Tesla Y or...?

[SWoll]

Durzel said:

I'm seriously thinking of chopping in my M3P for an MG4 or something, as a stop gap, until Tesla actually deliver on some promises.

I've only done 4k miles in mine since getting it in March 2020, so it's just sat there depreciating, and has fallen behind in terms of stuff that is now supplied (e.g. heated steering wheel, heatpump, etc). I might as well get something that ought to barely depreciate instead.

For the money I don't think you can go wrong really. I also don't think the materials will be any worse than the Tesla, and may actually be better. You'd also have the added bonus of the basic stuff (auto headlights, wipers, etc) actually working properly, and I'm sure the headlights are decent too.

Bargain of the century in EV terms I think.

4k miles in 32 months? Myself and the wife WFH and have done since March 2020 and have still managed to cover 25k miles in that period.

Big fan of EV's as a daily but not sure I'd bother for that kind of mileage, that's a lot of money to tie up in a new car for something so rarely used no matter the model?

[lizardbrain]

Fair enough. Doesn’t sound like you need a long range EV really so can sympathise with your wish to ditch.

I would agree that any further UK updates to fsd are unlikely in next couple of years. Personally I’m content with autopilot being frozen as is, it does everything I need it to. Would definitely be pissed if I’d paid for for FSD, and I think maybe there is an argument they shouldn’t sell it in UK right now.

My headlights and windscreens wipers seem to work well
enough. Maybe once a month I have to override.

I’m coming up to four years and 25k miles so out of warranty soon. I’ve been considering trading in for the Y but my 3 is holding up really well so there is a good chance I’ll just keep it.

Need to have a test drive of the Y really.

[Durzel]

SWoll said:

Durzel said:

I'm seriously thinking of chopping in my M3P for an MG4 or something, as a stop gap, until Tesla actually deliver on some promises.

I've only done 4k miles in mine since getting it in March 2020, so it's just sat there depreciating, and has fallen behind in terms of stuff that is now supplied (e.g. heated steering wheel, heatpump, etc). I might as well get something that ought to barely depreciate instead.

For the money I don't think you can go wrong really. I also don't think the materials will be any worse than the Tesla, and may actually be better. You'd also have the added bonus of the basic stuff (auto headlights, wipers, etc) actually working properly, and I'm sure the headlights are decent too.

Bargain of the century in EV terms I think.

4k miles in 32 months? Myself and the wife WFH and have done since March 2020 and have still managed to cover 25k miles in that period.

Big fan of EV's as a daily but not sure I'd bother for that kind of mileage, that's a lot of money to tie up in a new car for something so rarely used no matter the model?

Yeah, it's a bit silly. I've lost a minimum of £10k on it and only had 4k worth of smiles. Could be worse though, most other cars of that sort of retail price would lose more than half their value in ~3 years.

I need to go in to the office on an adhoc basis so I don't think I could do without a car at all, and to be honest I don't particularly want to go back to an ICE car either.

[SWoll]

Durzel said:

Yeah, it's a bit silly. I've lost a minimum of £10k on it and only had 4k worth of smiles. Could be worse though, most other cars of that sort of retail price would lose more than half their value in ~3 years.

I need to go in to the office on an adhoc basis so I don't think I could do without a car at all, and to be honest I don't particularly want to go back to an ICE car either.

Fair enough. I think I'd either hire a car occasionally or buy something utterly daft and petrol powered with at least 8 cylinders that would likely make me pick up the keys and drive it more often just for the fun of it, something our M3P never did for us either.

[Durzel]

SWoll said:

Durzel said:

Yeah, it's a bit silly. I've lost a minimum of £10k on it and only had 4k worth of smiles. Could be worse though, most other cars of that sort of retail price would lose more than half their value in ~3 years.

I need to go in to the office on an adhoc basis so I don't think I could do without a car at all, and to be honest I don't particularly want to go back to an ICE car either.

Fair enough. I think I'd either hire a car occasionally or buy something utterly daft and petrol powered with at least 8 cylinders that would likely make me pick up the keys and drive it more often just for the fun of it, something our M3P never did for us either.

Ironically I had something utterly daft, petrol powered with 8 cylinders prior to getting the M3P The problem with that car was that it was very mileage sensitive and I didn't want to drive it in the winter, so not practical as a car to go to work on short notice.

EDIT: Just checked WBAC out of curiosity, the valuation they're giving has dropped more than £10k since the start of August. Ouch!

Edited by Durzel on Friday 28th October 12:49

[lizardbrain]

yes same here on wbac, but prices were silly until recently.

I’m now looking at about 26% total depreciation over 3.5 years which seems about right.

Now if house prices can follow too that would be handy

[Durzel]

lizardbrain said:

yes same here on wbac, but prices were silly until recently.

I’m now looking at about 26% total depreciation over 3.5 years which seems about right.

Now if house prices can follow too that would be handy

Amen to that.

[greggy50]

Durzel said:

lizardbrain said:

What promises are you waiting for?

what was the reason for choosing the MP3 and what's changed?

Has depreciation been a big issue so far?

To be fair when I got my M3P my circumstances were a lot different to what they are now. Pre-COVID I was doing at least 800 miles a month commuting and spending a lot on petrol, whereas now I might do 100. My car was delivered at the height of the first lockdown.

Reason for choosing it was the belief that it was the most advanced self driving car available, and it was breaking the mould as far as OTA updates, etc goes. I also wanted a ballistically fast car again after having sold a similarly quick one a while before.

Pretty much nothing has changed with the car in terms of autonomous features in the time I've owned it. Tesla will blame UNECE rules for this, but ultimately I just don't think they care about Europe beyond selling cars. Basic stuff doesn't work properly - the auto headlights are the worst I've experienced on a car in the last 10 years, and the lights themselves are super dumb with no intelligence whatsoever. Auto wipers is marginally better, but not something I would say is completely reliable - and it should be, it's a solved problem. It has a certain Emperor's New Clothes feel about it, like you're paying for the brand name, battery tech and efficiency - but everything else you're just expected to accept.

I could see myself opting out of Tesla for 2-3 years until a genuinely facelifted Model 3 comes along, with the autonomous stuff unlocked (I won't make the same mistake of buying FSD up front again).

Depreciation was impressive until very recently, where it's settled back to a predictable level.

It certainly needs a good facelift, I agree on the headlights and wipers etc. they were terrible on mine as well.

I believe the newer models comes with Adaptive LED headlights (mine was a 69 plate) that should be similar to what my Polestar 2 has where it just blocks out individual cars on high beam, but Tesla can't be bothered to produce the software, so they don't actually work...

I haven't driven a car where I trust the self-drive yet, my Model 3 and Polestar 2 were both about as good i.e. its fine on a motorway but I wouldn't trust it anywhere else.

[Durzel]

Yeah, the fact that the cars have come with matrix-capable headlights since early 2021, perhaps even earlier, and nothing has been done with them in that time is just ridiculous really.

It's only been made legal recently in the States, so I can understand why Tesla have devoted zero development time to it until now, or perhaps not even now, which just cements my opinion that Tesla don't particularly care about the world outside of the United States.

£50k+ cars being delivered in 2022 with billy basic headlights that don't even do auto highbeam properly. Mine came on at about 07:45 the other day with some light foliage cover. Why would anyone use high beam in daylight hours?

[SWoll]

Durzel said:

Yeah, the fact that the cars have come with matrix-capable headlights since early 2021, perhaps even earlier, and nothing has been done with them in that time is just ridiculous really.

It's only been made legal recently in the States, so I can understand why Tesla have devoted zero development time to it until now, or perhaps not even now, which just cements my opinion that Tesla don't particularly care about the world outside of the United States.

£50k+ cars being delivered in 2022 with billy basic headlights that don't even do auto highbeam properly. Mine came on at about 07:45 the other day with some light foliage cover. Why would anyone use high beam in daylight hours?

They don't use normal sensors for light/rain etc. do they, all done va the cameras and "ai".

Alway been crap.

[Familymad]

The switch to EV isn’t black and white now with the price of electric at home and away. I had my annual meeting with the accountant and the EV purchase was discussed at length. We are both car bores.

He drives a PHEV X5 and took the 5% BIK. I was thinking model Y but majority of our 20k this year was to lakes and back to Bucks. One charge in milder weather, two in cold winter. We cruised up here in one tank and a 10 min toilet stop last week and it’s got me pondering once again about why I would be giving that up. Motorway speeds are also not markedly different for wind and road noise with an EV versus petrol.

I filled up at £1.65 litre (£72) and did the 305 miles with 1/4 tank left. I would have filled up at 32p kWh at home (£20ish). One stop at Keele (£36) and another at Charnock Richard (£36) to enable use while staying.

So it’s all comes down to tax savings by owning a new EV and taking the car payment and running costs off our personal finances. Tesla at circa £700pcm doesn’t feel like I’m winning overall…

[SWoll]

If you usage is mainly long trips requiring reguar public charging then 100% I wouldn't bother at the minute either as both EV finance costs and electricity at the moment aren't condusive to money saving, and even if you did I wouldn't suggest a Tesla as the best option anyway. Not very refined/comfortable on long trips or very quick to charge IME and supercharging locations are only getting getting busier and busier due to the massive increase in Tesla's on the road and likelihood of them opening up to other marques next year.

[NDA]

I didn't buy my Tesla expecting the most advanced car on the planet. It's a battery on wheels and a very good commuting appliance... in 25,000 miles it's been perfect and I've used the supercharger network about twice.

I tend to use it in preference to any other car I have - it's just easier.

[DMZ]

Familymad said:

The switch to EV isn’t black and white now with the price of electric at home and away. I had my annual meeting with the accountant and the EV purchase was discussed at length. We are both car bores.

He drives a PHEV X5 and took the 5% BIK. I was thinking model Y but majority of our 20k this year was to lakes and back to Bucks. One charge in milder weather, two in cold winter. We cruised up here in one tank and a 10 min toilet stop last week and it’s got me pondering once again about why I would be giving that up. Motorway speeds are also not markedly different for wind and road noise with an EV versus petrol.

I filled up at £1.65 litre (£72) and did the 305 miles with 1/4 tank left. I would have filled up at 32p kWh at home (£20ish). One stop at Keele (£36) and another at Charnock Richard (£36) to enable use while staying.

So it’s all comes down to tax savings by owning a new EV and taking the car payment and running costs off our personal finances. Tesla at circa £700pcm doesn’t feel like I’m winning overall…

Public charging is so pricey now that PHEV is very appealing. Even my V8 is pretty much the same kind of money on a longer trip and you can obviously get wherever you want with zero faff or delays. I think we used to call it “driving”, lol. A somewhat lost art in the era of EVs where I think the operative words are “planning”, “waiting”, and “worrying”.

Assuming the electricity at home or at work is cheap enough, which I think it should be, then I think it becomes a question of use. EV works for us because we mostly drive within the range radius but quite often beyond typical PHEV radius. But we also have a couple of normal cars that tend to get used on longer trips. But one to do it all would probably be PHEV and ideally one with a large battery. There are obviously various tax incentives to take into consideration also. In my view, PHEV tends be better to drive as well if that’s a factor.

[SWoll]

NDA said:

I didn't buy my Tesla expecting the most advanced car on the planet. It's a battery on wheels and a very good commuting appliance... in 25,000 miles it's been perfect and I've used the supercharger network about twice.

I tend to use it in preference to any other car I have - it's just easier.

As above though, there are many other choices that offer exactly that experience nowadays and do a lot of the basics better IME. We covered 20k miles in 2 years in our Model 3 beteen 2019 and 2021 and whilst I enjoyed it at the time I feel things have moved on and would be in no hurry to have another one of their products in the current marketplace.

[lizardbrain]

So as per title, what's the alternative for a 50k family EV with semi regular need to travel 300 miles in a day?

Bearing in mind I'd get about 35k for trading in my M3P

[Evanivitch]

lizardbrain said:

So as per title, what's the alternative for a 50k family EV with semi regular need to travel 300 miles in a day?

Bearing in mind I'd get about 35k for trading in my M3P

Ioniq 5 for the rapid charging speed (with appropriate charger) or Skoda Enyaq if you really need the extra luggage space (lower efficiency and charge speed).

[PushedDover]

Evanivitch said:

lizardbrain said:

So as per title, what's the alternative for a 50k family EV with semi regular need to travel 300 miles in a day?

Bearing in mind I'd get about 35k for trading in my M3P

Ioniq 5 for the rapid charging speed (with appropriate charger) or Skoda Enyaq if you really need the extra luggage space (lower efficiency and charge speed).

But thats the rub.... back to the Tesla solution

Especially if you want a rapid charger without a queue- I used Kings Lynn, 4:30 Friday afternoon Yesterday. NO ONE there.

Straight in. 7 minutes, enough to continue my journey to the end at the top of Yorkshire.
That makes all the difference in my mind.

[Evanivitch]

PushedDover said:

But thats the rub.... back to the Tesla solution

Especially if you want a rapid charger without a queue- I used Kings Lynn, 4:30 Friday afternoon Yesterday. NO ONE there.

Straight in. 7 minutes, enough to continue my journey to the end at the top of Yorkshire.
That makes all the difference in my mind.

There's like a dozen open-to-all superchargers now? And they're not immune to queues and waits too, even out at J36 M4 I've seen Tesla's queuing.

But even then, the Ioniq5/EV6 have the ability to maximise their power output.

[JonChalk]

Evanivitch said:

PushedDover said:

But thats the rub.... back to the Tesla solution

Especially if you want a rapid charger without a queue- I used Kings Lynn, 4:30 Friday afternoon Yesterday. NO ONE there.

Straight in. 7 minutes, enough to continue my journey to the end at the top of Yorkshire.
That makes all the difference in my mind.

There's like a dozen open-to-all superchargers now? And they're not immune to queues and waits too, even out at J36 M4 I've seen Tesla's queuing.

But even then, the Ioniq5/EV6 have the ability to maximise their power output.

In 20 months and 22,000 miles of EV driving, including France, I have yet to queue at a non-Tesla charger over 50kW.