Discussion
Opinions have been voiced extensively, we should now move on.
Further kicking and moaning is not likely to achieve anything beneficial for the scene. The show was by no means a failure, it was not busy but we did sell 2 MEV Rockets to two guys that we had not spoken to before, they handed money over at the show, RTR inform me that they have since sold a MEV Sonic7 to another customer who first appeared at the Stafford show. I will always remain therefore eternally grateful that the show went ahead.
Those with positive suggestions as to how the future of kit car shows should be run would be well received at this thread.
http://pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Further kicking and moaning is not likely to achieve anything beneficial for the scene. The show was by no means a failure, it was not busy but we did sell 2 MEV Rockets to two guys that we had not spoken to before, they handed money over at the show, RTR inform me that they have since sold a MEV Sonic7 to another customer who first appeared at the Stafford show. I will always remain therefore eternally grateful that the show went ahead.
Those with positive suggestions as to how the future of kit car shows should be run would be well received at this thread.
http://pistonheads.co.uk/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
I agree time to move on.
I found the original discussions very informative and interesting but I think the topic has reached a natural conclusion.
Judging the most effective marketing methods in business is a very risky, personal and tricky decision.
It will be interesting to see the reality of how shows develop over the next year.
I found the original discussions very informative and interesting but I think the topic has reached a natural conclusion.
Judging the most effective marketing methods in business is a very risky, personal and tricky decision.
It will be interesting to see the reality of how shows develop over the next year.
DEN TANNER said:
Ronnis,
For your information, there were 23 manufacturers and 40 parts/accessories stands at this year’s Stafford show.
Which hall was this lot in then as I seem to have missed most of them.....For your information, there were 23 manufacturers and 40 parts/accessories stands at this year’s Stafford show.
Bottom line about Stafford is that it was ok'ish 3 years ago, then very bad last year which lead to people saying its was going to be even sh!tter this year, which kept the traders away which in turn kept the putners away.
As for advertising, very poor. Not a single road sign up anywhere I noticed. Very little advertising, poor communication to the clubs.
If you knew it was being sabotaged (by whom?) then wouldn't it have been best to call it off an re-group in a future year instead of suffering the shame of a naff show and the potential financial losses?
As for the bickering Dennis and Ronnis make it constructive, Ronnis has some valid questions that could be answered about the Stafford Show (this topics subject)
There are a mass of new ways to market shows, advertising on the internet, every kit car club forum should be well frequented by an organiser to promote and answer and questions that may arise about an upcoming show, wouldn't take a huge amount of time and would reap rewards. Facebook and other social media can be used, advertising in similar magazines, ie Classic car/Max power/classic bikes/other petrol mags to get the word out to other audiences that might have an interest in petrol based amusement. The ideas are all out there, it just needs a sensible organiser to screw their head on right and do it properly instead of half assed.
Edited by Rob52 on Wednesday 19th October 14:32
Stuart Mills said:
The show was by no means a failure, it was not busy but we did sell 2 MEV Rockets... RTR inform me that they have since sold a MEV Sonic7... at the Stafford show. I will always remain therefore eternally grateful that the show went ahead.
Thanks Stuart!looks like you earned more from it than I did. Good luck to you!
Steffan said:
I found the original discussions very informative and interesting but I think the topic has reached a natural conclusion.
I was prepared to answer questions concerning the reasons I gave for the event's lack-lustre performance. But nobody asked. I've had a bad experience - not the first and almost certainly not the last - but I'm still in this industry. I need to learn something from this experience, because.... remember my first post?
DEN TANNER said:
Bounce
Rob52 said:
Which hall was this lot in then as I seem to have missed most of them.....
I've got a PDF article from CPR magazine which is awash with photos of the event..... shows how full/empty the hall was. Along with their unbiased, third-party opinion of the event. I've accepted that it wasn't good, but believe it wasn't that bad either. I think they, like Stuart, agree.Can anybody explain how I can 'attach' this PDF to this thread?
Den
Den,
It was not that bad. It has been better.
Unfortunately one of the English failings is tearing into successful people.
We do not have the Australian 'Good On Yer' approach to success.
I suspect you are already aware of this.
I have no doubt you will bounce back successfully.
Nothing will annoy your enemies more than a full recovery.
Which I have no doubt you will create. Bounce Den, Bounce.
Good luck to you
It was not that bad. It has been better.
Unfortunately one of the English failings is tearing into successful people.
We do not have the Australian 'Good On Yer' approach to success.
I suspect you are already aware of this.
I have no doubt you will bounce back successfully.
Nothing will annoy your enemies more than a full recovery.
Which I have no doubt you will create. Bounce Den, Bounce.
Good luck to you
Hi Folks,
In the next edition of my magazine there's a Stafford show report by Rob Hawkins. It's a positive report. At the end of it I'm appending a personal note: a draft of which follows:-
Den
In the next edition of my magazine there's a Stafford show report by Rob Hawkins. It's a positive report. At the end of it I'm appending a personal note: a draft of which follows:-
Kit Car Mag said:
Apologies Folks!
Whilst we’ve put a brave face on the 2011
Stafford show, the truth is that it wasn’t nearly
as good as it should have been.
Yes, it suffered as a result of the general
economic downturn; whilst the threat of
torrential weather on both days clearly didn’t
help either.
However, its main problem was that it simply
never had the widespread support of the
industry. Without the industry on show, or
at least enough of it, it struggled to attract
sufficient visitors. That in turn made it harder
to attract manufacturers who were thinner on
the ground this year than last.
I know when I’m beat, so there are no immediate
plans for the Stafford show to be repeated next
year.
As to the reasons for the lack of support; there
are many which I’ll not detail here. Save what I
regard as the most important one. There are some
manufacturers who, rightly or wrongly, see me
as a trouble-maker with too much influence.
Well, I have to admit that I can understand their
point-of view and intend to address this problem
before I embark on any further show ventures.
For now: please accept my most sincere apologies
for not delivering the show I honestly believed
Stafford would have become by now.
Contritely,
Big Ed - Den
Any advice on this wording would be appreciated. It's going to press in the next couple of days.Whilst we’ve put a brave face on the 2011
Stafford show, the truth is that it wasn’t nearly
as good as it should have been.
Yes, it suffered as a result of the general
economic downturn; whilst the threat of
torrential weather on both days clearly didn’t
help either.
However, its main problem was that it simply
never had the widespread support of the
industry. Without the industry on show, or
at least enough of it, it struggled to attract
sufficient visitors. That in turn made it harder
to attract manufacturers who were thinner on
the ground this year than last.
I know when I’m beat, so there are no immediate
plans for the Stafford show to be repeated next
year.
As to the reasons for the lack of support; there
are many which I’ll not detail here. Save what I
regard as the most important one. There are some
manufacturers who, rightly or wrongly, see me
as a trouble-maker with too much influence.
Well, I have to admit that I can understand their
point-of view and intend to address this problem
before I embark on any further show ventures.
For now: please accept my most sincere apologies
for not delivering the show I honestly believed
Stafford would have become by now.
Contritely,
Big Ed - Den
Den
Latest comment on the Exeter show in another thread show is interesting see:http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&f=30&t=1062954&i=20&mid=&nmt=
I thought Exter was excellent but clearly not everybody is happy.
Business is a really tough world currently. Downturns everywhere.
I thought Exter was excellent but clearly not everybody is happy.
Business is a really tough world currently. Downturns everywhere.
Meeja said:
Den - could you please publish your email address in this thread?
My email address is kitcarman at ntlworld dot com (encoded to avoid bots and spiders).Hi Meeja,
I'm sorry, I had no idea that my post might or could be taken as a promo of the mag. It certainly wasn't intended as such.
I trust that it's OK to discuss aspects of the apology itself here on PH? Just trying to ensure that I say what I mean (both here and in print). Many problems have arisen in the past because people haven't truly understood where I'm coming from. Seemed to me that discussions along those lines would be fruitful in understanding what went wrong at Stafford and help any future events in which I might become involved.
Den
DEN TANNER said:
Meeja said:
Den - could you please publish your email address in this thread?
My email address is kitcarman at ntlworld dot com (encoded to avoid bots and spiders).Hi Meeja,
I'm sorry, I had no idea that my post might or could be taken as a promo of the mag. It certainly wasn't intended as such.
I trust that it's OK to discuss aspects of the apology itself here on PH? Just trying to ensure that I say what I mean (both here and in print). Many problems have arisen in the past because people haven't truly understood where I'm coming from. Seemed to me that discussions along those lines would be fruitful in understanding what went wrong at Stafford and help any future events in which I might become involved.
Den
Meeja said:
I'd just be more comfortable with discussions about content for a magazine that you publish not being discussed on here.... Some members could take the view that it is simply a self-promotion exercise... Which is not allowed under the terms and conditions of membership.
Understood!Want me to remove or edit the post which gives rise to your concern?
Den
I've just read through the whole thread from post 1 and really believe there are some good, valid ideas floating in amongst the posts.
I did attend the Stafford show in my capacity as membership secretary for the Dutton Owners Club, Den allowed us to put some of our cars in the hall which was unexpected and I hope that they helped contribute something, no matter how small, to the event.
We stayed and spoke to Den after the event and I have some understanding of how he actually must have been feeling at the time, I hope time has dulled the emotions a little Den but I don't think anyone could really understand just how badly you felt Sunday afternoon.
From what I could see at the time I think the main failing was having to site share with two other events, not having full control of a site when hosting any event is a nightmare. At Stoneleigh the only people who get in free are the drivers. If everybody who actually showed up had chipped in a token £3 or £4 I imagine it would have been a different ball game financially at Stafford, as far as I am aware not one driver or passenger paid a penny to attend the event and the only way to charge was for admission to the hall.
I have noticed that a lot of the clubs have been very quiet and decided that I would try to post some ideas from my club's point of view. If any of the other club bodies are on here then chip in lads.
I would like to see some of the following content in 'my ideal car show'.
Spectator based entertainment, as suggested earlier in the thread. anything that will make the crowd go WOW (apart from a lap dancing tent) will draw a crowd, look at the spectators around the westfield experience at Stoneleigh or indeed Stafford a couple of years back. Maybe not a huge crowd but it did make people sit up and take notice. Performed in a smallish space it made enough noise to let the whole site know it was running, again that will attract an audience.
Driver participation events such as Autotests, 1/4 mile runs, obstacle courses for the 4x4 drivers, short circuit races (allowing for space and saftey issues)
Club participation events such as pit stop challenges, even a good old fashioned tug of war against another club or even a vehicle (which gets manafacturers involved too), best club stand etc
Audience participation events. If the manafacturers, and I don't mean to insult anybody on here, put their products into a moving demonstration of some kind like the autotests, 1/4 mile runs or circuit runs then take paying passengers with them surely this has to be better than a static display of how shiney is your gelcoat? All the cars in the hall look really good polished up, lets see some of them strutting their stuff in a bit of freindly rivalry maybe. You might have to classify the cars though as I don't see my Dutton keeping up with an exocet somehow.
A skidpan for members of the public to have a go on in a RWD, FWD and 4WD vehicles, learn something and play dirty at the same time.
Sorry if the spelling and grammar are pants by the way, feel free to correct as applicable.
Also, just as a side line, if anyone on here used to own a Dutton but doesn't want to admit it in public, we are doing a survey (still going) of all Tim's creations and are interested in any tales and stories you may have of your experiences. Any information on your old cars or tales you wish to tell can be mailed to me as membershipsecretary at duttonownersclub dot co dot uk.
All the best Den, let me know if there is anything the club or I can do for you in the future.
I did attend the Stafford show in my capacity as membership secretary for the Dutton Owners Club, Den allowed us to put some of our cars in the hall which was unexpected and I hope that they helped contribute something, no matter how small, to the event.
We stayed and spoke to Den after the event and I have some understanding of how he actually must have been feeling at the time, I hope time has dulled the emotions a little Den but I don't think anyone could really understand just how badly you felt Sunday afternoon.
From what I could see at the time I think the main failing was having to site share with two other events, not having full control of a site when hosting any event is a nightmare. At Stoneleigh the only people who get in free are the drivers. If everybody who actually showed up had chipped in a token £3 or £4 I imagine it would have been a different ball game financially at Stafford, as far as I am aware not one driver or passenger paid a penny to attend the event and the only way to charge was for admission to the hall.
I have noticed that a lot of the clubs have been very quiet and decided that I would try to post some ideas from my club's point of view. If any of the other club bodies are on here then chip in lads.
I would like to see some of the following content in 'my ideal car show'.
Spectator based entertainment, as suggested earlier in the thread. anything that will make the crowd go WOW (apart from a lap dancing tent) will draw a crowd, look at the spectators around the westfield experience at Stoneleigh or indeed Stafford a couple of years back. Maybe not a huge crowd but it did make people sit up and take notice. Performed in a smallish space it made enough noise to let the whole site know it was running, again that will attract an audience.
Driver participation events such as Autotests, 1/4 mile runs, obstacle courses for the 4x4 drivers, short circuit races (allowing for space and saftey issues)
Club participation events such as pit stop challenges, even a good old fashioned tug of war against another club or even a vehicle (which gets manafacturers involved too), best club stand etc
Audience participation events. If the manafacturers, and I don't mean to insult anybody on here, put their products into a moving demonstration of some kind like the autotests, 1/4 mile runs or circuit runs then take paying passengers with them surely this has to be better than a static display of how shiney is your gelcoat? All the cars in the hall look really good polished up, lets see some of them strutting their stuff in a bit of freindly rivalry maybe. You might have to classify the cars though as I don't see my Dutton keeping up with an exocet somehow.
A skidpan for members of the public to have a go on in a RWD, FWD and 4WD vehicles, learn something and play dirty at the same time.
Sorry if the spelling and grammar are pants by the way, feel free to correct as applicable.
Also, just as a side line, if anyone on here used to own a Dutton but doesn't want to admit it in public, we are doing a survey (still going) of all Tim's creations and are interested in any tales and stories you may have of your experiences. Any information on your old cars or tales you wish to tell can be mailed to me as membershipsecretary at duttonownersclub dot co dot uk.
All the best Den, let me know if there is anything the club or I can do for you in the future.
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