Porsche Taycan and future Porsche EVs and values
Discussion
theboss said:
AMVSVNick said:
theboss said:
22kW is nice to have if you can take advantage of it, but its value really depends on whether you expect you will need to charge at that rate. i.e. if you have a regular journey profile that puts to at the 3-phase site whereby you need to get as much charge in a short space of time. You might find you don't deplete the battery heavily as much as you expected, or that you do so overnight when it doesn't matter if it's charging at 22 or 11.
I only say this because I have it on one of my cars (iX M60), it's standard so I didn't have to seek it out, but now having done 11k miles in the car there have only been 2 or 3 occasions when it was of any real benefit. It was quite handy on those occasions, but not to the extent I might think it worth spending thousands of pounds for.l
Surely the benefit is being able to charge within the cheap overnight tariff hours? Happy to be corrected as I’m new to this as you may have gathered. I only say this because I have it on one of my cars (iX M60), it's standard so I didn't have to seek it out, but now having done 11k miles in the car there have only been 2 or 3 occasions when it was of any real benefit. It was quite handy on those occasions, but not to the extent I might think it worth spending thousands of pounds for.l
In reality for me at least, I find I am rarely wanting to add more than 50% or so of the battery overnight. If you know you’re going to be smashing through 90% of the battery regularly on consecutive days it will certainly have value.
Another point is that a smart tarrif like Intelligent Octopus will just allocate off-peak charging slots until its reached the desired charge level, its not guaranteed but in practice you can be reasonably assured that if you plugged in needing a full charge at 11kW it would all be done at the low rate.
22kW AC is also near ubiquitous on the continent and very handy to be able to get a useful charge whilst parked on street for a few hours. The one time I really thought it useful was when checking into a hotel late in France on 2% charge (I don’r mess around
) needing to leave early the next morning, being told I could use their AC charger for free and then ripping 115kWH out of it in a little over 5 hours whilst sleeping. Most comparable AC setups in the UK seem to he 7.4kW or 11kW, you don’t see as many 22kW. Worth knowing if you travel over the channel a lot.PinkHouse said:
Once these drop into the £30ks like the BMW i8, they would be impossible to resist for many, myself included
Same hereI'll buy one with OPC warranty and run it until that's no longer available and mentally write off the cost.
The OPC warranty coverage is costly but absolutely excellent
AMVSVNick said:
b0rk said:
AMVSVNick said:
Surely the benefit is being able to charge within the cheap overnight tariff hours? Happy to be corrected as I’m new to this as you may have gathered.
You’d need a domestic three phase supply for that to be a benefit which are somewhat rare. If you want a three phase supply then contact your DNO and ask for a quote, typical costs are in the range £3.5k to £7k. You also need to be racking up the miles per day for a normal slow 11kw charge to not provide enough of a top up.
Without venturing too far off topic the main 3-phase clincher for me was the fact that we daily 2 EVs and if you want to start keeping two cars charged on the off peak, it’s a game changer. Two chargers, plug both in each night and no faffing about having to time charges or swap cables. My chargers limit the sum of both charges respecting the DNO’s 22kW allocation but this is more than ample to keep 2 x 11kW cars charged on the cheap.
It also does this whilst providing ample headroom for battery storage, future electrification of heating and you can have a bigger PV setup without requiring approval.
There is also a hypothetical selfish “get in first” aspect because once the DNO have allocated a certain amount of capacity it might get harder for others to obtain the same without local grid upgrades.
It also does this whilst providing ample headroom for battery storage, future electrification of heating and you can have a bigger PV setup without requiring approval.
There is also a hypothetical selfish “get in first” aspect because once the DNO have allocated a certain amount of capacity it might get harder for others to obtain the same without local grid upgrades.
Edited by theboss on Sunday 28th January 11:03
AMVSVNick said:
Surely the benefit is being able to charge within the cheap overnight tariff hours? Happy to be corrected as I’m new to this as you may have gathered.
