Taycan starting to look like a bargain
Discussion
Louis Balfour said:
andy43 said:
Harry Metcalfe has just done an interesting video on EVs and the reasons why noones buying.
730 Taycans on autotrader this morning. Just checked again - 742 now. ETA of those 54 are brand new 23/24 cars.
'arry says:730 Taycans on autotrader this morning. Just checked again - 742 now. ETA of those 54 are brand new 23/24 cars.
Edited by andy43 on Thursday 8th February 19:54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZysvgm2_Aw
Car companies going full EV could be in big trouble.
I was never fooled by the smoke 'n' mirrors when everyone was being encouraged to switch to diesel.
I've not yet been fooled by the smoke 'n' mirrors around everyone being encouraged to buy electric.
No, I don't even want a "cheap" used Taycan. I can buy a brand new car of some kind for that money, with a nice warranty and no range anxiety.
I've not yet been fooled by the smoke 'n' mirrors around everyone being encouraged to buy electric.
No, I don't even want a "cheap" used Taycan. I can buy a brand new car of some kind for that money, with a nice warranty and no range anxiety.
Panamax said:
I was never fooled by the smoke 'n' mirrors when everyone was being encouraged to switch to diesel.
I've not yet been fooled by the smoke 'n' mirrors around everyone being encouraged to buy electric.
No, I don't even want a "cheap" used Taycan. I can buy a brand new car of some kind for that money, with a nice warranty and no range anxiety.
All of which is fair enough, choice is king.I've not yet been fooled by the smoke 'n' mirrors around everyone being encouraged to buy electric.
No, I don't even want a "cheap" used Taycan. I can buy a brand new car of some kind for that money, with a nice warranty and no range anxiety.
But the Taycan is a great car period, irrespective of drive train. If you've never had a drive of one, you should.
That is, of course, if it suits your use case. (I tend not to get anxious and full factory warranties are available for not much money, considering the class of car and performance on hand).
silentbrown said:
Louis Balfour said:
'arry says:
As always, he talks a lot of sense. Why anyone would need - or even WANT - a 600+HP SUV is beyond me.That is not how comparisons are done.
It may not have been intentional but very poor nonetheless
Panamax said:
Nomme de Plum said:
I watched the first 5 minutes.
Now go and watch the rest of it.Funny how the actual data was only on the screen for a very short time. A proper comparison would have been side by side and explained properly.
silentbrown said:
Louis Balfour said:
'arry says:
As always, he talks a lot of sense. Why anyone would need - or even WANT - a 600+HP SUV is beyond me.
Murph7355 said:
silentbrown said:
Louis Balfour said:
'arry says:
As always, he talks a lot of sense. Why anyone would need - or even WANT - a 600+HP SUV is beyond me.The battery degradation issue was interesting given the numbers provided by someone that appears to have spent more time digging into the reality than the manufacturers. Tesla comes out really well although the takeaway for me is the posters on here banging on about it hardly taking any time to top up on long journeys, you know the ones that go to the toilet and buy a coffee then browse the premises at every service station they visit (unlike many others that just jump out for a pee in a bush when in the middle of nowhere) while fast charging are the ones ruining the batteries for subsequent buyers.
Nomme de Plum said:
I will but he waffles way too much. I suppose it's the nature of business to make money from video.
Funny how the actual data was only on the screen for a very short time. A proper comparison would have been side by side and explained properly.
Sorry Nick, but that right there is the definition of irony Funny how the actual data was only on the screen for a very short time. A proper comparison would have been side by side and explained properly.
I've listened to it now, and it's disappointing. It sounds like an old man's ramble to justify buying a diesel Range Rover Sport 
A lot of what he belly aches about applies just as much to ICE cars.
"You just don't know how a previous user will have charged the car". Indeed. Just as you do not know how an ICE owner will have - will they have ragged it from stone cold all its life? Used s
t fuel?
"Dealers just don't know the SoH of the battery". Well yours didn't (maybe JLR were trying to dodge another warranty claim on a poorly made vehicle?), but you can get this detail from an OBD II reader if you cannot find a better dealer. And on ICE, presumably dealers provide you with compression tests and rolling road results every time you get it serviced?
His use case does not suit an EV. He needs to tow. And he does not want to spend what Range Rover want to charge for the EV version. Fair enough. I wouldn't want to spend 600 quid a month on a diesel Range Rover Sport. It doesn't mean nobody does, nor that all diesels are pointless.
Insurance? Ah, but all the press whining was the old model. So press whining is dismissable when you like the product personally...
0 out of 10. If you're going to rant, do it properly. Swear and shout and hit them with sticks.
A lot of what he belly aches about applies just as much to ICE cars.
"You just don't know how a previous user will have charged the car". Indeed. Just as you do not know how an ICE owner will have - will they have ragged it from stone cold all its life? Used s
t fuel?"Dealers just don't know the SoH of the battery". Well yours didn't (maybe JLR were trying to dodge another warranty claim on a poorly made vehicle?), but you can get this detail from an OBD II reader if you cannot find a better dealer. And on ICE, presumably dealers provide you with compression tests and rolling road results every time you get it serviced?
