Dare I ask about the D word.......depreciation......
Discussion
I just (yesterday) bought a used 12C. I agonised over possible residuals and warranties. In the end I had 2 choices, a lower spec car with 22,000 miles or a higher spec car with only 5,000 miles.
The cars were only £2,000 in difference. However the higher mileage car also has the qualified warranty (£3,500) and Iris 2 hardware and reversing camera (£3,500). In addition the information on McLaren Life forum and general consensus seems to be higher miles are better for the car than low miles and multiple owners.
Also buying McLaren qualified gives you invitations to interesting McLaren events, the 'family' as they call it. So now I have a Volcano Orange 22,000 mile 12C which was reduced from £114.750 to £112,450. Its a lot of money but an amazing car.
I am hoping depreciation has bottomed out and the £5k annual warranty and servicing costs will actually mean it costs less to run (including depreciation) than say a new Cayman or Boxster.
My decision to buy a 12C came from first looking for a 996 GT3 and then a turbo where values are all over the place and I simply could not work out what the cars actual value was and what hidden expenditure there may be lurking. With the 12C its a lot simpler as they are all around the same price give or take mileage / spec so you know where you are.
In addition the warranty and newness provides a level of comfort. I can't wait to pick it up, its quite a step up from my 2002 996 targa (for sale if anyone is interested, manual, black just spent £5,600 at 9E).
The cars were only £2,000 in difference. However the higher mileage car also has the qualified warranty (£3,500) and Iris 2 hardware and reversing camera (£3,500). In addition the information on McLaren Life forum and general consensus seems to be higher miles are better for the car than low miles and multiple owners.
Also buying McLaren qualified gives you invitations to interesting McLaren events, the 'family' as they call it. So now I have a Volcano Orange 22,000 mile 12C which was reduced from £114.750 to £112,450. Its a lot of money but an amazing car.
I am hoping depreciation has bottomed out and the £5k annual warranty and servicing costs will actually mean it costs less to run (including depreciation) than say a new Cayman or Boxster.
My decision to buy a 12C came from first looking for a 996 GT3 and then a turbo where values are all over the place and I simply could not work out what the cars actual value was and what hidden expenditure there may be lurking. With the 12C its a lot simpler as they are all around the same price give or take mileage / spec so you know where you are.
In addition the warranty and newness provides a level of comfort. I can't wait to pick it up, its quite a step up from my 2002 996 targa (for sale if anyone is interested, manual, black just spent £5,600 at 9E).
Bispal said:
I just (yesterday) bought a used 12C. I agonised over possible residuals and warranties. In the end I had 2 choices, a lower spec car with 22,000 miles or a higher spec car with only 5,000 miles.
The cars were only £2,000 in difference. However the higher mileage car also has the qualified warranty (£3,500) and Iris 2 hardware and reversing camera (£3,500). In addition the information on McLaren Life forum and general consensus seems to be higher miles are better for the car than low miles and multiple owners.
Also buying McLaren qualified gives you invitations to interesting McLaren events, the 'family' as they call it. So now I have a Volcano Orange 22,000 mile 12C which was reduced from £114.750 to £112,450. Its a lot of money but an amazing car.
I am hoping depreciation has bottomed out and the £5k annual warranty and servicing costs will actually mean it costs less to run (including depreciation) than say a new Cayman or Boxster.
My decision to buy a 12C came from first looking for a 996 GT3 and then a turbo where values are all over the place and I simply could not work out what the cars actual value was and what hidden expenditure there may be lurking. With the 12C its a lot simpler as they are all around the same price give or take mileage / spec so you know where you are.
In addition the warranty and newness provides a level of comfort. I can't wait to pick it up, its quite a step up from my 2002 996 targa (for sale if anyone is interested, manual, black just spent £5,600 at 9E).
Great post and congrats!!The cars were only £2,000 in difference. However the higher mileage car also has the qualified warranty (£3,500) and Iris 2 hardware and reversing camera (£3,500). In addition the information on McLaren Life forum and general consensus seems to be higher miles are better for the car than low miles and multiple owners.
Also buying McLaren qualified gives you invitations to interesting McLaren events, the 'family' as they call it. So now I have a Volcano Orange 22,000 mile 12C which was reduced from £114.750 to £112,450. Its a lot of money but an amazing car.
I am hoping depreciation has bottomed out and the £5k annual warranty and servicing costs will actually mean it costs less to run (including depreciation) than say a new Cayman or Boxster.
My decision to buy a 12C came from first looking for a 996 GT3 and then a turbo where values are all over the place and I simply could not work out what the cars actual value was and what hidden expenditure there may be lurking. With the 12C its a lot simpler as they are all around the same price give or take mileage / spec so you know where you are.
