570s - Reviews/ Videos/ Comparisons.
Discussion
kryten22uk said:
www.london.mclaren.com/cars/mclaren-financial-serv...
And the 650 Spyder one for comparison
www.london.mclaren.com/cars/mclaren-financial-serv...
Thanks, quite interesting and not a bad deal at all. £1300pcm depreciation seems pretty reasonable on a brand new £140k car. Plus financing costs of course, but I'm sure they can wiggle the numbers a bit to make those a little less painful.And the 650 Spyder one for comparison
www.london.mclaren.com/cars/mclaren-financial-serv...
Edited by kryten22uk on Tuesday 1st December 10:43
jw673 said:
It's the word guarantee, and you aren't missing it - the offer is.
That would be the one "minor" word that separates kryten22uk's "standard PCP" from HP with a Balloon and/or Lease Purchase. As without the guarantee, if it's underwater (TP321 - "it'll be worth 10p") you're on the hook for the difference. "Offer available to Qualifying HNW Individuals and Business Users only" - my money is on it being a Lease Purchase. I don't see the words PCP or guarantee anywhere on the offer page.
Not true. A PCP has an "OPTIONAL" final payment, all other balloon final payments are mandatory.That would be the one "minor" word that separates kryten22uk's "standard PCP" from HP with a Balloon and/or Lease Purchase. As without the guarantee, if it's underwater (TP321 - "it'll be worth 10p") you're on the hook for the difference. "Offer available to Qualifying HNW Individuals and Business Users only" - my money is on it being a Lease Purchase. I don't see the words PCP or guarantee anywhere on the offer page.
Another giveaway of a PCP is the mileage charges. An LP or HP dont care how many miles you put on the car, as you cant use it to wipe the debt.
PCP discussed in McLaren finance options:
http://www.london.mclaren.com/cars/mclaren-financi...
Finance house that provides the finance, discussing the PCP:
http://jbrcapital.com/blog/2015/06/05/mclaren-fina...
CAR magazine discussing the PCP, and stating the "beauty" of PCP is that you can walk away without paying balloon:
http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-news/industry-new...
Sytner site showing the McLaren deal as a PCP (albeit the 650s):
http://www.sytner.co.uk/mclaren/new-offers/650s-sp...
Edited by kryten22uk on Tuesday 1st December 12:18
kryten22uk said:
AMDBSNick said:
I repeat. Show me the word "guarantee"
Jees! What difference does it make whether the word "guarantee" is used?All I'm saying is that your downside depreciation is limited. Over 3 years you pay off £53k worth of depreciation (ie. £143k list down to 90k). Should the value of the car tank, you can hand the car back and walk away owing no more. So you never pay more than £53k depreciation regardless of how the car actually depreciates.
Call it a 'guarantee' or not, the terminology is just semantics, the principle is fundamental to the PCP deal.
McLaren Birmingham have now confirmed
kryten22uk said:
www.london.mclaren.com/cars/mclaren-financial-serv...
And the 650 Spyder one for comparison
www.london.mclaren.com/cars/mclaren-financial-serv...
Hello everyone, finally we have some DEPRECIATION numbers...how lovely! So, the 570 will not cost you more than Purchase Price less £90k. In the real world that will mean £160-90k = £70k loss over 3 years!!!!! Thats £1944 per month without the finance charges. And the 650 Spyder one for comparison
www.london.mclaren.com/cars/mclaren-financial-serv...
Edited by kryten22uk on Tuesday 1st December 10:43
That is no different to what 12C owners experienced, so no improvement so far...
Ferrari 458 owners would be shocked at that, and Porsche owners will think thats from another planet. Imagine if Ferrari actual sold a brand new car for £160k with options - even after 3 years it would still be worth £130k.
Edited by TP321 on Tuesday 1st December 14:00
Edited by TP321 on Tuesday 1st December 14:01
TP321 said:
Hello everyone, finally we have some DEPRECIATION numbers...how lovely! So, the 570 will not cost you more than Purchase Price less £90k. In the real world that will mean £160-90k = £70k loss over 3 years!!!!! Thats £1944 per month without the finance charges.
