MP12 three years ago, until I drove one. I found the seats uncomfortable, the paddles too small and awkward and the salesman took 5 minutes trying to get the driver's door to open. I found the whole experience underwhelming. I put this down in part to the double clutch gearbox, so went to Ferrari expecting to come away feeling the same about the 458. But after about 10 minutes I knew i had to have one. Gearchange was more positive, the noise was fantastic and i know it's a cliche but it just had more soul.

Fast forward 3 years and the McLaren garage let me have a 650S Spider for the day. Much better than the MP12, better noise, doors opened fitst time and the whole drive felt so much more involving. And it's fast. But again I dropped it back to the dealer with no desire to own own - no idea why, just didn't do it for me like the 458 does or indeed the 560-4 I had previously.

A piece of advice for you Gary - if you come on a forum spouting the same stuff in every post, on every thread about any car you own, expect some criticism.

And your last sentence makes no sense at all.

[MingtheMerciless]

I had a great desire to own the MP4 after driving it. Just a slightly greater desire to own a 458 after driving it (maybe for the third time) but just after the MP4 and on the same track.

I have a slightly lesser desire to own a 488 because it is just so bonkers fast that it takes away from the fun - It's not like the 458 is a $hitbox that gets sand kicked in its face like, but just when you are enjoying yourself in the 488, suddenly you have blasted to the end of whatever bit you are enjoying and its time to get the anchors on pronto to avoid a fiery death (and then the Feds arrive). I also don't think it sounds quite as nice as the 458 and I miss the extra 1000rpm. So (and I haven't had this pleaure yet), I can imagine how the 650S could shade the 488 in one's affections. But all this is pretty marginal and subjective and not worth trading insults over. If you prefer the BigMac good for you I wouldn't criticize you for it.

[Fuoco]

Although I'm not a maca fan, that colour is the nuts man, I have seen a 650 spider in Volcano red close up it's gorgeous well done. However as i push cars to whatever they will do, I'm better in slower cars, love my licence too much to go for the latest fastest thing and its more to do with how they make you feel, took my manual Murcielago out yesterday it was amazing, then this morning took out my 360 manual, wow these analogue cars were and are so good- who cares about how many times over the limit they can do if they don't vibrate and talk back. A lambo dealer once told me that one of the endearing features about the Bizzarrini engine is the whoosh of mechanical noise as it builds up the revs! and also the 360 with its 5 valves per cylinder is a real screamer, newer cars are quite and therefore you end up doing silly speeds to get the kicks!!

RamboLambo said:

LOL.

First thing anyone mentions about the car before they even know what it is, is the colour. "Wow that colour is amazing ". If I had a £1 for every time someone said that I could buy 2 458 Speciales

Sorry but I'm afraid you are out of touch with reality and just show your ignorance with your posts.

Fair play though you can keep trying to wind me up but eventually as all trolls do you will return under your bridge.

Volcano Red rocks man and my local Ferrari sales manager even says it tops his favourite Rosso Fuoco which costs £15k because its deeper and more vibrant. There is a real depth to the paint with Mclarens that Ferraris don't seem to have.

Happy trolling and no doubt if you even own a Ferrari ( which I doubt ) its probably Rosso Corsa - Been there, done that several times, boring

Edited by RamboLambo on Tuesday 13th September 23:53[/footnote]

[footnote]Edited by Fuoco on Tuesday 11th October 17:03

[F355spider]

As an owner of both i can confirm the 488 kicks the 12c's backside in terms of a drag race. Both lovely cars none the less..

[Durzel]

Now that's just greedy.

Looks like the correct spec and most importantly of all - Giallo calipers

[wayne-unyxt]

Wow, well done that man...

Well in terms of drag racing its no surprise the 488 kicks the maca's backside due to its weight and hp, but what about handling, have things progressed noticeably over the past few years in terms on handling and braking?

[RamboLambo]

650S moved the game on significantly again from early MP4 -12C with more power but more importantly 78Nm more torque.

The 488's power/torque is restricted in lower gears for a more linear and more N/aspirated feel to it so you don't get the full headline power figures Ferrari quote in the lower gears which is where the 650S can take it in a drag race because of its weight advantage due to be carbon tub

[lambo666]

I nearly forgot about that carbon tub.

[RamboLambo]

488 v 650s comparison review. Shock horror, older generation car beats the new kid on the block

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8ym6kSewAQ

Edited by RamboLambo on Saturday 29th October 20:10

[isaldiri]

wayne-unyxt said:

Wow, well done that man...

Well in terms of drag racing its no surprise the 488 kicks the maca's backside due to its weight and hp, but what about handling, have things progressed noticeably over the past few years in terms on handling and braking?

Sorry? I think you will find the 488 is a good bit heavier than the 12c.

the 488 is a generation of car ahead of the 12c. It's hardly a surprise it's quicker (or over the 650 for that matter which was a much smaller facelift improvement over the 12c) is it really?

[845ste]

sound 488 is best (458 is very very top best)

[Bunk]

This is such a preposterous debate. I often hear that X car smokes Y cars backside and is so ridiculously faster as to have "moved the game on" so much.

Then over the coming months and years, the likes of M5Board will do head to heads on an airstrip and we see that after about 15-20 seconds of hard acceleration that car X is in fact only a few car lengths clear of car Y and under conditions that can never be replicated in the real world.

And in the real world there is nothing between any of these cars since they have long passed the point where any of this is usable.