In addition the warranty and newness provides a level of comfort. I can't wait to pick it up, its quite a step up from my 2002 996 targa (for sale if anyone is interested, manual, black just spent £5,600 at 9E).
That must be about the 6th or 7th person posting up about purchasing a 12c in recent weeks, it's good to see, hopefully the appetite for them at this level will help residuals as owners won't have to take a bath to get out of them.....enjoy!
Sarnie said:
Great post and congrats!!
That must be about the 6th or 7th person posting up about purchasing a 12c in recent weeks, it's good to see, hopefully the appetite for them at this level will help residuals as owners won't have to take a bath to get out of them.....enjoy!
Thanks. Its a simply a case of looking what you can get with the performance, heritage and quality at around £110k and nothing comes close. The competition is at least £30-40k more and even non-'supercars' like GT4's are at that level and they are not 'supercars' (granted they are super though) and you can't even buy one if you wanted too. So what is left to buy if £110 is your budget for a low volume new-ish super-car with F1 heritage and day-day usability?That must be about the 6th or 7th person posting up about purchasing a 12c in recent weeks, it's good to see, hopefully the appetite for them at this level will help residuals as owners won't have to take a bath to get out of them.....enjoy!
Bispal said:
Sarnie said:
Great post and congrats!!
That must be about the 6th or 7th person posting up about purchasing a 12c in recent weeks, it's good to see, hopefully the appetite for them at this level will help residuals as owners won't have to take a bath to get out of them.....enjoy!
Thanks. Its a simply a case of looking what you can get with the performance, heritage and quality at around £110k and nothing comes close. The competition is at least £30-40k more and even non-'supercars' like GT4's are at that level and they are not 'supercars' (granted they are super though) and you can't even buy one if you wanted too. So what is left to buy if £110 is your budget for a low volume new-ish super-car with F1 heritage and day-day usability?That must be about the 6th or 7th person posting up about purchasing a 12c in recent weeks, it's good to see, hopefully the appetite for them at this level will help residuals as owners won't have to take a bath to get out of them.....enjoy!
The forums continue to be a good source of buying information and support. There is clearly a number of owners trading into 650s and 675s from thier 12C's as far as I can tell.
At the price they have reached, even though that's a big figure in the real world, the available cars at that price range is very broad and the 12C is a fantastic option to have. Beautiful car to look at and drive.
[quote=Bispal]I just (yesterday) bought a used 12C. I agonised over possible residuals and warranties. In the end I had 2 choices, a lower spec car with 22,000 miles or a higher spec car with only 5,000 miles.
Congrats on new car, great choice of car.
They look stunning from all sides.
But the best bit is just how fantastic and fun they are to drive.
Why buy a supercar and not drive it.
After all that is what they were built for.
Congrats on new car, great choice of car.
They look stunning from all sides.
But the best bit is just how fantastic and fun they are to drive.
Why buy a supercar and not drive it.
After all that is what they were built for.
I actually went for the leather interior !!Dave R D said:
Congrats on new car, great choice of car.
They look stunning from all sides.
But the best bit is just how fantastic and fun they are to drive.
Why buy a supercar and not drive it.
After all that is what they were built for.
Absolutely, may you have many happy miles together. They look stunning from all sides.
But the best bit is just how fantastic and fun they are to drive.
Why buy a supercar and not drive it.
After all that is what they were built for.
Bispal said:
I just (yesterday) bought a used 12C. I agonised over possible residuals and warranties. In the end I had 2 choices, a lower spec car with 22,000 miles or a higher spec car with only 5,000 miles.
The cars were only £2,000 in difference. However the higher mileage car also has the qualified warranty (£3,500) and Iris 2 hardware and reversing camera (£3,500). In addition the information on McLaren Life forum and general consensus seems to be higher miles are better for the car than low miles and multiple owners.
Also buying McLaren qualified gives you invitations to interesting McLaren events, the 'family' as they call it. So now I have a Volcano Orange 22,000 mile 12C which was reduced from £114.750 to £112,450. Its a lot of money but an amazing car.
Good man. At this rate there'll be no more left! Your choice of colour is impeccable!The cars were only £2,000 in difference. However the higher mileage car also has the qualified warranty (£3,500) and Iris 2 hardware and reversing camera (£3,500). In addition the information on McLaren Life forum and general consensus seems to be higher miles are better for the car than low miles and multiple owners.
Also buying McLaren qualified gives you invitations to interesting McLaren events, the 'family' as they call it. So now I have a Volcano Orange 22,000 mile 12C which was reduced from £114.750 to £112,450. Its a lot of money but an amazing car.
