EVs and In Gear Acceleration vs ICE
Discussion
wormus said:
OK should I flog my really fast EV and find something that is less fast that costs a wad to run and makes a farting noise and smoke when it goes? Suppose I could be ultra cool and get something with a steam engine, or maybe rollers like Fred Flintstone.
fatjon said:
wormus said:
OK should I flog my really fast EV and find something that is less fast that costs a wad to run and makes a farting noise and smoke when it goes? Suppose I could be ultra cool and get something with a steam engine, or maybe rollers like Fred Flintstone.ICE cars like above do have a cool factor for sure. The problem is that if you have an appreciation for well made machines, effective design and engineering... It's very difficult to have a performance EV and then go back to taking performance ICE very seriously, because as a product of engineering, the ICE is very crude and relatively ineffective by direct comparison.
I love a great sounding engine, I just know that if I drove most cars that do have such an engine these days, a big part of me would wish that I could have that fun and drama but also the more energetic performance of EV. I'd love to have both in one car, but I can't.
I still go to local car shows and adore looking at the more special ICE cars, I love seeing supercars in town most days too, the sound as they make their way through our old town streets is excellent
but one thing has changed, I used to look at such cars and dream of the day I could own something so fast and so high tech - that element of my appreciation has now been usurped by EV because I do have an EV that is 'that fast' and technically evolved ahead of what can be achieved with any ICE - in terms of throttle response and gear shift speeds etc, not just boring efficiency stuff.I'm still a fan of all car types, for what each offers. But a big chunk of my engineering mindset has been stolen by EV, because I always appreciated a fantastic powertrain.
TheDeuce said:
It's a tricky one...
ICE cars like above do have a cool factor for sure. The problem is that if you have an appreciation for well made machines, effective design and engineering... It's very difficult to have a performance EV and then go back to taking performance ICE very seriously, because as a product of engineering, the ICE is very crude and relatively ineffective by direct comparison.
I love a great sounding engine, I just know that if I drove most cars that do have such an engine these days, a big part of me would wish that I could have that fun and drama but also the more energetic performance of EV. I'd love to have both in one car, but I can't.
I still go to local car shows and adore looking at the more special ICE cars, I love seeing supercars in town most days too, the sound as they make their way through our old town streets is excellent but one thing has changed, I used to look at such cars and dream of the day I could own something so fast and so high tech - that element of my appreciation has now been usurped by EV because I do have an EV that is 'that fast' and technically evolved ahead of what can be achieved with any ICE - in terms of throttle response and gear shift speeds etc, not just boring efficiency stuff.
I'm still a fan of all car types, for what each offers. But a big chunk of my engineering mindset has been stolen by EV, because I always appreciated a fantastic powertrain.
That sums it up perfectly, thank you!ICE cars like above do have a cool factor for sure. The problem is that if you have an appreciation for well made machines, effective design and engineering... It's very difficult to have a performance EV and then go back to taking performance ICE very seriously, because as a product of engineering, the ICE is very crude and relatively ineffective by direct comparison.
I love a great sounding engine, I just know that if I drove most cars that do have such an engine these days, a big part of me would wish that I could have that fun and drama but also the more energetic performance of EV. I'd love to have both in one car, but I can't.
I still go to local car shows and adore looking at the more special ICE cars, I love seeing supercars in town most days too, the sound as they make their way through our old town streets is excellent
but one thing has changed, I used to look at such cars and dream of the day I could own something so fast and so high tech - that element of my appreciation has now been usurped by EV because I do have an EV that is 'that fast' and technically evolved ahead of what can be achieved with any ICE - in terms of throttle response and gear shift speeds etc, not just boring efficiency stuff.I'm still a fan of all car types, for what each offers. But a big chunk of my engineering mindset has been stolen by EV, because I always appreciated a fantastic powertrain.
TheDeuce said:
It's a tricky one...
ICE cars like above do have a cool factor for sure. The problem is that if you have an appreciation for well made machines, effective design and engineering... It's very difficult to have a performance EV and then go back to taking performance ICE very seriously, because as a product of engineering, the ICE is very crude and relatively ineffective by direct comparison.