So if you happen to go on a hoon in your "yesterday's man" 12C or 458 with a bunch of mates in 488's/650s, don't worry about it. They won't be losing you and you will be just as quick.

[MingtheMerciless]

I have just spent two days at Fiorano at the Corsa Pilota course, driving 488's and F12's. There is no doubt at all that the 488 will get around any track faster than my 458 will. There is no doubt that it is a "better" car by any objective measure. If I had to choose between the 488 and my 458 for one lap, the only one left to me, I'd pick my 458 because it sounds nicer and I want and need that extra 1000 rpm. But both the 488 and the 458 are magnificent. I haven't been fortunate enough to drive a 650S but I have driven (as I said above) the 12C back to back with a 458 around a track and I loved them both. I imagine the 650S and 488 are similarly narrowly differentiated.

I don't care that much which machine is faster (it's the F12 actually) - for me any of them will do. But it is interesting that the poster above felt that his 488 is faster than his 12C - I felt that the 12C was noticably faster than the 458. But I still preferred the 458. Just.

[F355spider]

MingtheMerciless said:

I have just spent two days at Fiorano at the Corsa Pilota course, driving 488's and F12's. There is no doubt at all that the 488 will get around any track faster than my 458 will. There is no doubt that it is a "better" car by any objective measure. If I had to choose between the 488 and my 458 for one lap, the only one left to me, I'd pick my 458 because it sounds nicer and I want and need that extra 1000 rpm. But both the 488 and the 458 are magnificent. I haven't been fortunate enough to drive a 650S but I have driven (as I said above) the 12C back to back with a 458 around a track and I loved them both. I imagine the 650S and 488 are similarly narrowly differentiated.

I don't care that much which machine is faster (it's the F12 actually) - for me any of them will do. But it is interesting that the poster above felt that his 488 is faster than his 12C - I felt that the 12C was noticably faster than the 458. But I still preferred the 458. Just.

Wasn't a case of 'feeling' my 488 is quicker ...it actually is quicker! Rumbo Dumbo started this thread to get a response and he's got one! The video he has posted is way off the real world, much akin to "my fiesta beat a Porsche off the lights video"
458 is a superb car, had one and loved it, also a Speciale.


Unfortunately Rumbo now seems to want to discuss 650 vs 488 which might be a different conversation as I've only briefly driven a 650s.

I've a trackday soon, will update the results of 488 vs 650

Edited by F355spider on Sunday 30th October 17:22

[RamboLambo]

F355spider said:

Wasn't a case of 'feeling' my 488 is quicker ...it actually is quicker! Rumbo Dumbo started this thread to get a response and he's got one! The video he has posted is way off the real world, much akin to "my fiesta beat a Porsche off the lights video"
458 is a superb car, had one and loved it, also a Speciale.


Unfortunately Rumbo now seems to want to discuss 650 vs 488 which might be a different conversation as I've only briefly driven a 650s.

I've a trackday soon, will update the results of 488 vs 650

Edited by F355spider on Sunday 30th October 17:22

650S v 488 is more relevant even if the product change cycles are different and the Ferrari is 2 years newer.
I guess neither manufacturer will want to align this so a direct comparison can be drawn

I would be woefully disappointed if the 488 didn't smash the 650S as it is 2 years newer and about £100k more to buy

[F355spider]

RamboLambo said:

F355spider said:

Wasn't a case of 'feeling' my 488 is quicker ...it actually is quicker! Rumbo Dumbo started this thread to get a response and he's got one! The video he has posted is way off the real world, much akin to "my fiesta beat a Porsche off the lights video"
458 is a superb car, had one and loved it, also a Speciale.


Unfortunately Rumbo now seems to want to discuss 650 vs 488 which might be a different conversation as I've only briefly driven a 650s.

I've a trackday soon, will update the results of 488 vs 650

Edited by F355spider on Sunday 30th October 17:22

650S v 488 is more relevant even if the product change cycles are different and the Ferrari is 2 years newer.
I guess neither manufacturer will want to align this so a direct comparison can be drawn

I would be woefully disappointed if the 488 didn't smash the 650S as it is 2 years newer and about £100k more to buy

Is a 650s not £200k and a 488 coupe similar money?

[RamboLambo]

650S production has ceased so in reality you are looking at a nearly new used car.

You can get a 650s Spider for circa £180k but a similar spec 488 spider at full list and 2 year waiting list is about £100k more.
That's a lot of dosh

[br d]

F355spider said:

Rumbo Dumbo started this thread to get a response and he's got one!

And with that childish response you've pretty much lost me.

RL certainly does have an annoying posting style, I'm a Mac owner and he still gets on my nerves.

But if that's your idea of a reasoned response then don't expect any of your subsequent posts to be taken seriously. I'd have thought that at least here we could avoid sounding like an archetypal pistonheads blowhard.

[martinvantage]

Rambo Lambo while I agree that discounts on a 650s may well be achievable possibly down to 180, a 488 really isn't 100k more expensive. That is first hand experience

[F355spider]

br d said:

And with that childish response you've pretty much lost me.

RL certainly does have an annoying posting style, I'm a Mac owner and he still gets on my nerves.

But if that's your idea of a reasoned response then don't expect any of your subsequent posts to be taken seriously. I'd have thought that at least here we could avoid sounding like an archetypal pistonheads blowhard.

Oh well, you don't sound my cuppa tea either