Octopus intelligent often fixes that for you, giving you much longer cheap rate than the standard 11:30 - 5:30. Indeed it has always charged my car (iPace so similar sized battery) for as long as required at the cheap rate (10 hrs for me last time). Plus when charging ALL electricity used by the house is at this rate.AMVSVNick said:
Frankychops said:
a used one since they've tanked in value would be the most sensible, 50ish K. worth noting that at our work its been a challenge to get one of them to do 25k in a year. its been spread between the 2 cars and the varous hire cars that the workshop gives.
As in reliability?kmpowell said:
Ok from that list then I’ve removed the GTS standard kit and left the options…
- Standard 20" Wheels (not optional 21's as they hammer range by 5-10%)
- 4+1 seating
- Adaptive Cruise (makes motorway/long-range driving so much more relaxing)
- Surround view (it's a big car, so parking is tricky)
- Ambient lighting
- Lane change assist (for the motorway driving becasue you are sat quite low down)
- Panoramic roof ( it's a long car so can feel claustrophobic)
- Electric Charging cover (not necessarily a must-have, but the button on the inside of teh car allows you to open it when the cars dirty without getting dirty fingers/hands)
- Auto-dimming mirrors (for night-time motorway driving)
- BOSE or Burmester (the standard system is ste so if you do long journeys and like your music, this is a must)
- 150kw DC-DC converter (an absolute must if you want to use rapid chargers on the go as they differ (some are 400v))
- 22kW on-board AC charger (if you plan to charge at the office)
All subjective, but I'd have the 21s on a GTS as they look great.- Standard 20" Wheels (not optional 21's as they hammer range by 5-10%)
- 4+1 seating
- Adaptive Cruise (makes motorway/long-range driving so much more relaxing)
- Surround view (it's a big car, so parking is tricky)
- Ambient lighting
- Lane change assist (for the motorway driving becasue you are sat quite low down)
- Panoramic roof ( it's a long car so can feel claustrophobic)
- Electric Charging cover (not necessarily a must-have, but the button on the inside of teh car allows you to open it when the cars dirty without getting dirty fingers/hands)
- Auto-dimming mirrors (for night-time motorway driving)
- BOSE or Burmester (the standard system is ste so if you do long journeys and like your music, this is a must)
- 150kw DC-DC converter (an absolute must if you want to use rapid chargers on the go as they differ (some are 400v))
- 22kW on-board AC charger (if you plan to charge at the office)
I'd drop the electric charge port cover (not neded), would go Bose and would drop the 150kW charger...
OP all depends on use.
How many miles per day will you genuinely be doing? How much charging on the hoof? What times do you get home/set off?
22kW can be added afterwards, but think it's iro £6k. As others have noted, I've not struggled getting the car charged up as needed in the cheaper tariff times, and am now finding that if I drain the car more, Intelligent Octopus does seem to extend the cheap window pretty reliably. It'd be great if it would do this for 2x EVs as the whole house gets the cheap rate at the same time...so 2x EVs needing more charge would be handy
(As I type that I'm wondering if linking Octopus up with a charger might actually be the better way in this scenario....).Our "regular" longer route is up the M11/A14/A1 corridor and charging infrastructure is great. Not yet had a single issue. Would be nice if Ionity put a station further north than Peterborough (or Gridserve hadn't started to catch up on price gouging with the others).
Will be going South West in it over Easter, so will see how that works out
Reliability concerns aside (mine had to have the pano roof replaced - internal cracks. Dealer handled it brilliantly), they're fab cars.
Murph7355 said:
All subjective, but I'd have the 21s on a GTS as they look great.
I'd drop the electric charge port cover (not neded), would go Bose and would drop the 150kW charger...
OP all depends on use.
How many miles per day will you genuinely be doing? How much charging on the hoof? What times do you get home/set off?
22kW can be added afterwards, but think it's iro £6k. As others have noted, I've not struggled getting the car charged up as needed in the cheaper tariff times, and am now finding that if I drain the car more, Intelligent Octopus does seem to extend the cheap window pretty reliably. It'd be great if it would do this for 2x EVs as the whole house gets the cheap rate at the same time...so 2x EVs needing more charge would be handy (As I type that I'm wondering if linking Octopus up with a charger might actually be the better way in this scenario....).
Our "regular" longer route is up the M11/A14/A1 corridor and charging infrastructure is great. Not yet had a single issue. Would be nice if Ionity put a station further north than Peterborough (or Gridserve hadn't started to catch up on price gouging with the others).