I'm with you on mileage. Bought mine last week and it has 27k on the odo. Does it bother me? Absolutely not. She's been well maintained and past experience tells me there's a much better chance of it not suffering any major issues in my ownership.
Also. I think we'll start to see more 12cs with real world mileage. The thing with Ferrari is that it's too easy to put the odometer back. This puts pressure on owners to keep the mileages low (the less scrupulous create an artificially low average mileage), which means honest owners end up driving them less.
You can't actually knock the mileage back on a 12c so hoping this low mileage nonsense that blights other brands becomes a non issue for us.
SlartiF430 said:
Good man. At this rate there'll be no more left! Your choice of colour is impeccable!
I'm with you on mileage. Bought mine last week and it has 27k on the odo. Does it bother me? Absolutely not. She's been well maintained and past experience tells me there's a much better chance of it not suffering any major issues in my ownership.
Also. I think we'll start to see more 12cs with real world mileage. The thing with Ferrari is that it's too easy to put the odometer back. This puts pressure on owners to keep the mileages low (the less scrupulous create an artificially low average mileage), which means honest owners end up driving them less.
You can't actually knock the mileage back on a 12c so hoping this low mileage nonsense that blights other brands becomes a non issue for us.
Congratulations on your new 12c as well, seems there a lot of people getting in to them now to drive and not just sit in the garage. I am still having sleepless nights over picking a 22,000 miler over a 5,000 miler but I can't stop feeling that the lower mileage car has been used as a show pony with many launch starts while the higher miles was pampered by 1 owner. I may be wrong and if I trade it in for a 650s in 2 years what will a 32,000 mile car be worth over a 15,000 mile car! That aside I can't wait to pick it up and go for a long drive, that's what it's all about :-)I'm with you on mileage. Bought mine last week and it has 27k on the odo. Does it bother me? Absolutely not. She's been well maintained and past experience tells me there's a much better chance of it not suffering any major issues in my ownership.
Also. I think we'll start to see more 12cs with real world mileage. The thing with Ferrari is that it's too easy to put the odometer back. This puts pressure on owners to keep the mileages low (the less scrupulous create an artificially low average mileage), which means honest owners end up driving them less.
You can't actually knock the mileage back on a 12c so hoping this low mileage nonsense that blights other brands becomes a non issue for us.
I don't think we're alone. I think future owners will buy (from us) based on spec and condition rather than mileage. Besides, if you're looking to trade in then (from experience and reading other people's experiences on ph), there usually isn't a massive difference in what you're offered.
In the meantime enjoy it. What's a few miles when you work so hard to enjoy your money, also we want be worried about the money we might have lost on our cars when we're long gone :-)
In the meantime enjoy it. What's a few miles when you work so hard to enjoy your money, also we want be worried about the money we might have lost on our cars when we're long gone :-)
Having seen the 570s at a dealers and told the differences for a 540, I feel the latter represents incredible value when you compare it's looks, doors, performance etc vs the competition. Personally I feel for the uninitiated the 540/570 will look a more expensive car than the 650S.
If you take depreciation out of the picture , although I like the 12C, a 540 appears better value based on above points, plus the inclusion of 3 year warranty worth £10k vs 12C.
BUT if you take expected depreciation into account , the 12C may be the more sensible choice from a financial perspective. Who knows until the 570/540 reach a year old.
BTW dealer was stating 67% GFV for 570 on 3 yr / 5k miles pa.
If you take depreciation out of the picture , although I like the 12C, a 540 appears better value based on above points, plus the inclusion of 3 year warranty worth £10k vs 12C.
BUT if you take expected depreciation into account , the 12C may be the more sensible choice from a financial perspective. Who knows until the 570/540 reach a year old.
BTW dealer was stating 67% GFV for 570 on 3 yr / 5k miles pa.
Edited by GTD40 on Saturday 16th January 11:14
Bispal said:
SlartiF430 said:
Good man. At this rate there'll be no more left! Your choice of colour is impeccable!
I'm with you on mileage. Bought mine last week and it has 27k on the odo. Does it bother me? Absolutely not. She's been well maintained and past experience tells me there's a much better chance of it not suffering any major issues in my ownership.
Also. I think we'll start to see more 12cs with real world mileage. The thing with Ferrari is that it's too easy to put the odometer back. This puts pressure on owners to keep the mileages low (the less scrupulous create an artificially low average mileage), which means honest owners end up driving them less.
You can't actually knock the mileage back on a 12c so hoping this low mileage nonsense that blights other brands becomes a non issue for us.
Congratulations on your new 12c as well, seems there a lot of people getting in to them now to drive and not just sit in the garage. I am still having sleepless nights over picking a 22,000 miler over a 5,000 miler but I can't stop feeling that the lower mileage car has been used as a show pony with many launch starts while the higher miles was pampered by 1 owner. I may be wrong and if I trade it in for a 650s in 2 years what will a 32,000 mile car be worth over a 15,000 mile car! That aside I can't wait to pick it up and go for a long drive, that's what it's all about :-)I'm with you on mileage. Bought mine last week and it has 27k on the odo. Does it bother me? Absolutely not. She's been well maintained and past experience tells me there's a much better chance of it not suffering any major issues in my ownership.
Also. I think we'll start to see more 12cs with real world mileage. The thing with Ferrari is that it's too easy to put the odometer back. This puts pressure on owners to keep the mileages low (the less scrupulous create an artificially low average mileage), which means honest owners end up driving them less.
You can't actually knock the mileage back on a 12c so hoping this low mileage nonsense that blights other brands becomes a non issue for us.
GTD40 said:
BTW dealer was stating 67% GFV for 570 on 3 yr / 5k miles pa.
I appreciate its all conjecture but If that pegs the GFV of a 15k 570 at £100k at 3 years old - and we know that means it's real value will more likely be a bit more - they never over estimate - that would mean the 12C has leveled out at £100k?Edited by GTD40 on Saturday 16th January 11:14
All barring catastrophes etc....
jmbdino said:
I think I was the previous owner of the car you have bought and I can put your mind at rest by saying that it was definitely pampered, never taken on a track, never used the launch control, never abused, never had a warning light come on or any problem with the car and I did mostly motorway miles. Ben at Ascot knows me if you want to check. You have a great car and I know you will enjoy it. Congratulations.
Hi, I hope it's your car, sounds like it, I know the reg number if you can send me a private message with your contact details It would be great to know for sure and find out a little more? ThanksNo need to self justify the car you bought surely. Not so long ago the last few buyers were all over low mileage cars only and refused to consider the high mileage ones and now seemingly it's high mileage is ok as the cars are used properly...
Realistically, cars like these are always going to be price sensitive to mileage and if less so (like the 12c with smaller spreads) the low mileage ones will always shift more easily. Thinking otherwise that people will in the future buy on history/condition rather than mileage is imo wishful thinking.
12c owner - 2011 car, 27k miles, always tracked (>8k track miles), never used to ponce around city centres/kings road, never abused (at least when cold
) and maintained obsessively. Likely worth nothing now given all that but hell it's liberating to jump into the thing and not have to even wonder about the impact of using it like the RS.
Realistically, cars like these are always going to be price sensitive to mileage and if less so (like the 12c with smaller spreads) the low mileage ones will always shift more easily. Thinking otherwise that people will in the future buy on history/condition rather than mileage is imo wishful thinking.
12c owner - 2011 car, 27k miles, always tracked (>8k track miles), never used to ponce around city centres/kings road, never abused (at least when cold
) and maintained obsessively. Likely worth nothing now given all that but hell it's liberating to jump into the thing and not have to even wonder about the impact of using it like the RS.Bispal said:
jmbdino said:
I think I was the previous owner of the car you have bought and I can put your mind at rest by saying that it was definitely pampered, never taken on a track, never used the launch control, never abused, never had a warning light come on or any problem with the car and I did mostly motorway miles. Ben at Ascot knows me if you want to check. You have a great car and I know you will enjoy it. Congratulations.
Hi, I hope it's your car, sounds like it, I know the reg number if you can send me a private message with your contact details It would be great to know for sure and find out a little more? ThanksSlartiF430 said:
I don't think we're alone. I think future owners will buy (from us) based on spec and condition rather than mileage. Besides, if you're looking to trade in then (from experience and reading other people's experiences on ph), there usually isn't a massive difference in what you're offered.
In the meantime enjoy it. What's a few miles when you work so hard to enjoy your money, also we want be worried about the money we might have lost on our cars when we're long gone :-)
I bought a good spec 25k mile spider rather than a lower mile coupe. And why not.... And I've done more miles in 6 maths than my annual mileage in a gt3. Because it's vastly more usable and enjoyable in a broader mix of driving conditions and roads. In the meantime enjoy it. What's a few miles when you work so hard to enjoy your money, also we want be worried about the money we might have lost on our cars when we're long gone :-)
kryten22uk said:
Is there anything particular to the 12C that would make it preferable to the 650S? i.e. would the prices of 12C ever become more than the 650S (or indeed further future updates)?
I don't think so. Some prefer the stance of the 12c (bigger air intakes) and think it has a more cohesive design. Other than they a 650 is a better car (I own a 12c). That said, the 12c was the first and sold in small numbers so that might make it more attractive to some. Gassing Station | McLaren | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff