Which Ferrari?
Discussion
Jonty355 said:
You can get a Ferrari 308 GTBi / GTSi under the £50k budget, so that would be the best buy as a short term investment. They're also fantastic to drive and cheap to maintain! They're also very pretty cars!
The 355 is the best for driving and a mix of looks but you wont get as gooder return as an investment.
The 360 was too mass produced for them to be an investment. Personally I'm not a fan of the looks. Yes they're quicker than a 355, but get the 355 remapped and it would be every bit as quick and better to drive!
i don't think you can now get a really nice 308 QV for under 50k now The 355 is the best for driving and a mix of looks but you wont get as gooder return as an investment.
The 360 was too mass produced for them to be an investment. Personally I'm not a fan of the looks. Yes they're quicker than a 355, but get the 355 remapped and it would be every bit as quick and better to drive!
Nmj said:
i don't think you can now get a really nice 308 QV for under 50k now
Have to agree! - The prices for 308's/328's are climbing fast! (as are just about all the Ferrari models). £50K is going to be @ bottom of the market already.
I was looking to buy a 328 GTS but just as I finally got the finances in a position where I could buy and run the car comfortably, the market took off and left Me for dead!
I'm now in the process of buying a very tidy 348 TS. Not the greatest Ferrari ever made (although I think it's better than many make it out to be!), and not as pretty as a 308/328, but it'll do for Me!
It's interesting to note that in the last couple of years, these cars have gone from being @ £20K~£25K, to being @ £30K~£36K.
In the same time period, 308's have gone from being £28K~£35K to being @ £50~£75K (or well over £100K for vetroresina's [fibre glass GTB's] ).
328's were £25K~£30K and are now pushing £45K+.
A short time ago 308 GT4's were going for @ £10K~£15K (and barely selling!), now they're sought after and going for @ £20K~£40K
355's are sought after and their prices are climbing fast.
Bargain Ferrari's at the moment?:
360's - They're climbing in value, but at a much slower rate than 308's/328's and 355's at the moment.
456's - I'd say they're bargain basement at the moment. Big car, V12 engine,costly to run (even by Ferrari standards), and 4seats put a lot of buyers off. You can find cars in need of a bit of tlc for @ £16K and nice ones going for £20K~£40K.
612's also appear to be heading into (comparatively), bargain territory now. I had a look at a "high mileage" (57K miles!) 612 that was for sale for @ £44K. It struck Me as being a lot of car for very little money, especially considering that they were £182K+ when new! They may come down a little bit more yet and it's a big old beast of a car, but it struck Me as being a bit of a bargain.
You'll probably note that even though I'm buying one right now, I don't think the 348 is a bargain.
When I switched from looking for a 328 GTS to a 348 TS (not that long ago!), average cars were @ £27K and top end cars were going for @ £30K. During My search, the lower end cars pretty much sold out and the top end cars are now £33K+ (I missed out on 4 cars before I found the one that I'm now buying as they were selling fast).
As for talk of waiting for the bubble to burst, I know it can happen almost overnight (as it has in the past!), but having spoken with a couple of Ferrari specialists, it seems that financial confidence is still growing at a steady rate and they both expect prices to rise for at least the next couple of years, if not longer (the one dealer did suggest the prices may start to ease up slightly in @ a years time though).
Time will tell! - As these things tend to go, for some, the market will go the right way and they'll make a killing on their Ferraris, and for others the market will go the wrong way and kill the value of their Ferraris. Then it will be the tough choice of either selling for a lose or braving out the storm until the markets rise again! (And then of course, there's the other Ferrari owner for whom the market fluctuations make no difference whatsoever because their car will be kept forever regardless of value!)
When I bought my 355 five years ago there was a fibreglass 308 up for sale privately at £26k. I'm guessing that would be worth a little more than that now. My guess is 308's, 328's have moved already, 355's are going whilst 360's are static and might be for a while. In that price range I agree on the 550.
4rephill said:
Have to agree! .........
+ 1, Nice summary. I see two questions.
a) Which car is right for the OP to enjoy without losing a chunk of money?
b) Which 'entry level' models will lose the least (or appreciate)?
So, on a) I think you (OP) will enjoy the 360 spider the most if you are from the Aston, Porsche world primarily. The 355 is very much a car you can use daily, however if you are into your modern cars the 360 looks like you would expect a car to look from the drivers seat. I may be wrong on my OP assumption. I love the feel of the 70s and 80s cars but I know some people don't, especially if they haven't experienced mid-engined classics, so probably best for you to try them all to see what fits best for you.
Therefore, If you want to keep / make the most money on a 360 now in your price range go for a manual. F1 box was not great as a road car box until the 430.
