Three wheeler Cabin Scooter Design
Discussion
911hillclimber said:
Qudos: we all wish you the very best and a discount for doing Market Research for you!
I think anyone has to be carefull about the style here. Too zaney and people will laugh and walk away.
In the UK the Smart car is a rare sight even now. go to Italy and they are everywhere, you can even hire them for hols or city visits from airports.
The Lotus style is about as wild as you can tolerate maybe; would a 50 year old woman buy one? My 23 year old daughter might.
That door though takes space to get out of the car, this design we started on is a great solution, though harder to manufacture.
Thanks for the encouragement I think anyone has to be carefull about the style here. Too zaney and people will laugh and walk away.
In the UK the Smart car is a rare sight even now. go to Italy and they are everywhere, you can even hire them for hols or city visits from airports.
The Lotus style is about as wild as you can tolerate maybe; would a 50 year old woman buy one? My 23 year old daughter might.
That door though takes space to get out of the car, this design we started on is a great solution, though harder to manufacture.
I tend to disagree regarding the Smarts there's hundreds of them round here in fact I'd say more than there are Minis.What we are doing though is a niche market machine and it's never going to sell in the masses as you're quite right a 50 year old woman wants a BMW Mini or a Honda Jazz or perhaps a Citroen Picasso.
However most folk who own a Mescherschmitt these days are generally 50+ years old and that's not even got a door!
I'm inclined to say that the Kevin Costner approach is the right one and it's what we're doing.... "Build it and they will come"
No in all seriousness our first machine is very much aimed at the young market but do not worry we've got the older market in the pipeline too. Nice machine Hillclimber, rather Carver/Clever like. Did you sell any ?
I can see Italo's really gotten into this he's finding pretty much all the one's I've had bookmarked for several years. There's still more though and one or two superb ones too. Keep them comming
I'm tempted to pop some pics up of some we were selling too but it would be nice to see you guys minds in action and see what you come up with and how close/far appart we are.
I'm tempted to pop some pics up of some we were selling too but it would be nice to see you guys minds in action and see what you come up with and how close/far appart we are.
I have a Street Rod background way back and now race cars but the custom building is all the same. Custom design to create something special.
The project is a niche market and that is far better than being in the mainstream (like the Smart).
Just what is the market 'wish list' do we think for such a single seater to be?
Small (parking etc)
Easy to drive (auto/comfortable)
Light (performance/ecomomy)
Cheap ( to build and run and to live with)
FUN (has to be)
Practical (? realy? bit of space for some light shopping, brief case, soft hold-all etc)
Do these things make it desirable, got to have one, should buy one?
The design overall and in detail has to exooooood these things, it has to be Cool as my daughter would say...
The original sketch caught my eye and still does, but It needs work to be practical to make (a profit)and sell.
Very interesting chat.I'm still with the petrol engine until someone can show me a similarly convienient alternative at the right cost/package.
I think I will extend my skething to the more engineeering side and cloth it in the great original shape.
Graham.
The project is a niche market and that is far better than being in the mainstream (like the Smart).
Just what is the market 'wish list' do we think for such a single seater to be?
Small (parking etc)
Easy to drive (auto/comfortable)
Light (performance/ecomomy)
Cheap ( to build and run and to live with)
FUN (has to be)
Practical (? realy? bit of space for some light shopping, brief case, soft hold-all etc)
Do these things make it desirable, got to have one, should buy one?
The design overall and in detail has to exooooood these things, it has to be Cool as my daughter would say...
The original sketch caught my eye and still does, but It needs work to be practical to make (a profit)and sell.
Very interesting chat.I'm still with the petrol engine until someone can show me a similarly convienient alternative at the right cost/package.
I think I will extend my skething to the more engineeering side and cloth it in the great original shape.
Graham.
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
We talked about various kitcar designs, electric 3 wheelers and other design concepts......
Italo
We talked about various kitcar designs, electric 3 wheelers and other design concepts......
Italo
Ahh-Ha!
Now we are cooking on gas!
That is much much closer to the ideal?
Easy refuel of the carbon engine, and all in one package mass produced.(cheap and well engineered/reliable)
Can it hit 50 mph so it is good to commute in with the trike package?
I think that will get over the reverse too by reversing the electric motor direction I wonder? Fab if that is the case.
That only leaves the glass panels to sort economically.
Now we are cooking on gas!
That is much much closer to the ideal?
Easy refuel of the carbon engine, and all in one package mass produced.(cheap and well engineered/reliable)
Can it hit 50 mph so it is good to commute in with the trike package?
I think that will get over the reverse too by reversing the electric motor direction I wonder? Fab if that is the case.
That only leaves the glass panels to sort economically.
911hillclimber said:
Ahh-Ha!
Can it hit 50 mph so it is good to commute in with the trike package?
50mph is okay if you're just using it to do a few miles to work, which I guess is where most of the market would lie. Can it hit 50 mph so it is good to commute in with the trike package?
However if you wanted to use it to cover 50 miles each way with a combination of motorway, A-roads and city streets (as my commute does) then it's going to need to be able to hit 70mph to avoid being squashed by trucks!
Footprintwise (is that a word?) how wide would it be? I work in a city centre so car parking at work is at a premium. We seem to have plenty of space for bikes and scooters but something like this wouldn't be welcomed if it took up the width of a couple of Hyabusas.
By the way Graham - did you used to own a Model-Y?
Yes, I built a chopped Y Ford with a variety of engines back in the early 70's, beige with brown wings first, then light ivory all over in the last years. A Model A Ford (chopped in steel) after!
I spent about 15 years with a Street Rod until I entered the Dark Side and bought a knackered 911...and took up hillclimbing.
I go back to the spec sheet for such a vehicle and the speed/accelleration aspect is critical to a general feeling of safety for Joe Average.
I think it needs to be 'nippy' about town, 0 to 60? About 12 secs will do the job I think. If it is a sluggard people will feel intimidated in today's rush to get everywhere.
I still get bothered when I see tall narrow vehicles, and think of the famous Elk Test that nearly did for the Merc A class and the Smart. Stable swerving is not to be taken lightly.
I spent about 15 years with a Street Rod until I entered the Dark Side and bought a knackered 911...and took up hillclimbing.
I go back to the spec sheet for such a vehicle and the speed/accelleration aspect is critical to a general feeling of safety for Joe Average.
I think it needs to be 'nippy' about town, 0 to 60? About 12 secs will do the job I think. If it is a sluggard people will feel intimidated in today's rush to get everywhere.
I still get bothered when I see tall narrow vehicles, and think of the famous Elk Test that nearly did for the Merc A class and the Smart. Stable swerving is not to be taken lightly.
911hillclimber said:
I have a Street Rod background way back and now race cars but the custom building is all the same. Custom design to create something special.
The project is a niche market and that is far better than being in the mainstream (like the Smart).
Just what is the market 'wish list' do we think for such a single seater to be?
Small (parking etc)
Easy to drive (auto/comfortable)
Light (performance/ecomomy)
Cheap ( to build and run and to live with)
FUN (has to be)
Practical (? realy? bit of space for some light shopping, brief case, soft hold-all etc)
Do these things make it desirable, got to have one, should buy one?
The design overall and in detail has to exooooood these things, it has to be Cool as my daughter would say...
The original sketch caught my eye and still does, but It needs work to be practical to make (a profit)and sell.
Very interesting chat.I'm still with the petrol engine until someone can show me a similarly convienient alternative at the right cost/package.
I think I will extend my skething to the more engineeering side and cloth it in the great original shape.
Graham.
I think it has to be able to carry two people (or at least have the capacity to, like scooters) and be able to carry at least two shopping bags worth of luggage (or room for two full-face crash helmets, as a guide). Performance equivalent to a Ford Ka would be adequate. The design IMHO shouldn't be too "zany", but also shouldn't look like it was designed to be a vehicle for disabled persons.The project is a niche market and that is far better than being in the mainstream (like the Smart).
Just what is the market 'wish list' do we think for such a single seater to be?
Small (parking etc)
Easy to drive (auto/comfortable)
Light (performance/ecomomy)
Cheap ( to build and run and to live with)
FUN (has to be)
Practical (? realy? bit of space for some light shopping, brief case, soft hold-all etc)
Do these things make it desirable, got to have one, should buy one?
The design overall and in detail has to exooooood these things, it has to be Cool as my daughter would say...
The original sketch caught my eye and still does, but It needs work to be practical to make (a profit)and sell.
Very interesting chat.I'm still with the petrol engine until someone can show me a similarly convienient alternative at the right cost/package.
I think I will extend my skething to the more engineeering side and cloth it in the great original shape.
Graham.
The footprint shouldn't be much more than half a BMW Mini. I have a Grinnall Scorpion and to start with, the wheels being so much wider than the body caused a few near-misses with road centre refuge islands, (in fact the previous owners had hit one as the offside wheel has a dent in it!). It would help drivers if the wheels were inside the body shape for this reason. Doing that also gives body room for luggage/storage. It would help customer confidence IMHO if there was a visible safety cage/roll bar. The body should be fully enclosed with glass/rigid plastic windows, no roll-up or flexible windows or panels.
I think it should be offered (or be able to be offered) with petrol or hybrid power units, or to be able to have them switched reasonably easily if required. It should come with an alarm/immobiliser and door locks. It would be more user friendly if it had steering wheel rather than handlebar control.
Just a few thoughts.
maggit
I just think that it has to be a very lowcost 3wheeler with a roof..........all the extras would make it un-competitive with any new or used citycar.
I believe that something similar could fly, if the base price was a little more than your classic scooter, but had a basic closed body, anything else, in my opinion wouldn't make sense, because as most have said here, or in other posts, who would buy it if it was going to be too expensive an close to a real car, Smart or other ?
Their is a niche, and my research shows that their is, but not for a product that had a price of 4500-5500 Pounds!, but less...........heck I woldn't buy it myself at those prices, even if I had designed it....
It has to be basic as the Moonbeam with just a styling makeover, no more no less, with no extra's because it's only supposed to replace your scooter and not your citycar.....no aircon, no anything......
A bese price of 3000 to a max of 4000 Pounds, and I would buy the thing, more than that and you can keep it!!, I'm sorry to burts the bubble, but this has to be a basic means of transportation, not a luxury one........for that you would have better options.
Call the concept a restyled Moonbeam !
Just my idea offcourse.......
I believe that something similar could fly, if the base price was a little more than your classic scooter, but had a basic closed body, anything else, in my opinion wouldn't make sense, because as most have said here, or in other posts, who would buy it if it was going to be too expensive an close to a real car, Smart or other ?
Their is a niche, and my research shows that their is, but not for a product that had a price of 4500-5500 Pounds!, but less...........heck I woldn't buy it myself at those prices, even if I had designed it....
It has to be basic as the Moonbeam with just a styling makeover, no more no less, with no extra's because it's only supposed to replace your scooter and not your citycar.....no aircon, no anything......
A bese price of 3000 to a max of 4000 Pounds, and I would buy the thing, more than that and you can keep it!!, I'm sorry to burts the bubble, but this has to be a basic means of transportation, not a luxury one........for that you would have better options.
Call the concept a restyled Moonbeam !
Just my idea offcourse.......
Edited by fuoriserie on Thursday 12th February 10:07
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