That is no different to what 12C owners experienced, so no improvement so far...
Ferrari 458 owners would be shocked at that, and Porsche owners will think thats from another planet. Imagine if Ferrari actual sold a brand new car for £160k with options - even after 3 years it would still be worth £130k.
Brand new California T for £155k (but needs +£15k options). After 3 years, must be trade-in of what £110k? Not that much better...That is no different to what 12C owners experienced, so no improvement so far...
Ferrari 458 owners would be shocked at that, and Porsche owners will think thats from another planet. Imagine if Ferrari actual sold a brand new car for £160k with options - even after 3 years it would still be worth £130k.
Porsche, brand new spec'd up 991 Turbo for £160k, after 3 years I wouldnt be surprised if it's £90k trade-in.
Brand new Bentley CGT will certainly do £70k in 3 years!!
New Merc SL65 AMG for £180k worth how many pence after 3 years!?
I don't think the 570 is that bad, so long as you go easy on the options, even 'regular' £80k-£100k cars often lose £10k-£15k+ per year. It seems many people buying these cars now are focussed on depreciation that is less than regular cars you see on every street corner, I don't think that is sustainable nor sensible to expect. These are still expensive cars, and should be bought as such. But for an expensive car, GFV of £90k after 3 years on a £140k (+ options) car is not half bad.
sealtt said:
Brand new California T for £155k (but needs +£15k options). After 3 years, must be trade-in of what £110k? Not that much better...
Porsche, brand new spec'd up 991 Turbo for £160k, after 3 years I wouldnt be surprised if it's £90k trade-in.
Brand new Bentley CGT will certainly do £70k in 3 years!!
New Merc SL65 AMG for £180k worth how many pence after 3 years!?
I don't think the 570 is that bad, so long as you go easy on the options, even 'regular' £80k-£100k cars often lose £10k-£15k+ per year. It seems many people buying these cars now are focussed on depreciation that is less than regular cars you see on every street corner, I don't think that is sustainable nor sensible to expect. These are still expensive cars, and should be bought as such. But for an expensive car, GFV of £90k after 3 years on a £140k (+ options) car is not half bad.
Yes but all of the above, can be used as you only daily driver. All of the above are far more practical and usuable on an everyday basis. They also dont have the mileage limitation that a mid engine seems to suffer from (12c, 458, Huracan). So i would expect them to lose more more as they will be used much more. The 570s still remains a weekend toy - no different to the 12c or 458. Its styling and limited numbers "should" offer better residuals than an Bentley, 911 or Merc....Porsche, brand new spec'd up 991 Turbo for £160k, after 3 years I wouldnt be surprised if it's £90k trade-in.
Brand new Bentley CGT will certainly do £70k in 3 years!!
New Merc SL65 AMG for £180k worth how many pence after 3 years!?
I don't think the 570 is that bad, so long as you go easy on the options, even 'regular' £80k-£100k cars often lose £10k-£15k+ per year. It seems many people buying these cars now are focussed on depreciation that is less than regular cars you see on every street corner, I don't think that is sustainable nor sensible to expect. These are still expensive cars, and should be bought as such. But for an expensive car, GFV of £90k after 3 years on a £140k (+ options) car is not half bad.
I have a sneaky feeling that the dark horse in this segment will be the new NSX...
TP321 said:
I have a sneaky feeling that the dark horse in this segment will be the new NSX...
I'm genuinely interested in the NSX too, but I think it'll be quite niche as a result of its branding (will always put some off compared to McLaren or Porsche etc), but especially so due to the limited numbers. AIUI they were fully sold out over a year ago? Or do you think they'll start to ramp up production after the initial restricted distribution?Coming back to the 570s, £90k after 3 years with 5k miles per annum, for a car that costs £160k equates to a residual of 56%. Nothing great with that - actually that is just industry standard. And if you are driving it daily, you wont be able to keep it witin the 15k miles over the 3 years. Certainly wouldnt make me jump to buy one.