Onto b) My view is as per 4rephill. 308/328 and 355 manuals will be the best option if you expect values to climb in the 5 - 10, in that order. The 355 F1s will lag and I wouldn't be surprised if people convert them to manuals at some point in the future. I think 360 manuals will follow behind the 355 due to volume produced and it's too similar to the 430 in overall shape and 430s will continue to drop for a few years, impacting 360s, particularly F1s from a rise.
Anyway, get it bought and start enjoying the car. The weather is great at the moment.
Nmj said:
Jonty355 said:
You can get a Ferrari 308 GTBi / GTSi under the £50k budget, so that would be the best buy as a short term investment. They're also fantastic to drive and cheap to maintain! They're also very pretty cars!
The 355 is the best for driving and a mix of looks but you wont get as gooder return as an investment.
The 360 was too mass produced for them to be an investment. Personally I'm not a fan of the looks. Yes they're quicker than a 355, but get the 355 remapped and it would be every bit as quick and better to drive!
i don't think you can now get a really nice 308 QV for under 50k now The 355 is the best for driving and a mix of looks but you wont get as gooder return as an investment.
The 360 was too mass produced for them to be an investment. Personally I'm not a fan of the looks. Yes they're quicker than a 355, but get the 355 remapped and it would be every bit as quick and better to drive!
4rephill said:
As for talk of waiting for the bubble to burst, I know it can happen almost overnight (as it has in the past!), but having spoken with a couple of Ferrari specialists, it seems that financial confidence is still growing at a steady rate and they both expect prices to rise for at least the next couple of years, if not longer (the one dealer did suggest the prices may start to ease up slightly in @ a years time though).
I reckon the market will stay strong for a while yet. The plus side of Ferraris is that they're controlled more by the buyers/owners over property. The problem with property is that a lot of the prices can be controlled by absolutely anyone! The majority of people can get on the property market in some way or another, its also controlled by the banks and the government. Far too many variables for that can turn the market pear-shaped. Same with banks, its those plus the gorvernment that control interest rates. As per Ferraris and classic cars, I think a lot of investors have seen they can control the market more themselves, and if you've got on the Ferrari/classic car ladder early enough then its a decent investment.Personally though, I just like owning Ferraris to thrash the nuts off them and have fun!!!!
Jonty355 said:
I reckon the market will stay strong for a while yet. The plus side of Ferraris is that they're controlled more by the buyers/owners over property. The problem with property is that a lot of the prices can be controlled by absolutely anyone! The majority of people can get on the property market in some way or another, its also controlled by the banks and the government. Far too many variables for that can turn the market pear-shaped. Same with banks, its those plus the gorvernment that control interest rates. As per Ferraris and classic cars, I think a lot of investors have seen they can control the market more themselves, and if you've got on the Ferrari/classic car ladder early enough then its a decent investment.
Personally though, I just like owning Ferraris to thrash the nuts off them and have fun!!!!
The acid test is when interest rates rise. Those that may have chosen not to overpay their mortgage and instead invest in a car may then find that their outgoings require them to sell the investment. If others are in the same boat we could see a rash of these cars for sale with no buyers..or no buyers willing to pay the asking price.Personally though, I just like owning Ferraris to thrash the nuts off them and have fun!!!!
For a £50k budget, I'd say go for 308 GT4. They are great to drive, practical and one of the least expensive Ferrari models to maintain. As a bonus, also a good investment IMO. Think of it as a 308 GTB with 2+2 bodywork (and GTBs are selling at £75k+).
You might find a RHD manual 355, but I doubt it'll be one you'd want to buy. You'll need to spend closer to £60-65k. There seems to be a cared-for manual 360 Modena in the classifieds at the moment sub-£50k - worth a look. Great choice if you're buying to drive and enjoy.
If financial return is more of a consideration, then consider rarity / supply-and-demand. There are only 26 RHD [edit after a long night! '261 UK RHD'] 348ts in the world - and there's one for sale in the classifieds.
You could also spend a lot less than £50k and find one of the 91 RHD Mondial 3.2 Coupes. Yes, it's a Mondial, so it's rubbish, right? Wrong! As with almost all Ferraris, find a good one and it's just that. We sold one last year for £25k - I almost bought it for myself. It's far from Maranello's prettiest, but it's a Ferrari for Ford Focus ST money!
People like to generalise about 'good Ferraris' and 'bad Ferraris' because it makes good forum fodder, but pick any model that is unilaterally regarded as amazing, and I could go and find a bad example of it tomorrow.