I love a great sounding engine, I just know that if I drove most cars that do have such an engine these days, a big part of me would wish that I could have that fun and drama but also the more energetic performance of EV. I'd love to have both in one car, but I can't.
I still go to local car shows and adore looking at the more special ICE cars, I love seeing supercars in town most days too, the sound as they make their way through our old town streets is excellent but one thing has changed, I used to look at such cars and dream of the day I could own something so fast and so high tech - that element of my appreciation has now been usurped by EV because I do have an EV that is 'that fast' and technically evolved ahead of what can be achieved with any ICE - in terms of throttle response and gear shift speeds etc, not just boring efficiency stuff.
I'm still a fan of all car types, for what each offers. But a big chunk of my engineering mindset has been stolen by EV, because I always appreciated a fantastic powertrain.
For me the engineering of ICE vs EV is a lot like mechanical vs quartz watches. Quartz is superior for time keeping, but not really interesting from an engineering point of view. ICE cars like above do have a cool factor for sure. The problem is that if you have an appreciation for well made machines, effective design and engineering... It's very difficult to have a performance EV and then go back to taking performance ICE very seriously, because as a product of engineering, the ICE is very crude and relatively ineffective by direct comparison.
I love a great sounding engine, I just know that if I drove most cars that do have such an engine these days, a big part of me would wish that I could have that fun and drama but also the more energetic performance of EV. I'd love to have both in one car, but I can't.
I still go to local car shows and adore looking at the more special ICE cars, I love seeing supercars in town most days too, the sound as they make their way through our old town streets is excellent
but one thing has changed, I used to look at such cars and dream of the day I could own something so fast and so high tech - that element of my appreciation has now been usurped by EV because I do have an EV that is 'that fast' and technically evolved ahead of what can be achieved with any ICE - in terms of throttle response and gear shift speeds etc, not just boring efficiency stuff.I'm still a fan of all car types, for what each offers. But a big chunk of my engineering mindset has been stolen by EV, because I always appreciated a fantastic powertrain.
car user said:
For me the engineering of ICE vs EV is a lot like mechanical vs quartz watches. Quartz is superior for time keeping, but not really interesting from an engineering point of view.
Steam engines are interesting but I would't want one powering my vehicle. Similarly I find the different designs of 2 stroke versus 4 stroke, Bore, stroke ratios, Camshaft design/placement, head design, supercharging, turbocharging etc.etc. interesting as well. But when an electric motor can do all that an ICE engine can but more efficiently and reliably with less drama then the ICE for me becomes like that steam engine. Fascinating but largely irrelevant going forward.I would not dream of wearing a mechanical watch for day to day use as mine has numerous other functions as well and keeps time perfectly. I may take out one of my dress watches for special occasions but that is all. It is not being worn for functionality.
I say this as guy that has built and rebuilt a few engines and boxes and an engineer by qualification. All that noise and heat the ICE engine makes is just indicating a lack of efficiency and thereby performance.
Seasonal Hero said:
wormus said:
Because this is cool
Not a single person here is listening to you about things like 'this is cool' 
Why? Because you are the very definition of boring. You could drive every ICE car in the world and that would remain the case.
Not everything new is automatically better in my eyes, and the same goes for EVs for me as well. They are fast and quiet...yes, but better? Not for me.
If I was left with only one car, and it had to be an EV, I'd personally miss swapping my own cogs, and listening to the engine and exhaust for sure. I liken EVs to automatic gearboxes, and an auto gearbox is quicker and more efficient than a manual gearbox for definite, but better? Not in my eyes.
If I was left with only one car, and it had to be an EV, I'd personally miss swapping my own cogs, and listening to the engine and exhaust for sure. I liken EVs to automatic gearboxes, and an auto gearbox is quicker and more efficient than a manual gearbox for definite, but better? Not in my eyes.
Seasonal Hero said:
wormus said:
Because this is cool
Not a single person here is listening to you about things like 'this is cool' Why? Because you are the very definition of boring. You could drive every ICE car in the world and that would remain the case.
fatjon said:
OK should I flog my really fast EV and find something that is less fast that costs a wad to run and makes a farting noise and smoke when it goes? Suppose I could be ultra cool and get something with a steam engine, or maybe rollers like Fred Flintstone.
