McLaren 570S

[br d]

Anyone going to the 570 private viewing at Olaf Street?

[isaldiri]

graeme4130 said:

I'm not sure where it leaves the 650s in terms of comparative value though, as asides from some of the finer technical points (suspension redesign), can people really tell the difference between 570 and 650bhp on the road, and does it justify the extra £70-90k outlay for the 650 with a very similar tub/engine architecture ?

Personally, it puts a Mclaren in my price range, which is a good thing for me, but maybe it devalues the position of the 650s, I don't know

Be interested to hear what others think

TP321 might have had a very negative view expressed towards Mclaren generally but he probably isn't entirely far off IMO. the 650 is left in an awkward position with the 570 - GRB apart I think most people will accept that.

The 570 is much the same car with pretty similar styling, 85-90% of the performance and at 2/3ds of the price. It is hardly the '911 type everyday usable' competitor that was suggested much earlier on and seems much more to be a car that is intended to supplant the older car offering a very similar experience at a lower price point. What however is then a bit jarring is why Mclaren have chosen to make the car that the 570 is but then have intentionally hamstring the car with very narrow tyres to ensure performance wise there is a gap to the 650.

I can see the logic of going after Huracan/488 £200+k class of car with the 570 especially at that price but if they do really want to do so, for goodness sake go all in and throw the book at the 570 and if it leaves the 650 nowhere so be it. P11 production is going to wind down in a year or so after the 675 is done and Woking have already done their best over the last year producing 650s whether there are customer orders or not and the future for Mclaren Automotive lies with the 570 and the 650 replacement.

[GRBF430F1]

As 570S goes into production 650S numbers will reduce dramatically with most if not all orders in the future being factory specced for customer sold orders. 458's already outnumber 650S 10:1
I believe this will be very good for 650s in the long term and only enhance the cars status.

Compared to my Ferrari I absolutely love the kudos and exclusivity that comes with the 650s and the way the general public enthuse over it.
If only I had a £1 for everytime someone has said to me "how the hell can you afford a £1,000,000 car "

[TP321]

GRBF430F1 said:

Don't make me Did you not learn from my previous post

"The 650S chews up and spits out a 458" Steve Sutcliffe.

650S prices will remain strong and the fewer out there the better as far as I'm concerned :

What you meant to say was - "They took on Ferrari in the mid V8 segment and murdered them, and are now making a plucky assault on Porsche, enhancing future residuals

Edited by GRBF430F1 on Wednesday 1st April 18:35

Good luck GRB with that £200k 650s. Have you wondered why you managed to get a £40k discount on "the best SUPERCAR on the planet" when it has not even been out for a year yet? Why wasn't there a waiting list?? Anyway, enjoy the fact that it has more power and speed over the £145k 570S, but bear in mind that in around 12 months time, there will be a super doopper 570s which will probably be faster than your 650s. With McLaren there is always a newer and better version just round the corner.;)

[mrloudly]

It's the old Range Rover to Range Rover Sport thing. One day I just know a 570S is going to pull beside me at the lights, and all will become clear

[TISPKJ]

mrloudly said:

It's the old Range Rover to Range Rover Sport thing. One day I just know a 570S is going to pull beside me at the lights, and all will become clear

No it's discovery and discovery sport this week :-)

[GRBF430F1]

TP321 said:

Good luck GRB with that £200k 650s. Have you wondered why you managed to get a £40k discount on "the best SUPERCAR on the planet" when it has not even been out for a year yet? Why wasn't there a waiting list?? Anyway, enjoy the fact that it has more power and speed over the £145k 570S, but bear in mind that in around 12 months time, there will be a super doopper 570s which will probably be faster than your 650s. With McLaren there is always a newer and better version just round the corner.;)

A £200k new 650S Spider, with £40k Discount ? I wish Couldn't even get a basic car for that.
Was offered £48k off a 1,000 mile 3 month old 458 spider demo though but as I've said before the McLaren was worth the extra and that's coming from an avid Ferrari fan and owner.
Just because every one else hasn't woken up to it yet doesn't mean its not fact.
Happy to be with a progressive company that doesn't sit on its bum being complacent. The more new models they bring to market the better as far as I'm concerned. Increase the customer base and in years to come 12c/650S will be viewed as low volume models that become sought after.
Residuals are already strong if you purchase sensibly and I can only see them improving but hey what do I know apart from I said this for both performante and scuderia and got slaughtered but both of those cars have been kind to me