Up until now McLaren owners tended to pile on a lot more miles than their immediate competitors like Ferraris and Lambo’s. And we all know how ridiculously sensitive the Ferrari market is too mileage. Therefore they have built a reputation in a very short period as a car you bought to drive, not just admire in the garage. Plus we now have a situation where some Ferrari dealers are refusing to take in anymore 458’s due to oversupply (138 in the classified at the moment) High residuals sound great until you have trouble actually selling the cars, you just have to look at how long some cars have gone unsold to see the problem building here
The 570S is aimed at a more practical segment. To call it a weekend car is plainly wrong when McLaren themselves as well as all those who have reviewed and driven the car has praised its practicality. To many this will be their only car and not a weekend toy. I myself am 6ft 2in tall and weight over 16 stone, with the seat pushed all the way back I can just about hit the peddles. It is very comfortable, has loads of internal storage space plus a very large boot.
The numbers look good compared to others in the segment, add the tiny build numbers and the fact that those that have driven it say it’s the best car in the segment, it appears to me that McLaren have built a winner
The 570S is aimed at a more practical segment. To call it a weekend car is plainly wrong when McLaren themselves as well as all those who have reviewed and driven the car has praised its practicality. To many this will be their only car and not a weekend toy. I myself am 6ft 2in tall and weight over 16 stone, with the seat pushed all the way back I can just about hit the peddles. It is very comfortable, has loads of internal storage space plus a very large boot.
The numbers look good compared to others in the segment, add the tiny build numbers and the fact that those that have driven it say it’s the best car in the segment, it appears to me that McLaren have built a winner
Sarnie said:
Streetrod said:
add the tiny build numbers
What do we know about build numbers? Someone posted in this thread that there were 1000 deposits down already!!TP321 said:
Hello everyone, finally we have some DEPRECIATION numbers...how lovely! So, the 570 will not cost you more than Purchase Price less £90k. In the real world that will mean £160-90k = £70k loss over 3 years!!!!! Thats £1944 per month without the finance charges.
That is no different to what 12C owners experienced, so no improvement so far...
Ferrari 458 owners would be shocked at that, and Porsche owners will think thats from another planet. Imagine if Ferrari actual sold a brand new car for £160k with options - even after 3 years it would still be worth £130k.
You really are a cretin - just because a finance package points at a predicted price does not in anyway predict what will happen in the market, you obviously have zero fThat is no different to what 12C owners experienced, so no improvement so far...
Ferrari 458 owners would be shocked at that, and Porsche owners will think thats from another planet. Imagine if Ferrari actual sold a brand new car for £160k with options - even after 3 years it would still be worth £130k.
king clue about finance because they do not take risks, and need to make sure that the idiot that decided to take credit can cover the cost of the car in the event that he decides to return it. On a side note - who the f
k uses PPI on a Supercar? it is the most expensive form of credit and you never actually own the car (until that final payment balloon payment) - in my experience people who can afford these cars are clever enough to know that you should never use credit, but clearly given they offer it someone is stupid enough! But back to depreciation - this givens no indication whatsoever - the reality is these cars are BETTER than all the competitors, and that is percolating through the industry and prices I am sure will hold up way better than you think (and seem to have a perverse thrill in seeing other people lose money)
NickOrangeCars said:
You really are a cretin - just because a finance package points at a predicted price does not in anyway predict what will happen in the market, you obviously have zero fking clue about finance because they do not take risks, and need to make sure that the idiot that decided to take credit can cover the cost of the car in the event that he decides to return it.
On a side note - who the fk uses PPI on a Supercar? it is the most expensive form of credit and you never actually own the car (until that final payment balloon payment) - in my experience people who can afford these cars are clever enough to know that you should never use credit, but clearly given they offer it someone is stupid enough!
But back to depreciation - this givens no indication whatsoever - the reality is these cars are BETTER than all the competitors, and that is percolating through the industry and prices I am sure will hold up way better than you think (and seem to have a perverse thrill in seeing other people lose money)
...who uses finance to buy a supercar? Everyone apart from you i recon. Really clever people invest their money and from the return of these investments, they pay for their toys. Why would anyone have £200k tied up in a depreciating (in the case of Mclaren, very depreciating...
