Attraction of EV's
Discussion
This again..
Show some examples of where the upfront cost of an EV is so much more than an equivelant ICE car.
If you aren't public charging regularly they are still cheaper to run than ICE, especially if you are on an EV tariff.
If you aren't doing regular 200+ mile trips they do everything better than an ICE car for daily duties.
I've mentioned nothing about the environmental impact as don't know the answer and TBH not interested as was never a motivating factor.
Show some examples of where the upfront cost of an EV is so much more than an equivelant ICE car.
If you aren't public charging regularly they are still cheaper to run than ICE, especially if you are on an EV tariff.
If you aren't doing regular 200+ mile trips they do everything better than an ICE car for daily duties.
I've mentioned nothing about the environmental impact as don't know the answer and TBH not interested as was never a motivating factor.
Justin85 said:
Surely the main attraction for almost all company car drivers is the BIK advantage over fossil fueled alternatives?
.
For me, a mid-spec Tesla Model 3 costs me £38 a month in additional tax. Spending the same money on a petrol or diesel fueled car of a similar size would cost me £900+ per month. It couldn't be more of a no-brainer.
Just like diesel offered a financial advantage to company car owners and fleet managers 15-20 years ago. I would suggest no fleet manager or company car driver selected a diesel car for anything other than financial reasons, and I'd wager that applies as much today with EV's. I assume private buyers (lessee/renter/whatever) are buying into the perceived environmental benefits of EV's or can't resist buying the latest thing just because.
There is no doubt of the benefits that the EV drivetrain offers in terms of reduced NVH, traction, packaging etc. but very few of the mainstream manufacturers' have done anything particularly clever with it - yet - to my eyes. The Tesla is a very good drivetrain and tech package in a very average, dull and cheaply built car, IMHO.
I wouldn't be surprised if we're listening to Classic FM adverts in twenty years offering compensation to buyers' of EV's who bought them because they thought they would be doing their bit to save the planet, but, in fact they weren't.
My wife is waiting for her new Tesla model 3 to arrive middle December..
For me, a mid-spec Tesla Model 3 costs me £38 a month in additional tax. Spending the same money on a petrol or diesel fueled car of a similar size would cost me £900+ per month. It couldn't be more of a no-brainer.
Just like diesel offered a financial advantage to company car owners and fleet managers 15-20 years ago. I would suggest no fleet manager or company car driver selected a diesel car for anything other than financial reasons, and I'd wager that applies as much today with EV's. I assume private buyers (lessee/renter/whatever) are buying into the perceived environmental benefits of EV's or can't resist buying the latest thing just because.
There is no doubt of the benefits that the EV drivetrain offers in terms of reduced NVH, traction, packaging etc. but very few of the mainstream manufacturers' have done anything particularly clever with it - yet - to my eyes. The Tesla is a very good drivetrain and tech package in a very average, dull and cheaply built car, IMHO.
I wouldn't be surprised if we're listening to Classic FM adverts in twenty years offering compensation to buyers' of EV's who bought them because they thought they would be doing their bit to save the planet, but, in fact they weren't.
£50k of her own money (our money really) is a fair chunk of cash.
I am also having second thoughts if to drop the £50k onto an EV,
As it would be a private sale, and bought outright, it is a bit chickening.
What to do, I don't know.
Her drives a Q7 at the moment, (paid for, bought outright) and feeds it wit £80 a week
So for her, charging at home on cheap rate, would cost her £7.00 a week at todays electric prices.
So really, its just about saving that £73 a week, that entices her, and me. circa £320 a month savings.
bigothunter said:
I spent over 30 years working in ICEV product development and still love driving them on race circuits.
But EVs are in a different league. They make ICEVs look like dinosaurs for all the obvious reason.
I don't think that it is quite as cut and dried as that for me. I had a 2021 Merc EQA 250 this week as a loan car, and I genuinely couldn't wait to get back into my 2022 Merc GLE400d. The EQA felt slow/heavy and a lot less refined than the GLE. I thought that an electric car would wipe the floor with a diesel car in terms of NVH and general smoothness, but not a chance from my experience. But EVs are in a different league. They make ICEVs look like dinosaurs for all the obvious reason.
So I just don't get the attraction with EVs other than the cheap running costs.
Europa Jon said:
So, an A-class isn't as good as an E-class. What a surprise...
That is a fair point, but I was genuinely expecting(especially from what I read on here) that an electric car would be head and shoulders more smooth/better than a car with a diesel engine to be honest though. cerb4.5lee said:
bigothunter said:
I spent over 30 years working in ICEV product development and still love driving them on race circuits.
But EVs are in a different league. They make ICEVs look like dinosaurs for all the obvious reason.
