So who's getting an i3?

[MrBig]

I would only consider spending someone else's money on one to be honest. I'd be far too concerned about fuel cell tech becoming more mainstream and arse dropping out of the EV market.

If I could run one as a company car and dodge the tax for a few years then it might be something I would take more seriously, but why oh why did they have to make it look like that?!? What's wrong with an EV 1/2/3 series?

My biggest issue with these cars is they have look like something out of a sci-fi film. Why?!? Do they think they can only sell them as Eco status symbols to self-righteous greenies? This coupled with my 80+ mile a day commute means they're not for me.

[TimJMS]

MrBig said:

...My biggest issue with these cars is they have look like something out of a sci-fi film. Why?!? Do they think they can only sell them as Eco status symbols to self-righteous greenies? This coupled with my 80+ mile a day commute means they're not for me.

I may be self - righteous, but I'm no 'greenie'. Funnily enough, I've bought one because I want one, and my i3 will rarely be doing less than 100 miles a day during the week.

[C.A.R.]

0llie said:

I spotted one out and around this morning, I think they look great (certainly striking).

Gunnels Wood Road, Stevenage?

I didn't see one but it makes sense as the BMW dealership is just up the road from there. At present they have a 'Batmobile' on display on the first floor, which is a lot more interesting than anything battery powered...

[Robb F]

fjord said:

Electric cars piss me off. People think they are going to save the world with electric fking cars.

I reckon a Boeing 747 burns more fuel in an hour than you would in a whole year of driving a 1.9d.

And for crying out loud,

This:


is still connected to this:

No argument at all with what you're saying, but just to stop the common misconception about horribly polluting powerstations.

[RossP]

I can confirm that I do not think buying an i3 will save the planet.

Nor would I consider myself a 'greenie'.

[Devil2575]

Robb F said:

fjord said:

Electric cars piss me off. People think they are going to save the world with electric fking cars.

I reckon a Boeing 747 burns more fuel in an hour than you would in a whole year of driving a 1.9d.

And for crying out loud,

This:


is still connected to this:

No argument at all with what you're saying, but just to stop the common misconception about horribly polluting powerstations.

I'd argue with what he is saying.

Electricity is produced in powerstations which don't tend to be located in town centres. This moves the source of polution from town centre roads to industrial sites which have high stacks so don't pump out pollution at ground level. Electricity generation can be through a number of routes including wind, solar, Nuclear, gas etc. Non of these produce as much pollution as an internal combustion engine. Energy generation is a powerstations business and so maximum efficiency is the name of the game. It is not with many of the cars on our roads. I'm pretty sure the overall efficiency of an electric car running on natural gas dervived power is a good deal better than a petrol car.

[simoid]

Devil2575 said:

I'm pretty sure the overall efficiency of an electric car running on natural gas dervived power is a good deal better than a petrol car.

Has anyone done numbers?

[Otispunkmeyer]

B5NXJ said:

Mr GrimNasty said:

Devil2575 said:

TransverseTight said:

its funny how the same old battery myths come up again. and again.

Those who have a deep routed desire not to see electric cars suceed will continue to perpetuate the myths regardless of how untrue they have been shown to be.

I think it's mamazing just how fast the technology is moving at the moment and I don't doubt that in another 10 years electric cars will be mainstream.

There's no myth. Unless you can afford to run different cars for different purposes, one being extremely expensive and limiting and ultimately completely redundant and not at all green in reality - battery electric cars are a dead limb of the evolutionary tree of the car.

Battery technology is NOT going to improve significantly enough to change this fact. It is a scientific impossibility.

How can you be so sure??

They have their work cut out for them though, do the battery boys. I do hope they'll get there but last week a guy from Argonne national labs dropped by to give a presentation about a low temperature combustion, compression ignition engine that uses pump gas (all the benefits of more efficient diesel combustion, with none of the emissions problems). He expects the ICE to still be the major motive force for the next 70 odd years at least. He showed us a graph of how battery tech as come on in the last 100 or so years and there is a great increase in energy densities with time, a five fold increase I think. Nothing to be sniffed at. But when compared to traditional fuels that whole development of battery power got squashed into the very bottom left of the graph, while petrol and diesel are way out over to the right. A bit like this:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_RCGoYwj_cwA/S3w8W4YOk0I/...

I don't think many people appreciate the power that flows through their hands when they're at the filling station. Serious energy content in liquid fuel. Given how long its taken batteries to reach that bottom left hand side.... how long do you think it will take to reach where current fuels are? which are still miles ahead even if we chop the numbers to reflect tapproimate efficiency of 40% for an ICE. Granted he is an engine man so of course, BEVs aren't going to get a lot of air time.

I hope they get there, but its going to need a break through to get it done in reasonable enough time to make BEVs a real possibility for most people. The next thing they are working on battery wise looked promising, a clear boost in energy density over Li-ion, I forget what it was called though and it wasn't sulphur based. I'll have to dig about, but the energy densities they were looking at would probably boost capacity by 50% at least for the same size battery. We already have BEVs capable of a good 200 miles so we'd be getting close to some petrol cars.

Of course I am also forgetting that an electric drive train is much more efficient that the one with the ICE in it. So the goal posts are favourably moved, i.e. we don't need the vast energy density of petrol or diesel.

[Fish]

RossP said:

On another note. Which home charging point is everyone going for?