-sorry had to!) asset? ...Hang on, maybe its you.....
king clue about finance because they do not take risks, and need to make sure that the idiot that decided to take credit can cover the cost of the car in the event that he decides to return it. On a side note - who the f
k uses PPI on a Supercar? it is the most expensive form of credit and you never actually own the car (until that final payment balloon payment) - in my experience people who can afford these cars are clever enough to know that you should never use credit, but clearly given they offer it someone is stupid enough! But back to depreciation - this givens no indication whatsoever - the reality is these cars are BETTER than all the competitors, and that is percolating through the industry and prices I am sure will hold up way better than you think (and seem to have a perverse thrill in seeing other people lose money)
...who uses finance to buy a supercar? Everyone apart from you i recon. Really clever people invest their money and from the return of these investments, they pay for their toys. Why would anyone have £200k tied up in a depreciating (in the case of Mclaren, very depreciating...
-sorry had to!) asset? ...Hang on, maybe its you.....TP321 said:
...who uses finance to buy a supercar? Everyone apart from you i recon. Really clever people invest their money and from the return of these investments, they pay for their toys. Why would anyone have £200k tied up in a depreciating (in the case of Mclaren, very depreciating...-sorry had to!) asset? ...Hang on, maybe its you.....
If one is long a supercar, as far as depreciation is concerned, it matters not whether one has an unleveraged position (cash paid in full) or a leveraged position (paid with a loan), one's exposure is the same. On an unrelated topic: if you want to invest 200k there are probably better ways of raising such funds than paying finance rates using a supercar as collateral.-sorry had to!) asset? ...Hang on, maybe its you.....NickOrangeCars said:
You really are a cretin - just because a finance package points at a predicted price does not in anyway predict what will happen in the market, you obviously have zero fking clue about finance because they do not take risks, and need to make sure that the idiot that decided to take credit can cover the cost of the car in the event that he decides to return it.
On a side note - who the fk uses PPI on a Supercar? it is the most expensive form of credit and you never actually own the car (until that final payment balloon payment) - in my experience people who can afford these cars are clever enough to know that you should never use credit, but clearly given they offer it someone is stupid enough!
But back to depreciation - this givens no indication whatsoever - the reality is these cars are BETTER than all the competitors, and that is percolating through the industry and prices I am sure will hold up way better than you think (and seem to have a perverse thrill in seeing other people lose money)
Of course it is a huge indication of future values, you may argue conservative due to wanting to ensure they don't get burned, or you may argue they are bullish to try and buoy up demand for the vehicles. Either way, it's one of the best clues we have to future values of these cars. If you are better than them at forecasting future asset values, in an asset in which they have infinitely more info & control than you, then you should truly be financing your vehicles as your investment returns must be astronomical king clue about finance because they do not take risks, and need to make sure that the idiot that decided to take credit can cover the cost of the car in the event that he decides to return it. On a side note - who the f
k uses PPI on a Supercar? it is the most expensive form of credit and you never actually own the car (until that final payment balloon payment) - in my experience people who can afford these cars are clever enough to know that you should never use credit, but clearly given they offer it someone is stupid enough! But back to depreciation - this givens no indication whatsoever - the reality is these cars are BETTER than all the competitors, and that is percolating through the industry and prices I am sure will hold up way better than you think (and seem to have a perverse thrill in seeing other people lose money)
PPI, huh? Few too many "Have I got PPI dot com" adverts I think...
PCP I think is what you meant, and it's absolutely not 'the most expensive' form of credit. Interest Rates are often fairly competitive and the financing comes with an inbuilt option (to sell) which is extremely valuable and should not be underestimated, I personally love the 'worst case' protection - i.e. see out the full PCP deal, what's the most it could cost, anything else is a bonus. That way you can leave speculation of future 570s values to the experts and get on with enjoying the car, using up your 10k annual mileage allowance.
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