No, you should definitely keep the car that nobody’s interested in and keep reminding them how “really fast” it is. Women will want you, men will want to be you, just like Steve McQueen.Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 28th March 17:42
cerb4.5lee said:
Not everything new is automatically better in my eyes, and the same goes for EVs for me as well. They are fast and quiet...yes, but better? Not for me.
If I was left with only one car, and it had to be an EV, I'd personally miss swapping my own cogs, and listening to the engine and exhaust for sure. I liken EVs to automatic gearboxes, and an auto gearbox is quicker and more efficient than a manual gearbox for definite, but better? Not in my eyes.
I can see where you're coming from with that; an EV is undoubtedly more efficient but I'm less convinced it would be involving to drive in the way a good petrol with a manual gearbox is. If I was left with only one car, and it had to be an EV, I'd personally miss swapping my own cogs, and listening to the engine and exhaust for sure. I liken EVs to automatic gearboxes, and an auto gearbox is quicker and more efficient than a manual gearbox for definite, but better? Not in my eyes.
But for a lot of the daily grind you arguably don't want to be that involved which is why to me for a petrolhead the ideal solution is probably an EV for everyday use supplemented by a driver focused ICE car - or maybe a motorbike - for fun. And for the vast majority of the driving public - who with the best will in the world aren't petrolheads - an EV makes a lot of sense, especially if they can charge at home...
wormus said:
No, you should definitely keep the car that nobody’s interested in and keep reminding them how “really fast” it is. Women will want you, men will want to be you, just like Steve McQueen.
Thanks for the advice. Are you sure women are getting damp at the sight of your tyre smoking Steve McQueen impression farting its way down the road? Sorry to pee on your firework but I learned long ago that what they are really thinking is “look at that pillock in his penis extension” while laughing about what it’s making up for.Edited by wormus on Thursday 28th March 17:42
I had a Model S five years ago, with the “Ludicrous” speed specification (apologies for not knowing the variant, maybe P100D?) and while it was obviously extremely fast, it only felt it up to around 40mph.
The numbers show that it was still fast far beyond it, but it didn’t feel it.
Given that what I enjoy in a fast car is the sensation of speed it just wasn’t for me.
I now have among other things an undoubtedly slower Range Rover Sport with 650bhp, and enjoy the feeling of acceleration in that far more.
The numbers show that it was still fast far beyond it, but it didn’t feel it.
Given that what I enjoy in a fast car is the sensation of speed it just wasn’t for me.
I now have among other things an undoubtedly slower Range Rover Sport with 650bhp, and enjoy the feeling of acceleration in that far more.
TheDeuce said:
...The problem is that if you have an appreciation for well made machines, effective design and engineering... It's very difficult to have a performance EV and then go back to taking performance ICE very seriously, because as a product of engineering, the ICE is very crude and relatively ineffective by direct comparison.
I still go to local car shows and adore looking at the more special ICE cars, I love seeing supercars in town most days too, the sound as they make their way through our old town streets is excellent but one thing has changed, I used to look at such cars and dream of the day I could own something so fast and so high tech - that element of my appreciation has now been usurped by EV because I do have an EV that is 'that fast' and technically evolved ahead of what can be achieved with any ICE - in terms of throttle response and gear shift speeds etc, not just boring efficiency stuff.
I'm still a fan of all car types, for what each offers. But a big chunk of my engineering mindset has been stolen by EV, because I always appreciated a fantastic powertrain.
Exactly!I still go to local car shows and adore looking at the more special ICE cars, I love seeing supercars in town most days too, the sound as they make their way through our old town streets is excellent
but one thing has changed, I used to look at such cars and dream of the day I could own something so fast and so high tech - that element of my appreciation has now been usurped by EV because I do have an EV that is 'that fast' and technically evolved ahead of what can be achieved with any ICE - in terms of throttle response and gear shift speeds etc, not just boring efficiency stuff.I'm still a fan of all car types, for what each offers. But a big chunk of my engineering mindset has been stolen by EV, because I always appreciated a fantastic powertrain.
My performance EV is quicker below about 120 mph plus corners and brakes as hard or harder than even the prototypical modern supercar. the Porsche 959!
That fact still amazes me
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