His use case does not suit an EV. He needs to tow. And he does not want to spend what Range Rover want to charge for the EV version. Fair enough. I wouldn't want to spend 600 quid a month on a diesel Range Rover Sport. It doesn't mean nobody does, nor that all diesels are pointless.
Insurance? Ah, but all the press whining was the old model. So press whining is dismissable when you like the product personally...
0 out of 10. If you're going to rant, do it properly. Swear and shout and hit them with sticks.
Nomme de Plum said:
I watched the first 5 minutes. The financial comparison are not like for like. Different purchase price, different deposits and different interest rates.
That is not how comparisons are done.
It may not have been intentional but very poor nonetheless
I watched it, all the vehicles were £20k down and the GFV was irrelevant because he fully intends to hand it back. Seemed a fair comparison to me. He didn't mention however that the running costs will be much less for the EV, but that depends on mileage covered. That is not how comparisons are done.
It may not have been intentional but very poor nonetheless
wc98 said:
Nomme de Plum said:
I will but he waffles way too much. I suppose it's the nature of business to make money from video.
Funny how the actual data was only on the screen for a very short time. A proper comparison would have been side by side and explained properly.
Sorry Nick, but that right there is the definition of irony Funny how the actual data was only on the screen for a very short time. A proper comparison would have been side by side and explained properly.
Murph7355 said:
I've listened to it now, and it's disappointing. It sounds like an old man's ramble to justify buying a diesel Range Rover Sport
A lot of what he belly aches about applies just as much to ICE cars.
"You just don't know how a previous user will have charged the car". Indeed. Just as you do not know how an ICE owner will have - will they have ragged it from stone cold all its life? Used st fuel?
When I had a Mk2 75bhp Astra I used to "rag it from cold" in that I worked about 500m from the Loudwater junction on the M40. Getting up to 70mph in short order on the uphill stretch towards London probably counted as ragging it. I'm not sure that I can think of any situation where you could rag a 300bhp automatic SUV for more than about 5-10 seconds without running out of road.A lot of what he belly aches about applies just as much to ICE cars.
"You just don't know how a previous user will have charged the car". Indeed. Just as you do not know how an ICE owner will have - will they have ragged it from stone cold all its life? Used s
t fuel?Murph7355 said:
His use case does not suit an EV. He needs to tow. And he does not want to spend what Range Rover want to charge for the EV version. Fair enough. I wouldn't want to spend 600 quid a month on a diesel Range Rover Sport. It doesn't mean nobody does, nor that all diesels are pointless.
Just for accuracy, the numbers were c600/month for the diesel, and c1050/month for a PHEV. On a lease, so no variability in residual value. Murph7355 said:
Insurance? Ah, but all the press whining was the old model. So press whining is dismissable when you like the product personally...
Or when it doesn't apply to the product you are talking about...0 out of 10. If you're going to rant, do it properly. Swear and shout and hit them with sticks.
Nomme de Plum said:
I watched the first 5 minutes. The financial comparison are not like for like. Different purchase price, different deposits and different interest rates.
That is not how comparisons are done.
Of course they're different. The whole point of the comparison is that the diesel is available at about half the APR and with a £5K finance contribution (because they're really struggling to shift themThat is not how comparisons are done.
If you're concerned that he put a deposit of £20,016 rather than £20,000 that's because you use a stupid slider to set the deposit value.
silentbrown said:
Nomme de Plum said:
I watched the first 5 minutes. The financial comparison are not like for like. Different purchase price, different deposits and different interest rates.
That is not how comparisons are done.
Of course they're different. The whole point of the comparison is that the diesel is available at about half the APR and with a £5K finance contribution (because they're really struggling to shift themThat is not how comparisons are done.
If you're concerned that he put a deposit of £20,016 rather than £20,000 that's because you use a stupid slider to set the deposit value.
This is not how, in the real commercial world, like for like comparisons are carried out. He'd be laughed out of the room.
I don't think the Harry video matters much with regards to this discussion.
Taycans at the lower end of the market are so cheap now that you could run one into the ground, break what's left for spares and still feel you've had your moneys worth.
Harry's point is that the new bloat wagons are too expensive to buy and depreciate too much from new for what they offer.
The Taycan is a victim of the latter so make a great buy to the used buyer.
What surprising thing is that they are really cheap and still nobody is buying them.
What are they going to do to shift them?
Taycans at the lower end of the market are so cheap now that you could run one into the ground, break what's left for spares and still feel you've had your moneys worth.
Harry's point is that the new bloat wagons are too expensive to buy and depreciate too much from new for what they offer.
The Taycan is a victim of the latter so make a great buy to the used buyer.
What surprising thing is that they are really cheap and still nobody is buying them.
What are they going to do to shift them?
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