Discussion
TISPKJ said:
garyhun said:
voicey said:
Given the price of a new 540 is the same as a second hand 12C - why would anyone buy the 12C (serious question)?
Want new, prefer the looks etc etc etc etc....Im considering both curently, 12C will remain at this level indefinately I recon, 540 after first year can only fall some.
12C will remain the big brother, 1st model etc, but a new car would be nice.
The 12C is still a very special car.
voicey said:
Given the price of a new 540 is the same as a second hand 12C - why would anyone buy the 12C (serious question)?
serious question, agreed, but asked and answered frequently!!Here's a couple of reasons -
Like for like spec, the 12C is up to £25,000 less.
It will take less than 12 months for the 12C to be the rarer car and in 2 years which will be more valuable, a 2 year old 540 or 4 year old 12C?
Looks pretty aggressive on the streets. Can't accuse McLaren of being conservative with that one!
Re: the 12C, it will always have a market (usual routine: older model, still great performance, less cost, but not the most 'up to date') t'was ever thus, I think. In a few years the 650S replacement will come along and history will repeat itself. Doesn't make it any less of a fantastic machine.
Anyway isn't the 540 a bit slow? Only does 204mph or something. Snails pace
Re: the 12C, it will always have a market (usual routine: older model, still great performance, less cost, but not the most 'up to date') t'was ever thus, I think. In a few years the 650S replacement will come along and history will repeat itself. Doesn't make it any less of a fantastic machine.
Anyway isn't the 540 a bit slow? Only does 204mph or something. Snails pace
SELON said:
Looks pretty aggressive on the streets. Can't accuse McLaren of being conservative with that one!
Re: the 12C, it will always have a market (usual routine: older model, still great performance, less cost, but not the most 'up to date') t'was ever thus, I think. In a few years the 650S replacement will come along and history will repeat itself. Doesn't make it any less of a fantastic machine.
Anyway isn't the 540 a bit slow? Only does 204mph or something. Snails pace
No, it's a tortoise - 199mph.Re: the 12C, it will always have a market (usual routine: older model, still great performance, less cost, but not the most 'up to date') t'was ever thus, I think. In a few years the 650S replacement will come along and history will repeat itself. Doesn't make it any less of a fantastic machine.
Anyway isn't the 540 a bit slow? Only does 204mph or something. Snails pace
garyhun said:
Oye, you start talking future values and a certain poster will be along!!!
Yeah, sorry. 
OT - you popping over next week Gary?
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
breadvan said:
Yeah, sorry.
OT - you popping over next week Gary?
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Thanks for the heads up, that's the first time I've seen that.OT - you popping over next week Gary?
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
I'll try to get over if I can.
voicey said:
Given the price of a new 540 is the same as a second hand 12C - why would anyone buy the 12C (serious question)?
I hear you but... it's a matter of pre owned vs new car specced to your own colour choice, etc. Beyond that for me the 540/570 is the best design since the 12C, I saw it at the London show and there really isn't an angle it doesn't work from, a real stunner. I like the idea of 540 especially being slightly biased towards day to day driving, although I gather the 12C is very liveable with for a super car. The angle of the doors is apparently a big plus over the 12C/650's, requiring less space to open enough to get out or in... quite handy really! That said I'd still prefer regular doors but that's not very McLaren! They're both great cars though, tough call.
Congrats Gary, will be a long wait! :-)
Did see the 570S in the flesh few weeks ago (Amsterdam), and it was a black one, with brown interior. Very stealth from the outside, and warm from the inside.
Here few pics:
Rear:
Front:
On the front, it is different it looks similar to a 650S (which was there too), the back of course is the major differentiator.
Even with the same specs, I would go for the 540C/570S over the 12C/650S, since I find the rear of the earlier cars a bit boring. All (4) cars drive great though, I am sure. Drove a 12C Spider a while ago, and was impressed with the steering, sound (for a turbo charged car) and the ability to use it daily (not so bumpy as a Hurican or 458).
Keep posting updates!
(drive a RS5 as a daily driver, and consider the new R8, AMG GT S or this new McLaren).
Did see the 570S in the flesh few weeks ago (Amsterdam), and it was a black one, with brown interior. Very stealth from the outside, and warm from the inside.
Here few pics:
Rear:
Front:
On the front, it is different it looks similar to a 650S (which was there too), the back of course is the major differentiator.
Even with the same specs, I would go for the 540C/570S over the 12C/650S, since I find the rear of the earlier cars a bit boring. All (4) cars drive great though, I am sure. Drove a 12C Spider a while ago, and was impressed with the steering, sound (for a turbo charged car) and the ability to use it daily (not so bumpy as a Hurican or 458).
Keep posting updates!
(drive a RS5 as a daily driver, and consider the new R8, AMG GT S or this new McLaren).
Edited by AWV12 on Sunday 10th May 18:43
BTW, I think the car I did see is in Onyx Black (might be Storm Grey, but I think that would be lighter).
So beware if you want really black, then I would suggest Fire Black (use the configurator in 2 windows and see the difference!). Of course try to see it on large sample or on other car (650S, 12C) in real life first!
I would go for Fire Black with Saddle Tan interior and no carbon at all (I don't like it, and it is also very 2010-ish, so don't worry about resale value in a few years, and buy it only when you want it yourself!).
BTW2, it seems that some front, side and rear spoier (diffuser) are different in the 540C versus the 570S. As well as the standard wheels (both nice imho). More important is that the 570S comes standard with ceramic brakes (as well as P Zero Corsa, which you ony need when you track it so back to normal P Zero's).
Since Ceramic brakes on 4 wheels is normally a 10-12K Euro option, this explains already a big part of the price difference, of course together with 30 bhp difference (and maybe even more important: 60 Nm of torque).
So beware if you want really black, then I would suggest Fire Black (use the configurator in 2 windows and see the difference!). Of course try to see it on large sample or on other car (650S, 12C) in real life first!
I would go for Fire Black with Saddle Tan interior and no carbon at all (I don't like it, and it is also very 2010-ish, so don't worry about resale value in a few years, and buy it only when you want it yourself!).
BTW2, it seems that some front, side and rear spoier (diffuser) are different in the 540C versus the 570S. As well as the standard wheels (both nice imho). More important is that the 570S comes standard with ceramic brakes (as well as P Zero Corsa, which you ony need when you track it so back to normal P Zero's).
Since Ceramic brakes on 4 wheels is normally a 10-12K Euro option, this explains already a big part of the price difference, of course together with 30 bhp difference (and maybe even more important: 60 Nm of torque).
70proof said:
mb1 said:
All the engine internal parts melting may be.....
thought about this long and hard as a lot of manufacturers now have one engine with multiple c02 and bhp outputs....if the first engine out is the best, cannot see any R&D or manufacturing savings from then designing an engine with inferior parts to 'tone it down'.... far easier just to map it down....
if the more powerful engine has come later, fair enough.... better parts likely to have been used....
and any turbo engine can be tuned.....
AWV12 said:
Congrats Gary, will be a long wait! :-)
Did see the 570S in the flesh few weeks ago (Amsterdam), and it was a black one, with brown interior. Very stealth from the outside, and warm from the inside.
Here few pics:
Rear:
Front:
On the front, it is different it looks similar to a 650S (which was there too), the back of course is the major differentiator.
Even with the same specs, I would go for the 540C/570S over the 12C/650S, since I find the rear of the earlier cars a bit boring. All (4) cars drive great though, I am sure. Drove a 12C Spider a while ago, and was impressed with the steering, sound (for a turbo charged car) and the ability to use it daily (not so bumpy as a Hurican or 458).
Keep posting updates!
(drive a RS5 as a daily driver, and consider the new R8, AMG GT S or this new McLaren).
Now this is a very nice problem to have, have you got a photo/description of your RS5? I rather like them.Did see the 570S in the flesh few weeks ago (Amsterdam), and it was a black one, with brown interior. Very stealth from the outside, and warm from the inside.