Newer and better models do not necessarily mean old models crash and burn long term.
There might be some short term effect but the value is irrelevant to me as the 650S is a definite keeper because its such an accomplished and all round car that's easy to live with.
I'm already doing twice the miles in it that I do in my other 2 cars so smiles by miles and value for money is already there IMHO

[ferdi p]

br d said:

Anyone going to the 570 private viewing at Olaf Street?

Yes, you?

[TP321]

GRBF430F1 said:

A £200k new 650S Spider, with £40k Discount ? I wish Couldn't even get a basic car for that.

Happy to be with a progressive company that doesn't sit on its bum being complacent. The more new models they bring to market the better as far as I'm concerned. Increase the customer base and in years to come 12c/650S will be viewed as low volume models that become sought after.
Residuals are already strong if you purchase sensibly and I can only see them improving
Newer and better models do not necessarily mean old models crash and burn long term.

GRB, this is exactly the same thing that this guy said in 2011 when he paid £200k for his 12C....

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/m...

[mb1]

In a way you are all right - but it depends as which point in time you place yourself.

Today, the 570S is meant to extend the range but in reality it is a medium term replacement to the 650S. The 650S own replacement will be aimed at Aventador, which the current 650S cannot compete with in terms of stance and what buyers in that market want from a car at that price.

So yes, in the medium term, current 650S owners will loose out. As soon as the 570 gets active aero and clever suspension plus more power. Which it will need to keep on selling.

But in the short term. I know that I rather have a 650bhp car with all the bells and whittles, with the driver focuses interior, rather than the more simple and less powerful 570s. So, I think the remaining 650S will go well and keep their value well.

But in 18-24 months. The drop will be sudden and sharp.

We should not forget that the 12C/650S is quite unique in terms of what it provides. It is a car with Aventador level of performance that you can easily be used everyday. Unfortunately, I do not think its replacement will be as versatile.

All this makes the 12C such an incredible proposition. 99% of what the 650S is (having driven both extensively, anybody arguing otherwise is a Formula 1 driver). At even lower price point than the 570S ! Grab yours while you can !!

[anonymous-user]

TP321 said:

GRB, this is exactly the same thing that this guy said in 2011 when he paid £200k for his 12C....

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/m...

All arguments aside, that is seriously good value unless I am missing something.

[isaldiri]

TP321 said:

GRB, this is exactly the same thing that this guy said in 2011 when he paid £200k for his 12C....

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/m...

That car would have been more like £180k than £200k, possibly less with Iris/meridian being refunded later. Still a lot to drop but at least get your facts right.....

[SL550M]

I'm with garyhun, the 12C looks like exceptional value at c100-110k. I see there's also a volcano orange one for less than 120k as well, which looks sensational and, to my eyes, every bit the exotic supercar. These past few months I've been on the lookout for a 599 to replace my much loved 550, but I must confess these 12C's have turned my head. Anyone got any thoughts/experiences/warnings to help me make up my mind?

[isaldiri]

SL550M said:

I'm with garyhun, the 12C looks like exceptional value at c100-110k. I see there's also a volcano orange one for less than 120k as well, which looks sensational and, to my eyes, every bit the exotic supercar. These past few months I've been on the lookout for a 599 to replace my much loved 550, but I must confess these 12C's have turned my head. Anyone got any thoughts/experiences/warnings to help me make up my mind?

Don't sell your 550, especially for a 599.

Would suggest (for your own peace of mind if nothing else) to ensure any car you got comes with the extended warranty. Avoid ceramic brakes especially if tracking the car and get the lighter rims. And make sure you have some kind of protective film on the car as some paints are really expensive to repaint stonechips.

As a sports car there's no contest between the 599 and 12c, the 12c is a vastly better car to drive IMO.