Will be going South West in it over Easter, so will see how that works out
Reliability concerns aside (mine had to have the pano roof replaced - internal cracks. Dealer handled it brilliantly), they're fab cars.
Thanks, Andy.I'd drop the electric charge port cover (not neded), would go Bose and would drop the 150kW charger...
OP all depends on use.
How many miles per day will you genuinely be doing? How much charging on the hoof? What times do you get home/set off?
22kW can be added afterwards, but think it's iro £6k. As others have noted, I've not struggled getting the car charged up as needed in the cheaper tariff times, and am now finding that if I drain the car more, Intelligent Octopus does seem to extend the cheap window pretty reliably. It'd be great if it would do this for 2x EVs as the whole house gets the cheap rate at the same time...so 2x EVs needing more charge would be handy
(As I type that I'm wondering if linking Octopus up with a charger might actually be the better way in this scenario....).Our "regular" longer route is up the M11/A14/A1 corridor and charging infrastructure is great. Not yet had a single issue. Would be nice if Ionity put a station further north than Peterborough (or Gridserve hadn't started to catch up on price gouging with the others).
Will be going South West in it over Easter, so will see how that works out
Reliability concerns aside (mine had to have the pano roof replaced - internal cracks. Dealer handled it brilliantly), they're fab cars.
The mileage is the tricky bit. Some days 100, some days 200 so would be good to have 22kw if possible even though may not be needed regularly. It's all school and sports runs
I've put a deal to my local OPC to include the upgrade as I don't suppose it cost's them £6k.
A mate has mentioned 22kw charging is not good for the battery, any thoughts on that point?
Cheers,
Nick
AMVSVNick said:
Thanks, Andy.
The mileage is the tricky bit. Some days 100, some days 200 so would be good to have 22kw if possible even though may not be needed regularly. It's all school and sports runs
I've put a deal to my local OPC to include the upgrade as I don't suppose it cost's them £6k.
A mate has mentioned 22kw charging is not good for the battery, any thoughts on that point?
Cheers,
Nick
Not sure.The mileage is the tricky bit. Some days 100, some days 200 so would be good to have 22kw if possible even though may not be needed regularly. It's all school and sports runs
I've put a deal to my local OPC to include the upgrade as I don't suppose it cost's them £6k.
A mate has mentioned 22kw charging is not good for the battery, any thoughts on that point?
Cheers,
Nick
I've heard that doing lots of rapid DC charging isn't good for them too. And that loads of 3 pin plug charging is bad. Who knows what to believe
I'm just charging mine up when I need to with whatever's available to do it. I only charge to 85% most of the time (that advice seems consistent with all battery operated devices) and try and run it low (10%-20%) now and then. Though not when the wife's in the car.
My view is to not do anything that's especially inconvenient as that defeats the object.
Thus far the benefits of not visiting a petrol station regularly outweigh the odd quick charge stop on longer journeys. But I don't do a huge amount of the latter.
I suspect the dealer may not see things like you do, but who knows
If it's a car they've had on a while, you never know! Good luck, and fire away with any more questions (Taycan Forum is very busy too).
AMVSVNick said:
Thanks, Andy.
The mileage is the tricky bit. Some days 100, some days 200 so would be good to have 22kw if possible even though may not be needed regularly. It's all school and sports runs
I've put a deal to my local OPC to include the upgrade as I don't suppose it cost's them £6k.
A mate has mentioned 22kw charging is not good for the battery, any thoughts on that point?
Cheers,
Nick
Porsche told me the issue is having the 22kw option but not using it the majority of the time. I.e. only charging at 7.2 or 11kw. Basically if you have access to 3 phase for most of your charging, spec it. Otherwise it will increases battery degradation. I’d be wary of buying a used Taycan with 22kw option for this reason alone.The mileage is the tricky bit. Some days 100, some days 200 so would be good to have 22kw if possible even though may not be needed regularly. It's all school and sports runs
I've put a deal to my local OPC to include the upgrade as I don't suppose it cost's them £6k.
A mate has mentioned 22kw charging is not good for the battery, any thoughts on that point?
Cheers,
Nick
garystoybox said:
AMVSVNick said:
Thanks, Andy.
The mileage is the tricky bit. Some days 100, some days 200 so would be good to have 22kw if possible even though may not be needed regularly. It's all school and sports runs
I've put a deal to my local OPC to include the upgrade as I don't suppose it cost's them £6k.
A mate has mentioned 22kw charging is not good for the battery, any thoughts on that point?
Cheers,
Nick
Porsche told me the issue is having the 22kw option but not using it the majority of the time. I.e. only charging at 7.2 or 11kw. Basically if you have access to 3 phase for most of your charging, spec it. Otherwise it will increases battery degradation. I’d be wary of buying a used Taycan with 22kw option for this reason alone.The mileage is the tricky bit. Some days 100, some days 200 so would be good to have 22kw if possible even though may not be needed regularly. It's all school and sports runs
I've put a deal to my local OPC to include the upgrade as I don't suppose it cost's them £6k.
A mate has mentioned 22kw charging is not good for the battery, any thoughts on that point?
Cheers,
Nick
Sidsw said:
So probably a real world range of 270-300 miles, about 30% better than in my previous Taycan ST 4S ownership experience......is-uk said:
I was reading that today and it is great to see the range improving for the Taycan.2. It reminded me, though, why I gave up on Autocar a while ago:
Plus, an ambient temperature of just 15-16deg C at time of test suggests there's room to substantially improve upon that maximum in warmer climes.
I’m not sure what relevance that statement has for a UK magazine written for UK customers.
is-uk said:
Still trying to do a deal on one, hopefully this will help 
To hr honest as nice as the extra range would be to have I think at this point I'd rather just spend more time charging than sign up for another 100 grand plus of depreciation on the upgrade.
My turbo S CT is at half of its value already at 3 years and 20k miles, so it's a sobering thought that yo do that again would fund a 992 Turbo S with the depreciation!
My turbo S CT is at half of its value already at 3 years and 20k miles, so it's a sobering thought that yo do that again would fund a 992 Turbo S with the depreciation!
It would be nice.
It seems the first thing they might have done is close the gap between nominal battery capacity and usable.
The Macan seems to have a 100kWh nominal with 96kWh usable. I suspect the Taycan will be using the same pack (roughly - shape etc may change). So only 4% not available to the driver.
The Taycan I has 93.4kWh nominal and 83.7kWh usable. Over a 10% gap.
Running them both the same way, with no other changes, the WLTP figure for a Taycan I would be ~322 versus 300.
The gap on the mkI seems too big. That must surely be adjustable via software.
Charging is also something I've not had any issues with. When I charge at DC point I've always received a peak of 170-270kW. At that rate the car's been full before the kids have finished using the toilet and grabbing a snack.
It seems the first thing they might have done is close the gap between nominal battery capacity and usable.
The Macan seems to have a 100kWh nominal with 96kWh usable. I suspect the Taycan will be using the same pack (roughly - shape etc may change). So only 4% not available to the driver.
The Taycan I has 93.4kWh nominal and 83.7kWh usable. Over a 10% gap.
Running them both the same way, with no other changes, the WLTP figure for a Taycan I would be ~322 versus 300.
The gap on the mkI seems too big. That must surely be adjustable via software.
Charging is also something I've not had any issues with. When I charge at DC point I've always received a peak of 170-270kW. At that rate the car's been full before the kids have finished using the toilet and grabbing a snack.
450 miles in the facelift Taycan.
Quite impressive, but how come the new Macan E does over 100 miles less?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScnmG2wCZTw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab1AIGLpd_0&t=...
Quite impressive, but how come the new Macan E does over 100 miles less?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScnmG2wCZTw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab1AIGLpd_0&t=...
GTS440 said:
450 miles in the facelift Taycan.
Quite impressive, but how come the new Macan E does over 100 miles less?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScnmG2wCZTw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab1AIGLpd_0&t=...
The Taycan is a hyper mile test the Macan's is at 70 mph Quite impressive, but how come the new Macan E does over 100 miles less?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScnmG2wCZTw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ab1AIGLpd_0&t=...
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