FWIW, I find that 'bad' Ferraris tend to be the result of someone buying the cheapest and ropiest example of a particular model. It sounds obvious, but I would always say: buy the best Ferrari you can afford.
You might find a RHD manual 355, but I doubt it'll be one you'd want to buy. You'll need to spend closer to £60-65k. There seems to be a cared-for manual 360 Modena in the classifieds at the moment sub-£50k - worth a look. Great choice if you're buying to drive and enjoy.
If financial return is more of a consideration, then consider rarity / supply-and-demand. There are only 26 RHD [edit after a long night! '261 UK RHD'] 348ts in the world - and there's one for sale in the classifieds.
You could also spend a lot less than £50k and find one of the 91 RHD Mondial 3.2 Coupes. Yes, it's a Mondial, so it's rubbish, right? Wrong! As with almost all Ferraris, find a good one and it's just that. We sold one last year for £25k - I almost bought it for myself. It's far from Maranello's prettiest, but it's a Ferrari for Ford Focus ST money!
People like to generalise about 'good Ferraris' and 'bad Ferraris' because it makes good forum fodder, but pick any model that is unilaterally regarded as amazing, and I could go and find a bad example of it tomorrow.
FWIW, I find that 'bad' Ferraris tend to be the result of someone buying the cheapest and ropiest example of a particular model. It sounds obvious, but I would always say: buy the best Ferrari you can afford.
Edited by torquespeak on Friday 23 January 23:51
torquespeak said:
If financial return is more of a consideration, then consider rarity / supply-and-demand. There are only 26 RHD 348ts in the world - and there's one for sale in the classifieds.
That number is very low......there were about 14 348GTS in the UK and maybe 10 GTC's but there were/are a couple of hundred TS's....Slickhillsy said:
JaseB said:
I believe there were 261 rhd TS model imported officially into the UK, guess more to the rest of the world.
15 rhd GTS manufactured, all UK, with a rumoured 11 left, I have one but haven't seen another for sale, ever. :-)
Sounds about right...15 rhd GTS manufactured, all UK, with a rumoured 11 left, I have one but haven't seen another for sale, ever. :-)
It's not that hard to check these sort of facts before posting a response is it? - 26 RHD 348 TS' in the World!
Sorry all - late night after researching a Daytona we've just bought, so an unfortunate (and *clearly* incorrect) typo slipped in there. Of course it should have read '261' rather than '26'. We sold a lovely 27k mile car last year.
Commenters above are also correct - I should have said UK RHD.
Commenters above are also correct - I should have said UK RHD.
ukshooter said:
I'm waiting for the Mondial QV Cabriolet to creep up :-)
Only 24 RHD brought into the UK and only 670 or so in total. I think they might have been the last coach built car too!
In the meantime, I use it as the family fun car to whizz the kids around in.
OJ's wife Nicole had the exact same car in the exact same colour and used it for the exact same purpose!Only 24 RHD brought into the UK and only 670 or so in total. I think they might have been the last coach built car too!
In the meantime, I use it as the family fun car to whizz the kids around in.
cgt2 said:
ukshooter said:
I'm waiting for the Mondial QV Cabriolet to creep up :-)
Only 24 RHD brought into the UK and only 670 or so in total. I think they might have been the last coach built car too!
In the meantime, I use it as the family fun car to whizz the kids around in.
OJ's wife Nicole had the exact same car in the exact same colour and used it for the exact same purpose!Only 24 RHD brought into the UK and only 670 or so in total. I think they might have been the last coach built car too!
In the meantime, I use it as the family fun car to whizz the kids around in.
I've always thought that the Mondial looks far better as a convertible than a coupe.
The problem with the coupe seems to be (to Me at least), that to keep the proportions of the car balanced due to the rear seats, the roof-line was made slightly high, which, with no one sitting in the car looks okay, but when someone is in the car there's just too much space above their heads (added to which, the front seat occupants seem to sit a bit too far forward from an aesthetic point of view).
Don't get Me wrong, I'm not knocking the Mondial, just pointing out a couple of areas where the need for some (relative) practicality dictated a degree of compromise on the design.
One thing that has got Me curious:
How is it that the steam is only coming out of the exhaust pipes on the drivers side?
Surely based on the exhaust box design, the steam should be coming from both sets of pipes?
My father's had several Mondials and as you say, the seating position can make you look like a midget, he's only 5'6" so it was almost comical! They must have adjusted the seating position for the 3.4t as he looked taller in that. Of the 6 Ferraris he has owned - 308 GTBi, 328 GTB, Mondial 3.2, Mondial t and two 550 Maranellos, oddly it's the Mondial t that he speaks most fondly of.
Gassing Station | Ferrari Classics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff