(PENDING)Phonesafe, Beware!!!!!

[KFC]

10 Pence Short said:

The fix for PH is more or less free and, if you are all right about how people understand it and don't mind paying...

The problem is you're expecting the buyer to pay for something when all the listed advantages are actually for the advertiser.

What are the benefits of using PhoneSafe?

PhoneSafe blocks calls from known canvassers and leaves you free to answer queries from people genuinely interested in buying your vehicle.
It is a free service for PistonHeads advertisers.
Sellers are able to keep their own phone numbers private.


point 1 - why should I care? The canvassers aren't going to call me are they?

point 2 - its not free if I'm going to be fked over via my phone bill though. Its free for the advertiser only.

point 3 - Another point that I couldn't care less about as an advertiser.


Those 3 things should all be listed on the 'add your car' page to encourage sellers to use it... but its pointless promoting them from a button on the page advertisers look at.

[MattDell]

10 Pence Short said:

The fix for PH is more or less free and, if you are all right about how people understand it and don't mind paying, it will have minimal impact on revenue. So what's stopping them?

Nothing.

As eyebic said before, we're making changes to make the charges more clear. It's been fast tracked to the top of the technical pile and should be out in a few business days. The reason we need a few days is because the classifieds runs off compiled code, not script, so we can't just go onto a web server and change some text around like the old days.

I would like to defend the point about us ignoring this issue for five years. I've worked for PH for the past three years and I've never seen this thread until this week. In addition, we've changed the classifieds twice in the past few years and both times that has involved changing the way we display Phonesafe to you, our users. If there were continuous complaints about Phonesafe charges we would have made the clarity of costs a higher priority. The only reason nothing has changed in the past five years is because there hasn't been many, if any, complaints about it.

I agree with many of the points made before my post here, but I don't think it's fair to vilify the PH staff as part of some evil corporate machine when we (meaning the people who work here now and not 5 years ago) weren't really aware of the issue.

Right, I'll get off the soap box.

[hadenough!]

Good response, shame eyebic wasn't as sensible.

[iwantagta]

Agreed - nicely said & fair point.

[ALXJ]

Just to let you know I have now received a refund for the majority of the calls, around £52 out of a possible £59....

I am happy for PH to make money by providing services which are transparent. How much that is... really is none of my business.

I hope that they address the clarity issue, regarding cost to call 070 'phonesafe' numbers with clear information. They have promised to do so.

I was really under the impression I was just calling a mobile number that had been created to hide the sellers number, obviously I used my mobile because ringing another mobile was free for me as long as I was within my minutes. I trusted PH because of the community feel, and the fact that their car adverts are very reasonably priced compared to other sites. I know this doesnt really seem rational but I just didnt ever think I was ringing a premium rate number @ 75p a minute.

It is a potentially fantastic revenue stream for someone which could easily be abused. Just set up numbers linked to answerphones to bogus ads, or even worse bogus sellers on the other end of a line...rung many times and the numbers get big.. there doesnt even have to be a person answering but if you can keep someone talking like my 50 minute call then happy days. And the other option as soon as the answerphone kicks in, its immediately 75p from a mobile whether you leave a message or not.

I want to make it clear I am not in any way suggesting pistonheads or any other car website are using these 070 personal numbers in this way, but it does make you think !

[Spitfire2]

MattDell said:

I would like to defend the point about us ignoring this issue for five years. I've worked for PH for the past three years and I've never seen this thread until this week. In addition, we've changed the classifieds twice in the past few years and both times that has involved changing the way we display Phonesafe to you, our users. If there were continuous complaints about Phonesafe charges we would have made the clarity of costs a higher priority. The only reason nothing has changed in the past five years is because there hasn't been many, if any, complaints about it.

Your post is a good one, but I would say the above pretty much confirms the issue has been ignored for all these years. Remember the response all those years back was that something would be done about it.

To a cynic (like me) that could be read as "it's gone quiet, let's leave it as it is".

Not suggesting that's the case, but rather than defending current staff (which isn't necessary as it's not a personal criticism) a proper company response would be "Sorry. We said we'ld fix this years ago but we didn't. We are fixing it now".

The fact that staff have changed isn't relevant.

[Haggleburyfinius]

hadenough! said:

Good response, shame eyebic wasn't as sensible.

Eybic isn't really suited to a customer facing role I don't think

[ALXJ]

No change on the classifieds...will be interesting to see if there will be.

[Vaud]

ALXJ said:

No change on the classifieds...will be interesting to see if there will be.

I think it was noted that it is compiled code rather than just a easy web page change, so allow a few days for dev>test>production. Changing live code on a big web site is a bit like rewiring the house with the electricity still on...

[eybic]

We're hoping for a release early next week but I'll update this thread as soon as it's live

[Mermaid]

eybic said:

We're hoping for a release early next week but I'll update this thread as soon as it's live

ALXJ , be patient now.

[ALXJ]

Mermaid said:

ALXJ , be patient now.

Youre on rocky ground Mermaid !

[eybic]

Just to let you know that we have amended the wording in the Phonesafe description making it clearer that the charges are more than a "normal" number and also hopefully made it more obvious that there are additional charges by adding a "click here for pricing info" link next to the number.

Nathan

[WinstonWolf]

It's still not clear that you're not calling a number that will be excluded from your bundle. Perhaps adjust the wording to say "This call is not free from mobiles, click here for pricing info"

It's better, but it still has the potential to be ignored.

[Vaud]

Given recent fines, I suggest PH errs on the side of caution:

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2014/apr/03/118-1...

[ALXJ]

It is a bit better because it draws you to click

but still not completely obvious

75 pence a minute from mobiles is not mentioned

[eybic]

ALXJ said:

It is a bit better because it draws you to click

but still not completely obvious

75 pence a minute from mobiles is not mentioned

As I think we've mentioned before, the prices are constantly changing and vary from operator to operator, yours happens to be 75p per minute but mine might be 50p per minute etc. the only firm prices are for a BT Landline which is why we list those prices and state that calling from a mobile WILL cost more as thats all we can guarantee.

[rscott]

eybic said:

ALXJ said:

It is a bit better because it draws you to click

but still not completely obvious

75 pence a minute from mobiles is not mentioned

As I think we've mentioned before, the prices are constantly changing and vary from operator to operator, yours happens to be 75p per minute but mine might be 50p per minute etc. the only firm prices are for a BT Landline which is why we list those prices and state that calling from a mobile WILL cost more as thats all we can guarantee.

Warning seems perfectly okay to me - it's pretty much the same as the one used by the BBC on their voting lines.
As eybic mentions, prices are different for most mobile operators. o2 charge 66p per minute - http://www.o2.co.uk/help/everything-else/special-n...

[mmm-five]

It still maintains that user will be charged "only a small amount more than direct calls".

Prices quoted for landlines:

• Day: 37.5p
• Evening: 25.0p
• Weekend: 12.5p

If I'm reading it correctly, BT's standard (national) prices from landlines are:

• Day: 8.076p
• Evening: 4.032p
• Weekend: 1.524p

So should this instead read "will be charged at 4 to 6 times more than direct calls" - as I'm not sure most users would know what the standard call rate was in the first place to compare with.

[Andehh]

I'm another very Internet and phone literate individual who assumed they were mobile numbers and not premium rate ones, I'd have been royally stuffed as well!!