I am currently favouring the Chargemaster option. It's only £95 for the 7KW version (free for 3KW) versus £300+ for the BMW one which seems to offer no advantages.

I think there are other options too but I haven't looked at them in depth (hoping someone else who will be along shortly has).

I've had the chargemaster option fitted in black and I'm very happy with the kit(obviously not used it yet thought!)

I drove the i3 today and am very impressed. It has the best steering of any normal car I have driven for a long time. Gets upto 75mph fine for dual carriageway work and at lower speeds is really quick of the mark.

The regenerative braking is really very strong an feels weird at first but you soon adjust then it feels normal.

I'm actually quite excited about it.

I've got a delivery date of week 8 or early mid Feb, I'm the first REX customer in Derby and apparently orders taken now are July delivery.

[Fish]

RossP said:

Do you have a delivery date yet? As mine is going to the pure electric I think I may get mine first...

What colour / trim have you ordered?

Ross I've got the Arranvai Grey (flat grey) with standard interior, pronav heated seats and LED lights...

[DonkeyApple]

Saw one on the A40 near Witney on Saturday. It's larger than I thought. Looked nice for a runabout.

[Devil2575]

simoid said:

Devil2575 said:

I'm pretty sure the overall efficiency of an electric car running on natural gas dervived power is a good deal better than a petrol car.

Has anyone done numbers?

I've seem some data somewhere but it was a while ago.

A quick google found this:

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-efficiency/vehi...

[shoestring7]

simoid said:

Devil2575 said:

I'm pretty sure the overall efficiency of an electric car running on natural gas dervived power is a good deal better than a petrol car.

Has anyone done numbers?

Doh! Why on earth didn't those dunderhead engineers at BMW, Renault etc. etc. do this calculation before troubling us with all this 'its-a-revolution-in-motoring-and-we're-going-to-completely-re-engineer-our-business' nonsense.

SS7
Oh wait, its possible they might have done this. It turns out the electric motors are much more efficient that IC ones, tank-to-wheels is 3x more efficient, but well-to-wheel efficiency is very dependent on the source of power, which varies from day to day and country to country.

[DonkeyApple]

shoestring7 said:

simoid said:

Devil2575 said:

I'm pretty sure the overall efficiency of an electric car running on natural gas dervived power is a good deal better than a petrol car.

Has anyone done numbers?

Doh! Why on earth didn't those dunderhead engineers at BMW, Renault etc. etc. do this calculation before troubling us with all this 'its-a-revolution-in-motoring-and-we're-going-to-completely-re-engineer-our-business' nonsense.

SS7
Oh wait, its possible they might have done this. It turns out the electric motors are much more efficient that IC ones, tank-to-wheels is 3x more efficient, but well-to-wheel efficiency is very dependent on the source of power, which varies from day to day and country to country.

Let's not forget that currently 99.99% of BMW sales are derived from ICE units so they can't go overboard on saying ICE is crap.

[mids]

Fish said:

I drove the i3 today and am very impressed. It has the best steering of any normal car I have driven for a long time. Gets upto 75mph fine for dual carriageway work and at lower speeds is really quick of the mark.

The regenerative braking is really very strong an feels weird at first but you soon adjust then it feels normal.

I'm actually quite excited about it.

I drove a REx car today as well and was also pleasantly surprised by the steering feel. Combined with the low speed acceleration and small size it's very pointy and squirty. Should brighten up the commute a bit, makes a change from a diesel at least.

For my spec, I've gone with REx to avoid public charging as much as I can. I don't really care what the i3 looks like (which is obvious most haters on here will say ) so I have no cosmetic options i.e. non-metallic arravani, bog standard wheels, no tints, etc. I've then gone winter pack, HK, suite interior, LED and the driving assist pack. Buying it through my company and think I'll be keeping it a few years.

[J4CKO]

fjord said:

Electric cars piss me off. People think they are going to save the world with electric fking cars.

I reckon a Boeing 747 burns more fuel in an hour than you would in a whole year of driving a 1.9d.

And for crying out loud,

This:


is still connected to this:

A Boeing 747 will burn about 600 gallons per hour, the average car doing 30 mpg for 10,000 would burn 300 odd.

An electric car is around three to four times more efficient in terms of energy usage than a conventional petrol engine, and yes it does move the pollution
but it is less pollution.

And anyway, who says people are choosing EV's just to be eco friendly ? the fact that they are making more financial sense, A Leaf costs a couple of quid to charge and does 90-100 miles, is smooth, quiet and torquey, it avoids congestion charges and VED.

[covmutley]

My commute is 80 miles a day so 'in range' but its 95% motorway. I will be interested to see what impact motorway speed has on range.

If I could do it all electric, I'd probably be looking at a 3k annual fuel saving compared to my current car.

[crazy about cars]

Saw one in a shopping centre in a BMW "pop up" shop and I must say I quite like the interior. Very stylish urban commuter and surprisingly spacious inside too. Not too sure about the price though once specced up...

[rallycross]

not seen one yet but a contact within BMW said they had already sold the full allocation of i3's due for the UK, sounds like a long waiting list if true.

Edited by rallycross on Monday 18th November 19:43

[scrwright]

How much energy does it take to charge one of these things up? Sod the green side of things, how long before electric car charging will put a strain on UK electricity generation? (not trolling, but has someone done the maths?)