Would you buy a hybrid/electric car?
Discussion
Well, despite them having a lot of experience in this field and offering a hybrid version of most of their vehicles, I wouldn't buy a Toyota hybrid. Slow, heavy and mediocre handling. The fuel economy isn't that impressive either really, when any diesel worth its salt will do 50mpg+ and a decent turbocharged petrol will do close to that too (the 1.2 Golf that I hired recently although not that quick at the top end, was plenty lively enough at lower rpm and did an easy 45mpg). They only really make sense if you drive into Central London regularly (which I don't). Likewise, the Nissan Leaf. 30k for a rather bland, dull hatchback with a very limited range. No thanks.
These three cars however do intrigue me and make me wonder whether hybrid/electric has some merit.
Honda CRZ
Well for a start, it has a manual transmission which I like. Does any other hybrid offer this? Secondly, it looks a bit like a 1980s Honda CRX, which is a car that I am quite fond of. I think that it would potentially make a stylish, economical and different commuter amongst the sea of diesel Golfs, A3s and 1-Series (a MINI of some description would be the only other viable alternative). Not that fast but that's not necessarily a problem if it handles well (the Ford Puma was always a fun steer despite low power) but a bit more power might have been nice. I'm also a bit confused about the seating situation. I thought it was a 2+2 but in pictures of ones for sale that I have seen here (Canada) it doesn't appear to have rear seats, which I would want, as I have two young children. Still on sale here but have Honda quietly withdrawn it from sale in the UK (can't find any details on its website)?
BMW i8
I'm not sure if it's good looking but it does look very cool and futuristic (laser-powered headlamps for instance) and yes, it's a cliche but it could actually be the supercar that you really can use every day. Only 30mpg+ rather than the claimed 134mpg but that's still pretty good for the performance and obviously better if you're running solely in electric mode. However, it shares an engine with the MINI Cooper (albeit in a higher standard of tune) that costs less than a fifth of the price. Would it not be even better (and not much less economical) with an M3 engine plus electric hybrid? Difficult to choose one over an AMG GT, Audi R8 or Nissan GTR for the same/less money when they all have "proper" engines though (or am I missing the point)?
Tesla Model S
Well apart from the relatively high price, this is quite an easy car to make a case for. Quite good looking and different, more practical than a conventional super saloon (two boots, hatchback, option of extra seats etc), fast , decent range and peanuts to run. There are only a handful of journeys when a M5/RS6/AMG Merc would be more convenient i.e, on a really long road trip, it's quicker to refill a petrol car than recharge a hybrid but the rest of the time, it makes the others seem a bit silly! I would love one apart from I guess it's missing a heart (a bit of passion and emotion) but with one of these at your diposal for the mundane driving, imagine the bonkers car that you could own for fun!
Can you see the benefits of hybrid/electric at the present time and are there any hybrid/electric vehicles that you would be tempted to own at the moment?
These three cars however do intrigue me and make me wonder whether hybrid/electric has some merit.
Honda CRZ
Well for a start, it has a manual transmission which I like. Does any other hybrid offer this? Secondly, it looks a bit like a 1980s Honda CRX, which is a car that I am quite fond of. I think that it would potentially make a stylish, economical and different commuter amongst the sea of diesel Golfs, A3s and 1-Series (a MINI of some description would be the only other viable alternative). Not that fast but that's not necessarily a problem if it handles well (the Ford Puma was always a fun steer despite low power) but a bit more power might have been nice. I'm also a bit confused about the seating situation. I thought it was a 2+2 but in pictures of ones for sale that I have seen here (Canada) it doesn't appear to have rear seats, which I would want, as I have two young children. Still on sale here but have Honda quietly withdrawn it from sale in the UK (can't find any details on its website)?
BMW i8
I'm not sure if it's good looking but it does look very cool and futuristic (laser-powered headlamps for instance) and yes, it's a cliche but it could actually be the supercar that you really can use every day. Only 30mpg+ rather than the claimed 134mpg but that's still pretty good for the performance and obviously better if you're running solely in electric mode. However, it shares an engine with the MINI Cooper (albeit in a higher standard of tune) that costs less than a fifth of the price. Would it not be even better (and not much less economical) with an M3 engine plus electric hybrid? Difficult to choose one over an AMG GT, Audi R8 or Nissan GTR for the same/less money when they all have "proper" engines though (or am I missing the point)?
Tesla Model S
Well apart from the relatively high price, this is quite an easy car to make a case for. Quite good looking and different, more practical than a conventional super saloon (two boots, hatchback, option of extra seats etc), fast , decent range and peanuts to run. There are only a handful of journeys when a M5/RS6/AMG Merc would be more convenient i.e, on a really long road trip, it's quicker to refill a petrol car than recharge a hybrid but the rest of the time, it makes the others seem a bit silly! I would love one apart from I guess it's missing a heart (a bit of passion and emotion) but with one of these at your diposal for the mundane driving, imagine the bonkers car that you could own for fun!
Can you see the benefits of hybrid/electric at the present time and are there any hybrid/electric vehicles that you would be tempted to own at the moment?
I think the Merc C350E is going to be an interesting car, especially for company car drivers.
Petrol turbo with plug in hybrid electric.
If you can't be bothered to read the press release, in round figures it's
0-60 6 seconds
150mph
£40,000
50 CO2
http://media.daimler.com/dcmedia/0-921-656505-1-17...
Petrol turbo with plug in hybrid electric.
If you can't be bothered to read the press release, in round figures it's
0-60 6 seconds
150mph
£40,000
50 CO2
http://media.daimler.com/dcmedia/0-921-656505-1-17...
I DID buy a Nissan Leaf.
The only compromise is the range. It's comfortable, well-equipped, quiet and fun to drive. The way it takes off is fantastic fun - you can embarrass much more powerful petrol cars easily. Runs out of puff by 50mph though. Takes a while to get up to 70.
I love it. It means all my s
tty miles are eaten up by it so my sports cars can do sunny days, highdays and holidays.
The only compromise is the range. It's comfortable, well-equipped, quiet and fun to drive. The way it takes off is fantastic fun - you can embarrass much more powerful petrol cars easily. Runs out of puff by 50mph though. Takes a while to get up to 70.
I love it. It means all my s
tty miles are eaten up by it so my sports cars can do sunny days, highdays and holidays.white_goodman said:
Honda CRZ
Well for a start, it has a manual transmission which I like. Does any other hybrid offer this? Secondly, it looks a bit like a 1980s Honda CRX, which is a car that I am quite fond of. I think that it would potentially make a stylish, economical and different commuter amongst the sea of diesel Golfs, A3s and 1-Series (a MINI of some description would be the only other viable alternative). Not that fast but that's not necessarily a problem if it handles well (the Ford Puma was always a fun steer despite low power) but a bit more power might have been nice. I'm also a bit confused about the seating situation. I thought it was a 2+2 but in pictures of ones for sale that I have seen here (Canada) it doesn't appear to have rear seats, which I would want, as I have two young children. Still on sale here but have Honda quietly withdrawn it from sale in the UK (can't find any details on its website)?
According to wikipedia: 'excluding North American models where the backseat is removed'Well for a start, it has a manual transmission which I like. Does any other hybrid offer this? Secondly, it looks a bit like a 1980s Honda CRX, which is a car that I am quite fond of. I think that it would potentially make a stylish, economical and different commuter amongst the sea of diesel Golfs, A3s and 1-Series (a MINI of some description would be the only other viable alternative). Not that fast but that's not necessarily a problem if it handles well (the Ford Puma was always a fun steer despite low power) but a bit more power might have been nice. I'm also a bit confused about the seating situation. I thought it was a 2+2 but in pictures of ones for sale that I have seen here (Canada) it doesn't appear to have rear seats, which I would want, as I have two young children. Still on sale here but have Honda quietly withdrawn it from sale in the UK (can't find any details on its website)?
white_goodman said:
LordGrover said:
According to wikipedia: 'excluding North American models where the backseat is removed'
Bugger! I wonder why. Would have to move back to the UK if I wanted one then!Handy for reducing the insurance group rating as it means it's no longer a two seater.
GeorgeMackmurdie said:
I have looked at converting Rover vehicle to electric power. I have a long history of coming outwith innovative ideas around Rover cars. Anyone who Google my name will see that.
George Mackmurdie.
I'd never heard of you until now George but having followed your advice... wow, just wow! I wouldn't encourage people to google your name when it brings up a list of allegations of fraud, theft and ineptitude. I'm sure that these are unfair of course.George Mackmurdie.
I think we'll almost certainly end up replacing the Skoda with a Tesla Model-3 in five or six years' time. I don't think we'll ever buy another family car with an internal combustion engine driving the wheels.
We will certainly never buy a diesel. Hateful things.
We will certainly never buy a diesel. Hateful things.
Edited by kambites on Monday 23 March 17:25
Yes, I'd consider the CRZ as my next car, or as an option for the wife. If I were buying for her I'd also be looking at the Insight and Prius, which I also really like, but the CRZ would be my pick of the three. I'd much sooner have a hybrid than some droning diesel, if that were the choice!
Edited by Baryonyx on Monday 23 March 17:26
The first gen Insight is a fabulous car, I sold mine last year because I wasn't using it enough. Hybrids really do not like standing for more than a few days. First gen Insights are great fun and really do have a similar feel to an Elise, but at much slower speeds and "hypermiling" can become addictive. They are difficult to find, my 2002 car was very good but not perfect and sold easily for over £5k.
The Ampera is a good choice if range anxiety is an issue, they drive nicely although hardly ever see them.
Second gen Leaf is best of normal cars.
However, drive a Tesla Model S and it all changes - it really does make everything else feel about 50 years out of date.
The Ampera is a good choice if range anxiety is an issue, they drive nicely although hardly ever see them.
Second gen Leaf is best of normal cars.
However, drive a Tesla Model S and it all changes - it really does make everything else feel about 50 years out of date.
white_goodman said:
Well, despite them having a lot of experience in this field and offering a hybrid version of most of their vehicles, I wouldn't buy a Toyota hybrid. Slow, heavy and mediocre handling. The fuel economy isn't that impressive either really, when any diesel worth its salt will do 50mpg+ and a decent turbocharged petrol will do close to that too
I suppose it depends on what you're comparing them too, but the Toyota hybrids are an easy match for a 'standard' 140 or so bhp Diesel, in terms of performance and economy. If anything, their performance is more accessible due to having more or less full power available at any road speed.I'd suggest the Toyotas are a reasonable alternative to a run of the mill equivalent from any of the other manufacturers, and, at least from my experience of the Auris, will easily out handle a Golf. Obviously if you're trying to compare one to a sports car, they're crap, but on a like for like basis, they're very comparable. Steering feel is non-existent though, but grip and braking power is astonishing for what is an ordinary family car.
Having said that, they're not particularly exciting, but then nothing equivalent is either.
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