I don't think that it is quite as cut and dried as that for me. I had a 2021 Merc EQA 250 this week as a loan car, and I genuinely couldn't wait to get back into my 2022 Merc GLE400d. The EQA felt slow/heavy and a lot less refined than the GLE. I thought that an electric car would wipe the floor with a diesel car in terms of NVH and general smoothness, but not a chance from my experience. But EVs are in a different league. They make ICEVs look like dinosaurs for all the obvious reason.
So I just don't get the attraction with EVs other than the cheap running costs.
delta0 said:
It’s more refined and pleasant to drive. Plus you can’t get something with 600bhp that costs so little to run and is so easy to live with. Servicing, insurance and everything else is just easier and cheaper.
How far can you go if actually anything like the full 600bhp? 20 miles then a 10 hour top up. Sounds great!Register1 said:
Justin85 said:
Surely the main attraction for almost all company car drivers is the BIK advantage over fossil fueled alternatives?
.
For me, a mid-spec Tesla Model 3 costs me £38 a month in additional tax. Spending the same money on a petrol or diesel fueled car of a similar size would cost me £900+ per month. It couldn't be more of a no-brainer.
Just like diesel offered a financial advantage to company car owners and fleet managers 15-20 years ago. I would suggest no fleet manager or company car driver selected a diesel car for anything other than financial reasons, and I'd wager that applies as much today with EV's. I assume private buyers (lessee/renter/whatever) are buying into the perceived environmental benefits of EV's or can't resist buying the latest thing just because.
There is no doubt of the benefits that the EV drivetrain offers in terms of reduced NVH, traction, packaging etc. but very few of the mainstream manufacturers' have done anything particularly clever with it - yet - to my eyes. The Tesla is a very good drivetrain and tech package in a very average, dull and cheaply built car, IMHO.
I wouldn't be surprised if we're listening to Classic FM adverts in twenty years offering compensation to buyers' of EV's who bought them because they thought they would be doing their bit to save the planet, but, in fact they weren't.
My wife is waiting for her new Tesla model 3 to arrive middle December..
For me, a mid-spec Tesla Model 3 costs me £38 a month in additional tax. Spending the same money on a petrol or diesel fueled car of a similar size would cost me £900+ per month. It couldn't be more of a no-brainer.
Just like diesel offered a financial advantage to company car owners and fleet managers 15-20 years ago. I would suggest no fleet manager or company car driver selected a diesel car for anything other than financial reasons, and I'd wager that applies as much today with EV's. I assume private buyers (lessee/renter/whatever) are buying into the perceived environmental benefits of EV's or can't resist buying the latest thing just because.
There is no doubt of the benefits that the EV drivetrain offers in terms of reduced NVH, traction, packaging etc. but very few of the mainstream manufacturers' have done anything particularly clever with it - yet - to my eyes. The Tesla is a very good drivetrain and tech package in a very average, dull and cheaply built car, IMHO.
I wouldn't be surprised if we're listening to Classic FM adverts in twenty years offering compensation to buyers' of EV's who bought them because they thought they would be doing their bit to save the planet, but, in fact they weren't.
£50k of her own money (our money really) is a fair chunk of cash.
I am also having second thoughts if to drop the £50k onto an EV,
As it would be a private sale, and bought outright, it is a bit chickening.
What to do, I don't know.
Her drives a Q7 at the moment, (paid for, bought outright) and feeds it wit £80 a week
So for her, charging at home on cheap rate, would cost her £7.00 a week at todays electric prices.
So really, its just about saving that £73 a week, that entices her, and me. circa £320 a month savings.
Scrimpton said:
They're better, apart from for fun obviously.
I’d disagree with this. We’ve had an BMW i3 which was great fun to hoon around, small, lightening quick off the lights and I’d have another tomorrow. Then went to a hybrid which was really the worst of both worlds, so went back to an EV with an iPace.The Jaguar is a fair bit quicker than the i3 but then feels a bit more grown up and reassuring.
I always charge at home and don’t miss having to go to a fuel station every time I want to fill up. Even if it cost me as much to fill up with electricity as it did with petrol/diesel, I’d still choose an EV. We haven’t gone completely electric as I have an old diesel van that I use for taking the dogs out, tip runs etc but other than that I don’t think I’d buy another ICE car.
85Carrera said:
delta0 said:
It’s more refined and pleasant to drive. Plus you can’t get something with 600bhp that costs so little to run and is so easy to live with. Servicing, insurance and everything else is just easier and cheaper.
How far can you go if actually anything like the full 600bhp? 20 miles then a 10 hour top up. Sounds great!The Road Crew said:
Certainly am. I've had an EV previously and was semi considering another for the mrs but not with current electricity prices - just isn't viable. The additional cost of VED doesn't help either.
Electricity is cheaper if you have an EV... Intelligent Octopus is 10p (at time of writing, I'm on 7.5p) per kwh, if you drive 8000 miles a year that's about £280 in 'fuel'.Also the EV tariff makes all other power used during the cheap hours cheap, well below the current capped rates and will be even lower than the soon to come un capped rates.
Aside from that, as others have said the two don't compare side by side in cost terms alone. As a daily, EV is far superior, and still overall no more expensive if you're on the right tariff. The reality is, the car has been improved upon by electrification. It's cheaper, cleaner, greener, smoother, simpler, easier, quieter.. and so far the signs are they will be longer lived and more reliable. Put the two side by side and there's no competition anymore imo.
If you want hardcore fun, obviously go ICE for now. But for a daily, things have seriously moved on a notch.
Richtea1970 said:
I’d disagree with this. We’ve had an BMW i3 which was great fun to hoon around, small, lightening quick off the lights and I’d have another tomorrow. Then went to a hybrid which was really the worst of both worlds, so went back to an EV with an iPace.
The Jaguar is a fair bit quicker than the i3 but then feels a bit more grown up and reassuring.
I always charge at home and don’t miss having to go to a fuel station every time I want to fill up. Even if it cost me as much to fill up with electricity as it did with petrol/diesel, I’d still choose an EV. We haven’t gone completely electric as I have an old diesel van that I use for taking the dogs out, tip runs etc but other than that I don’t think I’d buy another ICE car.
To be fair, I'm going from my own garage but I've heard the i3 is a very good steer. I certainly don't miss petrol stations, commuting in the M3 I was filling up every 3 days. Filling up at home is so much better, I will never have an ICE day to day car again. The Jaguar is a fair bit quicker than the i3 but then feels a bit more grown up and reassuring.
I always charge at home and don’t miss having to go to a fuel station every time I want to fill up. Even if it cost me as much to fill up with electricity as it did with petrol/diesel, I’d still choose an EV. We haven’t gone completely electric as I have an old diesel van that I use for taking the dogs out, tip runs etc but other than that I don’t think I’d buy another ICE car.
delta0 said:
85Carrera said:
delta0 said:
It’s more refined and pleasant to drive. Plus you can’t get something with 600bhp that costs so little to run and is so easy to live with. Servicing, insurance and everything else is just easier and cheaper.
How far can you go if actually anything like the full 600bhp? 20 miles then a 10 hour top up. Sounds great!delta0 said:
85Carrera said:
delta0 said:
It’s more refined and pleasant to drive. Plus you can’t get something with 600bhp that costs so little to run and is so easy to live with. Servicing, insurance and everything else is just easier and cheaper.
How far can you go if actually anything like the full 600bhp? 20 miles then a 10 hour top up. Sounds great!What luxury SUV with 400hp could I possibly replace my EV with that would do 10k miles a year driven with reckless abandon and cost just £300 ish a year to fuel? Realistically I'd have to buy and fuel a turbo/supercharged V8 SUV which would cost at least £2000 more a year to fuel and the value would plummet. And it would be slower and less stable in the corners, as all ICE SUV's are.
I'll stick, thanks
85Carrera said:
delta0 said:
85Carrera said:
delta0 said:
It’s more refined and pleasant to drive. Plus you can’t get something with 600bhp that costs so little to run and is so easy to live with. Servicing, insurance and everything else is just easier and cheaper.
How far can you go if actually anything like the full 600bhp? 20 miles then a 10 hour top up. Sounds great!85Carrera said:
delta0 said:
85Carrera said:
delta0 said:
It’s more refined and pleasant to drive. Plus you can’t get something with 600bhp that costs so little to run and is so easy to live with. Servicing, insurance and everything else is just easier and cheaper.
How far can you go if actually anything like the full 600bhp? 20 miles then a 10 hour top up. Sounds great!TheDeuce said:
delta0 said:
85Carrera said:
delta0 said:
It’s more refined and pleasant to drive. Plus you can’t get something with 600bhp that costs so little to run and is so easy to live with. Servicing, insurance and everything else is just easier and cheaper.
How far can you go if actually anything like the full 600bhp? 20 miles then a 10 hour top up. Sounds great!What luxury SUV with 400hp could I possibly replace my EV with that would do 10k miles a year driven with reckless abandon and cost just £300 ish a year to fuel? Realistically I'd have to buy and fuel a turbo/supercharged V8 SUV which would cost at least £2000 more a year to fuel and the value would plummet. And it would be slower and less stable in the corners, as all ICE SUV's are.
I'll stick, thanks
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