Hyundai IONIQ 5 N - am I mad?
Discussion
SWoll said:
£44k to hire a £60k car for 4 years and 40k miles?
The depreciation on new EV's is making leasing/PCP costs utterly ridiculous. I'd leave it to company car/SS drivers and pick one up in a couple of years for half price personally.
I agree. Costs are bonkers. Having said that, prices on our sal sac scheme at work are getting daft too. Feels like they’ve increased way in excess of the monthly allowance and only the lease companies are benefitting.The depreciation on new EV's is making leasing/PCP costs utterly ridiculous. I'd leave it to company car/SS drivers and pick one up in a couple of years for half price personally.
Tempted to just buy an old smoker and potter around in that, except that work have stated that you can’t use the car allowance on anything over seven years old!
cossey said:
The Tesla cost is heavily impacted by the interest rate. The Model Y is <2% but the Model 3P is nearly 10%.
A few months time once any pent up demand is gone and the cost will drop significantly without them having to mess around with the headline price.
Yep agree with that. I swooped in for a Model Y LR at £44670 new and lease is £3k down and £440 inc vat. So less that VAT it’s a cheap hack. It’s always worth checking the a Tesla site weekly as the rates go up and down like his tweets.A few months time once any pent up demand is gone and the cost will drop significantly without them having to mess around with the headline price.
Friend of mine has a "regular" IONIQ 5, it's a great family car.
Don't get me wrong, it'll be painfully fast, but that hp number isn't there just to light up the tires.
MCarpentier1 said:
I *really* like the look of the IONIQ 5 N, even if 650ps in a hatchback is totally ludicrous.
While 650 hp is A LOT, especially EV horsepower, don't confuse this with a Golf. In dimensions it's nearly an exact match of an Audi Q5, but ~200kg heavier.Don't get me wrong, it'll be painfully fast, but that hp number isn't there just to light up the tires.
SWoll said:
Familymad said:
£44k to hire a £60k car for 4 years and 40k miles?The depreciation on new EV's is making leasing/PCP costs utterly ridiculous. I'd leave it to company car/SS drivers and pick one up in a couple of years for half price personally.
You're paying money either way, either in depreciation if you buy outright (my 2020 M3P has lost ~£830/month in value to date, if not more) or to rent it, so I guess what's the difference?
I've never been a fan of finance, always bought outright, but in the case of Tesla (and perhaps new cars generally) I've been punished for it.
To flip your argument on its head - you get to drive a car you might otherwise not be able to buy, and enjoy all of the benefits from it as if it was your own, for £16k less than the asking price.
That being said - 9.6% APR on the new Model 3 Performance is a joke.
Some questions
How much of that HP is available when you haven’t preheated the batteries for 20-30 minutes before hitting the go pedal?
How much of it is available at 69% battery charge.
How much battery charge does it use to preheat the batteries to full performance mode temperature?
You might find the answers informative.
How much of that HP is available when you haven’t preheated the batteries for 20-30 minutes before hitting the go pedal?
How much of it is available at 69% battery charge.
How much battery charge does it use to preheat the batteries to full performance mode temperature?
You might find the answers informative.
fatjon said:
Some questions
How much of that HP is available when you haven’t preheated the batteries for 20-30 minutes before hitting the go pedal?
How much of it is available at 69% battery charge.
How much battery charge does it use to preheat the batteries to full performance mode temperature?
You might find the answers informative.
You also have to warm up ICE vehicles before any use, not just high performance, that uses up petrol and takes time you realise?How much of that HP is available when you haven’t preheated the batteries for 20-30 minutes before hitting the go pedal?
How much of it is available at 69% battery charge.
How much battery charge does it use to preheat the batteries to full performance mode temperature?
You might find the answers informative.
740EVTORQUES said:
fatjon said:
Some questions
How much of that HP is available when you haven’t preheated the batteries for 20-30 minutes before hitting the go pedal?
How much of it is available at 69% battery charge.
How much battery charge does it use to preheat the batteries to full performance mode temperature?
You might find the answers informative.
You also have to warm up ICE vehicles before any use, not just high performance, that uses up petrol and takes time you realise?How much of that HP is available when you haven’t preheated the batteries for 20-30 minutes before hitting the go pedal?
How much of it is available at 69% battery charge.
How much battery charge does it use to preheat the batteries to full performance mode temperature?
You might find the answers informative.
Taken this morning in advance of your smart arsed comments. I turned on preheat at 10:57, arrived home at 11:24 by which time it had still not reached full power temperature and was limiting to 360Kw (480HP), having burned through 21% of the total energy expended on the journey warming the batteries. I was charged to 90% when I left and 76% when I got home. At less than 70% battery preheat and full power are locked out and you can only get 480HP. Don't get me wrong 480HP is plenty but annoying when you paid for 585HP. If you want full power you need to charge to 100%, spend a good chunk of it heating the batteries and then you have a few miles of full power before it dips below the 70% threshold and even in GT mode you get limited back to about 480HP.
I can live with it but I would have preferred to be told this before I spent my £65k and maybe the OP would like to make an informed decision.
Familymad said:
Didn’t realise that info. I’m sure Kia won’t want potential buyers to know it either.
Tesla don’t appear to need this to achieve repeatable and full performance. Do Porsches? Intrigued
IIRC the Ioniq 5N battery is different from other E-GMP ones, more advanced thermal management etc. In any cse, I think KIA EV6 GT was among the first EVs that could do a lap of Nurburgring without going into limp mode. I read a claim that a 5N could do two sub-8 minute laps in a row (TBC, of course). Tesla don’t appear to need this to achieve repeatable and full performance. Do Porsches? Intrigued
I don't know if the Ioniq 5N will drop into the 480hp valet mode, too - might still be enough power to get under 8 minutes? At least the KIA EV6 looked pretty lively even towards the end of the lap. The background article (in French) mentions the reasons they had almost given up on taking EVs to the track (one of them an experience with a Tesla, for what it is worth).
All this is just academic interest for me as someone pottering around with a standard 4WD, meekly letting cyclists and faster joggers past...
All EVs need to heat their batteries for peak performance, it’s what ‘ludicrous mode’ does in a Tesla for example
The EV6GT has a remarkable ability to produce full
power without fade , which is also why it can fast charge right up to 80% whereas , for example, a Mach E starts to reduce its charge speed well before this point.
The new Taycan is significantly better as it can charge (and discharge) optimally at 15 degrees, much cooler than the 1st gen.
That means less need to heat the battery (and less power consumed doing it)
But I thought batteries had hardly changed in the last 100 years or so?
By 2030 or 2035 people will look back and wonder why on earth some were doubting that the technology would be in any way inferior to ICE.
The EV6GT has a remarkable ability to produce full
power without fade , which is also why it can fast charge right up to 80% whereas , for example, a Mach E starts to reduce its charge speed well before this point.
The new Taycan is significantly better as it can charge (and discharge) optimally at 15 degrees, much cooler than the 1st gen.
That means less need to heat the battery (and less power consumed doing it)
But I thought batteries had hardly changed in the last 100 years or so?
By 2030 or 2035 people will look back and wonder why on earth some were doubting that the technology would be in any way inferior to ICE.
“
The EV6GT has a remarkable ability to produce full
power without fade , which is also why it can fast charge right up to 80% whereas , for example, a Mach E starts to reduce its charge speed well before this point.”
within ten minutes of the battery heater shutting down at 69% my car goes from 430kw (584.6hp) to 370kw (475hp). Hardly a remarkable fade free performance. Tested yesterday in an ambient of 11c. It took the best part of an hour to reach optimal temperature and I had to stop and recharge once as it got below 70% before reaching optimal.
By 40% charge it is down to 275kw (380hp).
I like the car just fine but just because I bought one does not mean I’m going to mislead someone looking to buy one. Meet a fully charged one with warmed up batteries in it’s 20 minute sweet spot and it’s silly fast. Half charged and cold, it’s fairly quick and no more.
The EV6GT has a remarkable ability to produce full
power without fade , which is also why it can fast charge right up to 80% whereas , for example, a Mach E starts to reduce its charge speed well before this point.”
within ten minutes of the battery heater shutting down at 69% my car goes from 430kw (584.6hp) to 370kw (475hp). Hardly a remarkable fade free performance. Tested yesterday in an ambient of 11c. It took the best part of an hour to reach optimal temperature and I had to stop and recharge once as it got below 70% before reaching optimal.
By 40% charge it is down to 275kw (380hp).
I like the car just fine but just because I bought one does not mean I’m going to mislead someone looking to buy one. Meet a fully charged one with warmed up batteries in it’s 20 minute sweet spot and it’s silly fast. Half charged and cold, it’s fairly quick and no more.
fatjon said:
“
within ten minutes of the battery heater shutting down at 69% my car goes from 430kw (584.6hp) to 370kw (475hp). Hardly a remarkable fade free performance. Tested yesterday in an ambient of 11c. It took the best part of an hour to reach optimal temperature and I had to stop and recharge once as it got below 70% before reaching optimal.
By 40% charge it is down to 275kw (380hp).
I guess the (near) "fade-free" is/was relative to the competition. within ten minutes of the battery heater shutting down at 69% my car goes from 430kw (584.6hp) to 370kw (475hp). Hardly a remarkable fade free performance. Tested yesterday in an ambient of 11c. It took the best part of an hour to reach optimal temperature and I had to stop and recharge once as it got below 70% before reaching optimal.
By 40% charge it is down to 275kw (380hp).
Regarding the power figures on different levels of charge: are there published numbers anywhere?
PetrolHeadInRecovery said:
I guess the (near) "fade-free" is/was relative to the competition.
Regarding the power figures on different levels of charge: are there published numbers anywhere?
This has been benched on teslas a number of times, from what I can find the difference between 90% and 15% SoC is less than 20% on a TM3.Regarding the power figures on different levels of charge: are there published numbers anywhere?
In accelleration from a standstill there's not much in it as at lower speeds the motors are limited by traction anyway.
This chart for example suggests a ~.5s loss in 0-65mph time.
SWoll said:
Familymad said:
£44k to hire a £60k car for 4 years and 40k miles?The depreciation on new EV's is making leasing/PCP costs utterly ridiculous. I'd leave it to company car/SS drivers and pick one up in a couple of years for half price personally.
Maybe pick up an used EV6 GT or Model S for a couple of years.
fatjon said:
Some questions
How much of that HP is available when you haven’t preheated the batteries for 20-30 minutes before hitting the go pedal?
How much of it is available at 69% battery charge.
How much battery charge does it use to preheat the batteries to full performance mode temperature?
You might find the answers informative.
Just give it the beans. Won't take many seconds for the batteries to warm up when they're pumping out a 1000 amps. How much of that HP is available when you haven’t preheated the batteries for 20-30 minutes before hitting the go pedal?
How much of it is available at 69% battery charge.
How much battery charge does it use to preheat the batteries to full performance mode temperature?
You might find the answers informative.
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