Model S 90D - high mileage, range, depreciation & other bits
Discussion
ORD said:
JonV8V said:
Where do get your timings from? Longest is 250 mile trip, needs a 50 mile top up if he can't charge at his destinations which he may be able to do, and at 200mph+ charging that's 15 mins while he gets a coffee.
I even make that more than the minimum wage in terms of free travel while charging
Seriously? You would be aiming to get home with 0 on the clock? No account of lower mileage than expected? No accounting for diversions? I even make that more than the minimum wage in terms of free travel while charging
Utterly unrealistic. If I were the OP, I would be imagining hours staring at the miles remaining, dawdling at 65 on the motorway and hoping like hell that I make it home. Not much fun.
The strong sweeping opinions that appear whenever EVs are mentioned (both positive and negative) show that they are at least more interesting that the bland eco-boxes that are clogging up our roads.
A V8 would be great but too expensive for me to run as my main car. I (especially now) dislike the harsh drivetrain combo of a manual diesel, with an average daily mileage of 25 miles, plus a driveway, I think it's nuts to drive anything BUT an EV now.
When my Tesla arrives (fingers crossed 2016 is a great year!) 7 days a week range won't be an issue.
BUT if you do more than 120 miles a day without access to both home charging and workplace charging most EVs are not suitable for you, so keep your diesel car (assuming you're not running a petrol over 30,000 miles a year)!
ORD said:
Huh? An EV is suitable for you. It is not for the OP.
It bloody well is if he charges at his destinations which he says he can do.ps 911s are tail happy light nosed death traps that throw you in a ditch once that fat arse gets out shape which it will do. Imagine the response I'd get if I posted that in the pork section? Thats about as accurate as your views on here. Its a legitimate concern for the OP and its been answered by people who know. You coming in with clap trap based on bugger all real knowledge is hardly helping anybodies cause.
London to Birmingham is easy. Drive to Birmingham and pull into the Supercharger at Junct 15 M1 on the way back down. Coffee and a leak later, you're good to go ;-)
If you put the route into the car's nav, it'll sort out charge points for you (if required) en-route.
Just ordered an S90D :-)
If you put the route into the car's nav, it'll sort out charge points for you (if required) en-route.
Just ordered an S90D :-)
LittleSwill said:
Could Tesla lend you one to see if their claims are actually true?
I don't think they have enough demo cars to go round. But I've heard stories if you've orders but the order hasn't been built and suddenly your not sure which battery pack to get, you might be able to persuade your sales managers to source you a 24 Hr test drive 
In any case I'm going to be doing a 360 mile round trip in my Leaf in the next few weeks....Prevous longest trip was 300 miles. Some of you guys worrying about doing a 250miles trip in a Tesla need to 'man up'
'Man up'? I think it depends how much time you have. I have had an i3 Rex for a month now (8 litres / 90 ish miles petrol and 1040 electric) and perhaps I should have got a tesla - I read of all the exploits of those in leafs and marvel at their determination! But I simply don't have the time to make a <100 mile range electric car fit into my pattern of travel. The northwest has a poor selection of rapid chargers for a start and charging rapid still adds a lot of time to any extended journey. Up to around 120 miles each way is ok (assuming rapid half way there and back and opportunity to charge at the designation) but beyond that it takes simply too long. For some of us, that is
I read these threads thinking 'Who has all that spare time to waste that they say adding 30 mins to every longish journey isn't a big deal?'. It completely rules out any EV for me and I am sure lots of others. But the technology will move on, hopefully, as EVs make huge sense for most types of car and usage.
ORD said:
I read these threads thinking 'Who has all that spare time to waste that they say adding 30 mins to every longish journey isn't a big deal?'. It completely rules out any EV for me and I am sure lots of others. But the technology will move on, hopefully, as EVs make huge sense for most types of car and usage.
How long does it take you to stop for petrol & a piss though? You're adding 30 minutes, you're adding ten at best and you need to weigh that against all the time spent filling up for your normal commute v charging at home. In the round I'd say most EV users are getting time back.Collectingbrass said:
How long does it take you to stop for petrol & a piss though? You're adding 30 minutes, you're adding ten at best and you need to weigh that against all the time spent filling up for your normal commute v charging at home. In the round I'd say most EV users are getting time back.
Most but not all - depends very much on the length of journey. For anyone who never does more than 50 miles there won't be much time lost if any (and yes probably even time saved) but for anyone regularly doing journeys over 100 miles the charging will destroy the time. I regularly do a round trip of 320 miles in one day - that's going to be five stops and rapid charges in my i3, so will only be feasible if I stay overnight. No way would I do it in the i3 in a day hit in a tesla I wouldoop north said:
Collectingbrass said:
How long does it take you to stop for petrol & a piss though? You're adding 30 minutes, you're adding ten at best and you need to weigh that against all the time spent filling up for your normal commute v charging at home. In the round I'd say most EV users are getting time back.
Most but not all - depends very much on the length of journey. For anyone who never does more than 50 miles there won't be much time lost if any (and yes probably even time saved) but for anyone regularly doing journeys over 100 miles the charging will destroy the time. I regularly do a round trip of 320 miles in one day - that's going to be five stops and rapid charges in my i3, so will only be feasible if I stay overnight. No way would I do it in the i3 in a day hit in a tesla I wouldCollectingbrass said:
How long does it take you to stop for petrol & a piss though? You're adding 30 minutes, you're adding ten at best and you need to weigh that against all the time spent filling up for your normal commute v charging at home. In the round I'd say most EV users are getting time back.
If it takes you 20 minutes to take a piss, you need that looked at I think it takes me 7 minutes or so to stop and fill up with petrol, which then lasts 300 miles. It's still a completely different league in terms of convenience.
Town cars are a different proposition. EVs are miles ahead of ICE cars for use in town.
Collectingbrass said:
ORD said:
I read these threads thinking 'Who has all that spare time to waste that they say adding 30 mins to every longish journey isn't a big deal?'. It completely rules out any EV for me and I am sure lots of others. But the technology will move on, hopefully, as EVs make huge sense for most types of car and usage.
How long does it take you to stop for petrol & a piss though? You're adding 30 minutes, you're adding ten at best and you need to weigh that against all the time spent filling up for your normal commute v charging at home. In the round I'd say most EV users are getting time back.I regularly do a ~320mile run, easily doable in a single tank (with another ~200 miles left over!)
No stops required.
To do that same journey in a 60kWh Tesla would require two stops, one on the way there and one on the way back due to the location of the supercharging points and as it would only be half empty it would take much longer to charge as well. In theory it could be done with one stop (on the way back) and with a shorter stop too but you're right at the range limit. So an extra hour to hour and a half. Even with the 85kWh Tesla you'll need a recharge as that's bang on the maximum range.
EV's really make sense round town, not for long journeys. I'm sure it'll come but it's not there yet. I'll be seriously interested when they can do 500miles before a recharge.
This thread is an exceptional case that shows with a bit of lateral thinking even higher milage users can fit an EV around their needs.
I've got an i3 REX and done 23,000 miles in the year I've had it. The last 15,000 I've only stuck 25 litres of fuel in it. Charge at night, drive to work 46 miles, charge drive back. Couple of trips over 100 miles using the Rex.
National travel statistics show 99% of all journeys are under 50 miles. Is the 1% that everyone seems to worry about. But the other 99% you start each trip with a full tank refill while you are parked up and never have to detour to a petrol station. In those 23000 miles I've used rapid charging about 2 dozen times and public chargers about 5 times. Not perfect but that's why I bought a REX. Using rapids about 50% of the time is just a 5 minute stop to get say 40% on the battery. More than enough to get home. There's an obsession in charging for 30 minutes to 80% because that's what they can do. But it doesn't mean you have to if your trip is only 100 miles.
A tesla is the only EV I'd recommend in the OPs use though. With superchargers, onsite 32A 3ph charging and 32A single phase at home that's a no disruption approach.
Regarding claiming expenses.. no to fuel. Yes to milage. You can however claim electricity used at home as a business expense like you would a phone line or if you ran a welding rig. It might be different for me though as I'm working via my own ltd company with my registered address at home. Worth checking with your company if they would be happy for you to stick a monthly claim in based on a separate meter in the car charger circuit. The one that I had with the grant scheme contains a smart meter with a readout. 4000kWh this year. Or about £320 (8p off peak) to do 23000 miles. The rest was free leccy at work or public points. Oh hang on 2000 miles was on petrol so not quite that good. Was doing 120/day @ my first clients site.
I've got an i3 REX and done 23,000 miles in the year I've had it. The last 15,000 I've only stuck 25 litres of fuel in it. Charge at night, drive to work 46 miles, charge drive back. Couple of trips over 100 miles using the Rex.
National travel statistics show 99% of all journeys are under 50 miles. Is the 1% that everyone seems to worry about. But the other 99% you start each trip with a full tank refill while you are parked up and never have to detour to a petrol station. In those 23000 miles I've used rapid charging about 2 dozen times and public chargers about 5 times. Not perfect but that's why I bought a REX. Using rapids about 50% of the time is just a 5 minute stop to get say 40% on the battery. More than enough to get home. There's an obsession in charging for 30 minutes to 80% because that's what they can do. But it doesn't mean you have to if your trip is only 100 miles.
A tesla is the only EV I'd recommend in the OPs use though. With superchargers, onsite 32A 3ph charging and 32A single phase at home that's a no disruption approach.
Regarding claiming expenses.. no to fuel. Yes to milage. You can however claim electricity used at home as a business expense like you would a phone line or if you ran a welding rig. It might be different for me though as I'm working via my own ltd company with my registered address at home. Worth checking with your company if they would be happy for you to stick a monthly claim in based on a separate meter in the car charger circuit. The one that I had with the grant scheme contains a smart meter with a readout. 4000kWh this year. Or about £320 (8p off peak) to do 23000 miles.
The rest was free leccy at work or public points. Oh hang on 2000 miles was on petrol so not quite that good. Was doing 120/day @ my first clients site.Edited by TransverseTight on Thursday 21st January 02:42
interesting thread!
Found this by a bit of t'internet searching trying to get a real world range figure.
My commute is about 95 miles each way and 90 miles of that is motorway.
I usually sit at around 85-90ish depending on traffic levels and looking at the P85/90/100 think it doesn't quite have the range for my needs if you include adverse weather conditions/cold/rain etc.
Would prefer at least 220-230 range with the above use.
Anyone care to update the thread with any new range info?
Found this by a bit of t'internet searching trying to get a real world range figure.
My commute is about 95 miles each way and 90 miles of that is motorway.
I usually sit at around 85-90ish depending on traffic levels and looking at the P85/90/100 think it doesn't quite have the range for my needs if you include adverse weather conditions/cold/rain etc.
Would prefer at least 220-230 range with the above use.
Anyone care to update the thread with any new range info?
chillo said:
interesting thread!
Found this by a bit of t'internet searching trying to get a real world range figure.
My commute is about 95 miles each way and 90 miles of that is motorway.
I usually sit at around 85-90ish depending on traffic levels and looking at the P85/90/100 think it doesn't quite have the range for my needs if you include adverse weather conditions/cold/rain etc.
Would prefer at least 220-230 range with the above use.
Anyone care to update the thread with any new range info?
190 miles is really tight for comfort on a 90D as a daily mileage. I did 145 round trip for a while and it was ok but not massively so. I used to go to Leeds which was a 220 round trip and never managed it without charging. 85-90 kills range, anyone that claims in winter to be getting over 200 miles out of a 90D is driving at or below the speed limit. Summer it would be possible, but boring... The P100D looks more promising but at something like £140k with the obligatory options. A 100D if they launch one would almost certainly not have a problem but given a 90D is now 100k, you'd probably be looking at 120k. Found this by a bit of t'internet searching trying to get a real world range figure.
My commute is about 95 miles each way and 90 miles of that is motorway.
I usually sit at around 85-90ish depending on traffic levels and looking at the P85/90/100 think it doesn't quite have the range for my needs if you include adverse weather conditions/cold/rain etc.
Would prefer at least 220-230 range with the above use.
Anyone care to update the thread with any new range info?
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