Hawk Stratos prices

[Sam_68]

jason61c said:

Or waiting to see how the lister bell cars work out....

It has to be said that rarity seems to be holding up the second-hand prices of these cars.

Notwithstanding the scarcity of some of the 'original' components you have to track down if you're after authenticty, it seems odd that a shabby one could be considered worthy of commanding (for example)three times the price of a well-built GTM Libra.

The same problem is currently afflicting the Westfield Eleven and seems likely to prevent my owning one in the near future.... lovely as they are to drive, I couldn't bring myself to part with nearly £20K for what, ultimately, is nothing more than a second-hand Midget-based live-axle 'Seven'.

[jason61c]

Sam_68 said:

It has to be said that rarity seems to be holding up the second-hand prices of these cars.

Notwithstanding the scarcity of some of the 'original' components you have to track down if you're after authenticty, it seems odd that a shabby one could be considered worthy of commanding (for example)three times the price of a well-built GTM Libra.

The same problem is currently afflicting the Westfield Eleven and seems likely to prevent my owning one in the near future.... lovely as they are to drive, I couldn't bring myself to part with nearly £20K for what, ultimately, is nothing more than a second-hand Midget-based live-axle 'Seven'.

The Eleven's do seem to be on the steep side for what you get. I'm sure they'll plummet in the next few years before the market sorts out an accurate value for them.

Does anyone know if any Lister Bell kits have been sold yet?

[Harpo]

Hi guys, thanks for the views on the car!

Sam, I can confirm that it is the car that you know. Looks like you are in the same business as D. R?
May I ask you if you read the advert at all? You have a lot to say about it!
Since we don't know each other I certainly don't take any of your postings personally, but you seem very 'anti' the car for some reason I'm not privy to. Feel free to explain!

''The car certainly doesn't owe its owner the asking price'' and you know this how?
You seem to think I'm after a 6k profit on the car. Not so.

You mentioned ''enough wear and tear to shag the interior (via 10 owners in a mere 20,000 miles, if the ad is to be believed?)''.
Well, I believe that this includes the total number of owners include the Lancia Beta Coupe that the number plate came from(1974)! Now that interior will be well and truly beyond!
Seats aren't replica, but original and have been trimmed by an Italian company that does work for Ferrari. They really are stunning.
The steering wheel fitted is now an original. Not easy to find I can tell you, nor cheap.

''develop other significant faults'' What faults mate? You seem keen on bold statements.
''A spare of unknown condition''. True, but the car doesn't have to be sold with the spare engine/box so the condition of those needn't be considered.

I have spent money improving the car on what I bought. I would be pleased on getting that money back. If my additions have priced the car beyond what the market deems acceptable then I will accept that and realise that no one else appreciates it in the same way that I do. The car is paid for so I'm happy to leave it where it is.
Second gear sync isn't worth the trouble in stripping the box considering the use I get from it ...... it really isn't an issue for me and shouldn't be for the next owner.
I have mentioned items to be honest with any potential buyer.


The body work is fine for me. the car looks great washed and polished. I don't enter car shows with it.
If I could get the car into my living room looking at it everyday then maybe a few things would bug me. Since I only see it a few times a week I'm still like a kid on Xmas day when the garage door opens!
I certainly wouldn't plan on doing any body work for the for seeable future.
The carpets do need doing, granted. This is the only item that I will attend to if it doesn't sell. Other than that, it needs nothing (for me).
25 is the starting price. eBay is a good medium for getting it out to the market.
Everyone expects to knock the asking price down (new or second hand) so all I have done is to allow slightly for that.

Chris J, thanks for listing the present prices. I was looking at building one about 10 years ago and it's interesting to see the changes over the years. I have my original costing's somewhere ......
You mentioned ''I reckon the price this red car was 4 years ago was a bit on the cheap side and the price it is now is more realistic?'' Agreed, but obviously others don't see it that way.
Wasn't that they time when folk were getting rid of the Astons, Porsches, etc? At the time I could've reached the asking price of a nice Vantage. Once the economy recovered up went the prices again beyond my reach.
This is turning into War and Peace so I'd better get going!

[Sam_68]

Harpo said:

May I ask you if you read the advert at all?

Yes

Harpo said:

'The car certainly doesn't owe its owner the asking price'

I recall (I think) the asking price before, and since the car was for sale for some time, I sincerely hope you didn't pay the full amount without haggling.

Of course I accept that you may have spent many thousands of pounds upgrading it, but I see no evidence of where that money might have been spent in your advert, apart from your mention of the interior. Perhaps it would help your sale if you detailed the expensive recent work?

Harpo said:

Well, I believe that this includes the total number of owners include the Lancia Beta Coupe that the number plate came from(1974)!

Is the car correctly registered as a Hawk Stratos? If so, I was under the impression that the number of owners should have been reset at the change of identity, but I stand to be corrected by someone with better knowledge of registration procedures. Again, perhaps it would help your sale if you both points clear in your ad. Of course if it isn't correctly registered (ie. it is still listed as a 'Lancia Beta' on the V5), you may well have a serious problem anyway, as the DVLA are clamping down on that sort of thing.

Harpo said:

''develop other significant faults'' What faults mate?

The gearbox synchro, which wasn't identified as a problem the last time the car was sold. Of course if that problem did exist when you bought the car and you simply haven't got round to fixing it in the last 4 years, you have my apologies. Perhaps an explanation along the lines of 'the gearbox was like that when I bought the car and hasn't deteriorated in 4 years, so I haven't seen the need to fix it' would help allay the fears of prospective purchasers?

Clearly the gearbox issue doesn't worry you but you must surely appreciate that it can only get worse and that an obvious fault with a major mechanical component such as the gearbox will be a cause for concern for any prospective purchaser who intends to get substantial use out of the car?

Harpo said:

I have spent money improving the car on what I bought. I would be pleased on getting that money back. If my additions have priced the car beyond what the market deems acceptable then I will accept that...

You do appreciate, I'm sure, that spending £X,000 on maintenance and improvement of a car seldom, if ever, results in an £X,000 increase in its value, but good luck with your sale!

[MKnight702]

jason61c said:

The Eleven's do seem to be on the steep side for what you get. I'm sure they'll plummet in the next few years before the market sorts out an accurate value for them.

I do hope not!

There is very limited supply of the Eleven, not as limited as it may have been, I have no 32 of the first batch of 50 that the factory said they were going to produce, but even the original 80's cars still command a strong price. I have had enquiries about mine from as far afield as Denmark and Germany but I am not interested in selling since the car is such a blast to drive (especially on a track).

[Sam_68]

MKnight702 said:

jason61c said:

The Eleven's do seem to be on the steep side for what you get. I'm sure they'll plummet in the next few years before the market sorts out an accurate value for them.

I do hope not!

....even the original 80's cars still command a strong price....

This is true. They always maintained a strong price after the end of the first production run, so my guess is that they'll continue to do so.

They're one of the nicest cars to drive I've ever encountered: not fast, but fabulously precise and well-balanced. I wish I could overcome my tightfistedness, but I suspect that as a Yorkshireman it's probably genetic!

[ChrisJ.]

Harpo said:

Chris J, thanks for listing the present prices. I was looking at building one about 10 years ago and it's interesting to see the changes over the years. I have my original costing's somewhere ......
You mentioned ''I reckon the price this red car was 4 years ago was a bit on the cheap side and the price it is now is more realistic?'' Agreed, but obviously others don't see it that way.
Wasn't that they time when folk were getting rid of the Astons, Porsches, etc? At the time I could've reached the asking price of a nice Vantage. Once the economy recovered up went the prices again beyond my reach.
This is turning into War and Peace so I'd better get going!

I'm at an advantage in that I know the reputation of the car's original builder.
Having searched, found and paid good money for some of the rarer and most authentic parts myself (including a similar 4 spoke original Ferrero Stradale steering wheel), I can appreciate the worth of the sum of your car's parts. Ok, so it's a good age now for a finished Hawk kit?, but any issues this car has at the moment are fairly insignificant, compared to what anyone contemplating building a Hawk kit from scratch has to overcome.

[ChrisJ.]

HF3000 on PH:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2662466.htm

[ChrisJ.]

ChrisJ. said:

HF3000 on PH:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2662466.htm

No longer available.

[ChrisJ.]

£10k less than price of new:
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2840797.htm

[ChrisJ.]

Allora on ebay:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LANCIA-STRATOS-ALAURA-RE...

Missing panels will be around £2,500.

Winning bid was £2065

Edited by ChrisJ. on Wednesday 20th June 12:30

[Blib]

One of if not THE original Alloras. I know the car the owner and his selling agent ( as the owner lives abroad) well. Could be turned into an excellent car .

[ChrisJ.]

Blib said:

Could be turned into an excellent car .

Yep, here's an old Allora make-over:
http://www.stratossupersite.com/forum/showthread.p...

[ChrisJ.]

An Allora Stratos:
One of only 10 known cars, so a bit of a collector's piece.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LANCIA-STRATOS-REPLICA-/...

Strarting bid £6,500

Now sold...

Edited by ChrisJ. on Saturday 14th April 20:43

Edited by ChrisJ. on Wednesday 20th June 12:31

[ChrisJ.]

Another Hawk Stratos for sale on PH.

£20,000

http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/3991867.htm

[Furyblade_Lee]

That is absolutely lovely.

[p1doc]

so tempted ......
martin

[p1doc]

and having accountant meeting to divvy up profits............
how much would it cost to build a basic hawk with plans to add alfa v6 later??-come on piston headers justify this to me!!
martin

[Blib]

p1doc said:

and having accountant meeting to divvy up profits............
how much would it cost to build a basic hawk with plans to add alfa v6 later??-come on piston headers justify this to me!!
martin

I shall not go into cost as I've not actually built one myself. However, what you will undoubtedly need is is some skill, time and dedication. These cars are far from 'bolt on body' jobs. However, if you have the requisite skills and you want to build one of these terrific vehicles, then head over to the Strato's Enthusiasts' forum and join the Club.

http://stratosec.com/Forum/forum.php

Here you'll find a really friendly and helpful bunch of people and everything you need to enable you to build a car.

[jason61c]

Has anyone built one of the Lister Bell cars yet? I've not seen a 'whole' one. They look very nicely produced.