[TP321]

isaldiri said:

That car would have been more like £180k than £200k, possibly less with Iris/meridian being refunded later. Still a lot to drop but at least get your facts right.....

OK £200k was for effect, but not a penny less than £188k with a refund of £5k for the iris. Whichever way you look at it, thats one HUGE drop especially as the owner will not even see £100k from this sale.

[isaldiri]

TP321 said:

OK £200k was for effect, but not a penny less than £188k with a refund of £5k for the iris. Whichever way you look at it, thats one HUGE drop especially as the owner will not even see £100k from this sale.

It's 40-45% of the value after 4 years. Outside of Ferrari mid engine V8s, that's not exactly out of line is it? Look at the SLS or other AMG mercs or Ferrari V12s for example. Compared against the 458 purely in terms of residuals, of course the 12c and now the 650 has got battered. However in any other metric, the 12c has done alright for a new car in the sector in my book. If residuals are your main criteria then Mclaren probably isn't going to be the car to get....

[SL550M]

Sadly, the 550 is already gone. Waved goodbye to it about 3 years ago, just before values started sky-rocketing. There are some days when I manage not to think about it!

[anonymous-user]

SL550M said:

I'm with garyhun, the 12C looks like exceptional value at c100-110k. I see there's also a volcano orange one for less than 120k as well, which looks sensational and, to my eyes, every bit the exotic supercar. These past few months I've been on the lookout for a 599 to replace my much loved 550, but I must confess these 12C's have turned my head. Anyone got any thoughts/experiences/warnings to help me make up my mind?

I was originally looking at the new Mercedes AMG GT or a 991 but, like you, might have to look at a 12C at those sort of prices.

[GlynnsportRacing]

isaldiri said:

It's 40-45% of the value after 4 years. Outside of Ferrari mid engine V8s, that's not exactly out of line is it? Look at the SLS or other AMG mercs or Ferrari V12s for example. Compared against the 458 purely in terms of residuals, of course the 12c and now the 650 has got battered. However in any other metric, the 12c has done alright for a new car in the sector in my book. If residuals are your main criteria then Mclaren probably isn't going to be the car to get....

I'm certainly no expert so would be grateful for those with more knowledge to comment. My observations are that so far the 650s has not been hit hard in the used market at all. I can only find 6 for sale & it seems to me that largely they're being offered at prices which pretty much reflect the new price less the vat - pretty normal for a car less than 12 months old?

Compare that with over 100 available 458's at prices which appear to me to have a lot higher percentage depreciation & it makes me feel the 650s is the more exclusive car & more likely to hold its value better, particularly as the press seem to praise it outside of the subjective "emotion" it may or may not evoke!

[isaldiri]

GlynnsportRacing said:

I'm certainly no expert so would be grateful for those with more knowledge to comment. My observations are that so far the 650s has not been hit hard in the used market at all. I can only find 6 for sale & it seems to me that largely they're being offered at prices which pretty much reflect the new price less the vat - pretty normal for a car less than 12 months old?

Compare that with over 100 available 458's at prices which appear to me to have a lot higher percentage depreciation & it makes me feel the 650s is the more exclusive car & more likely to hold its value better, particularly as the press seem to praise it outside of the subjective "emotion" it may or may not evoke!

New price less vat is a meaningless number IMO. It's something the dealers always like to spin by you to offer a crap p/x value but it isn't relevant. The next person buying it isn't going to be VAT exempt either and if he is, he claims it back from HMRC not the original buyer.

Don't want to be overly negative about this but the 650 is a car that is a maximum of 1 year old vs the 458 which has been in production since late 2009, not really a like for like comparison. You can find delivery mileage 650s at 10-15% below list prices (and maybe more) for sale due to cars being stocked as dealer inventory (lesson sadly not learnt from the 12c). That's hard hit on used car prices to me and not reflective of the car being in very strong demand despite the best efforts of GRB to proclaim otherwise. If the 650 follows the 12c and to be honest there is no real indication it should not, there is a big chunk that hits early on then the cars seem to stay a bit more stable after that.

If you can find a car that fits your spec, likely you can do it at a good price but be prepared to pay a decent chunk if you are ordering a new one exactly as you want i guess.