Here few pics:
Rear:
Front:
On the front, it is different it looks similar to a 650S (which was there too), the back of course is the major differentiator.
Even with the same specs, I would go for the 540C/570S over the 12C/650S, since I find the rear of the earlier cars a bit boring. All (4) cars drive great though, I am sure. Drove a 12C Spider a while ago, and was impressed with the steering, sound (for a turbo charged car) and the ability to use it daily (not so bumpy as a Hurican or 458).
Keep posting updates!
(drive a RS5 as a daily driver, and consider the new R8, AMG GT S or this new McLaren).
Edited by AWV12 on Sunday 10th May 18:43
As for the new options their all going to be great although one would assume the R8 V10 plus would be quickest? However Mclaren will definitely feel and look the most special in my eyes, although fantastic cars/products they're not from an more bespoke manufacturer like ferrari/mclaren/lamborghini. I guess everyones different how they see that argument mind you - is it the 540c you will look at or the 570s (on the basis of brakes alone)? I think Mclaren are going from strength to strength now, just love the fact they've had the balls to take on ferrari, and purely from an accelerative point of view wipe the floor with them in my view. At the v8 super car level (i.e. 12c/650s) the fact theres no torsional loss between a coupe and spider and minimal weight difference can only be a good thing.
garyhun said:
Oye, you start talking future values and a certain poster will be along!!!
IM quite shocked RamboLambo (You can run but you can't hide GRB 
) hasn't posted about value yet, I rather like a lot of his posts it has to be said - always seems to stir the forum a bit which I find amusing.Gary have you chosen a spec yet on your 540c? Or several options?
Edited by mattf93 on Monday 11th May 07:39
garyhun said:
@Matt.
Basically my initial deposit has secured my slot. Once the production date is known, which will be 4 months prior to the production start, then I will need to pay additional deposit and spec the cat.
I expect to spec in Nov/Dec with delivery April/May.
Are you sticking with the 540c? Will be interesting to see if you change your mind to the 570 by the time you come to a spec (I have no idea what mclarens process would be for 'upgrading' but guessing you would be put further along the waiting list if you did so? Basically my initial deposit has secured my slot. Once the production date is known, which will be 4 months prior to the production start, then I will need to pay additional deposit and spec the cat.
I expect to spec in Nov/Dec with delivery April/May.
mattf93 said:
garyhun said:
@Matt.
Basically my initial deposit has secured my slot. Once the production date is known, which will be 4 months prior to the production start, then I will need to pay additional deposit and spec the cat.
I expect to spec in Nov/Dec with delivery April/May.
Are you sticking with the 540c? Will be interesting to see if you change your mind to the 570 by the time you come to a spec (I have no idea what mclarens process would be for 'upgrading' but guessing you would be put further along the waiting list if you did so? Basically my initial deposit has secured my slot. Once the production date is known, which will be 4 months prior to the production start, then I will need to pay additional deposit and spec the cat.
I expect to spec in Nov/Dec with delivery April/May.
That said, I can change at any time if I desire but, as you suggest, this will push me back possibly. Until the dealers understand how the allocation mix will work - 540 vs 570 - no one can really say right now what the numbers will be and how quickly they will be delivered. For example, if 90% of orders are for 570 will that put 540 production back to meet 570 demand? Or is the 540 production schedule totally separate? No one knows right now.
Not too sure on the looks of the front. The black looks better because it hides the thick black bands around the headlamps which you can see in the pictures of the silver prototype. Still looks better and much more different than most other marques. Haven't seen the 488 but think it looks to evolutionary compared to 458
cho said:
Not too sure on the looks of the front. The black looks better because it hides the thick black bands around the headlamps which you can see in the pictures of the silver prototype. Still looks better and much more different than most other marques. Haven't seen the 488 but think it looks to evolutionary compared to 458
The 488 is really a mid-life upgrade/facelift a la 360-430 and 348-355. The one after the 488 is the big change.Gassing Station | McLaren | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff