Three Wheelers - Your opinions and expertise wanted!

[fuoriserie]

Stuart Mills said:

Wayhay!!!!!!!! Many thanks for stepping forward Italo.
Now then, that is an offer I cannot refuse.
2 front wheels.
1 rear.
1 seat as low as possible.
1 m front track width (tyre cetres).
2 m long, wheel base around 1.5 m
Canopy roof, hinged at the base of the screen.
Screen from a BMW scooter (sorry, I know this is limiting but is available)
Narrow wheels from a yam 125 bike.
Room around the front wheels for tilting up to 30 degrees.
Only one headlight required for MSVA on vehicles under 1300mm wide.
If 2 headlights are fitted min gap is 400mm and 400mm from edge of vehicle.
The above rule applies to trikes (not motor cycle type trikes) under 1300mm
Aerodynamic style.
Contemparary steamline, low, design.
Well you did offer!
WOW, I can't wait until next year already!

Edited by Stuart Mills on Saturday 31st December 13:07

Edited by Stuart Mills on Saturday 31st December 13:17

Very interesting Design Brief but doable...I'm guessing this would be a closed or open single seater ? tandem 2 seater ? height of the vehicle ?

[KDIcarmad]

Rodeo said:

Hi All,Cant see an introduction area so thought I would dive straight in!Im new to the forum,but not to modded cars and the like ,been building stuff for 40 odd years.Just scratch built a 2 rear wheel trike and MSVA'd it,now looking to plan a 2 front wheel 2 seater trike,but am stuck for cash.Have read this thread with great interest. Crazy I know but I really like the Velorex !not the blue one,but the brown fabric covered ones,as shown a few pages back. Always fancied a vintage type vehicle,not after speed,just plodding about really,so am thinking about doing one of those for fun,as it will be a lot cheaper,as I have most of the parts laying around here.My main stumbling point is the front suspension arrangement.Anyone know if there is anything other than the double wishbone set up that would work and maybe look in keeping with the style? A macpherson strut would be too bulky .

Edited by Rodeo on Sunday 1st January 16:03

Well welcome to the fun! I hope you enjoy read all our ideas comment and other silly stuff.

Could you please tell us more about your trikes and you velorex idea. I did see a velorex for sale, in a classic car magazine just before Xmas for £2,600.

I wish you well and hope you post a lot.

Out of interest what do you think of the Vigillante/Trivette I post about a few pages back. As a trike builder and owner, I value you opinions on these.

Edited by KDIcarmad on Monday 2nd January 20:24

[Martin A]

The problem with the Trivette is not one of insufficient weight on the nose for the steering. The problem is likely to be with the centre of aerodynamic pressure being ahead of the centre of gravity. When this is the case any side wind will tend to turn the vehicle to a more broadside attitude, so increasing the side profile attitude of the vehicle even more. This will then cause the problem to escalate. Also as the location of the centre of pressure can vary with the speed of the vehicle it may make the handling unpredictable which is a lot scarier than just being bad.

The low powered original was affected by crosswinds according to one of the magazine articles from the 70's. Add an extra 100 mph and it would take a braver man than I to give it the beans. I imagine the similarly styled Le Mans racer has been computer simulated and thoroughly wind tunnel tested making it a very different animal. Think wasp and hover-fly.

Hope this helps

[Stuart Mills]

fuoriserie said:

Very interesting Design Brief but doable...I'm guessing this would be a closed or open single seater ? tandem 2 seater ? height of the vehicle ?

I feel it should be closed canopy hingeing at the base of the screen, one seat, driver sat on the power pack, motor at the front driving a diff to the 2 front wheels. Simple swing arm rear and no belt or chain noise, approx height shown on drawing, MEV logo's are about 1:100 scale for wheels. Very much looking forward to seeing your interpretation. Regards Stuart Mills

[fuoriserie]

Stuart Mills said:

I feel it should be closed canopy hingeing at the base of the screen, one seat, driver sat on the power pack, motor at the front driving a diff to the 2 front wheels. Simple swing arm rear and no belt or chain noise, approx height shown on drawing, MEV logo's are about 1:100 scale for wheels. Very much looking forward to seeing your interpretation. Regards Stuart Mills

I replied on the tilting post, but thanks for the info, will now start working on a few ideas..

Will show something soon on the tilting post as it it's fitting for your new 3wheeler design.

[Rodeo]

KDIcarmad said:

Well welcome to the fun! I hope you enjoy read all our ideas comment and other silly stuff.

Could you please tell us more about your trikes and you velorex idea. I did see a velorex for sale, in a classic car magazine just before Xmas for £2,600.

I wish you well and hope you post a lot.

Out of interest what do you think of the Vigillante/Trivette I post about a few pages back. As a trike builder and owner, I value you opinions on these.

I googled these.I like the futuristic shape,Im no designer,and tend to build stuff from rough sketches,but would be worried about the cornering abilities with the powerful engines!

Edited by KDIcarmad on Monday 2nd January 20:24

[KDIcarmad]

This is a design by Mazda for a fantasy electric race car. It certainly looks dramatic and of course will never be build. Looking at this I can not see how you would stear it, the front wheels look like they are fixed in place with areodynamic pieces behind them appearing to block any movemont. Any ideas?

A friend wonder if it turns by slowing/breaking one of the front wheels and slikking to the left or right. I do not see this working. As it would put a lot strain on the side of the tyres, possible pulling them of the rims. Any better ideas?

[VxDuncan]

Given it's a concept, they might be implying that the "tyres" (front or rear) not only rotate as a whole around the axle (ie conventional movement), but if they were split into segments that could rotate at 90 deg to the wheel axis then lateral movement could be achieved. This technique is sometimes used in robotics to allow sideways movment in a confined space.

[KDIcarmad]

The above picture are of the Scootacar MK2. Look at the cabin seating. Very Mclaren F1. It is even mid engine, as it small 250cc 2stoke is under that rear bench. There is a company Andy's Modern Microcars that offer bodyshell and fully build replica of the MK1 powered the Suzuki Burgman (400 or 650cc). At £2490 or £16800. The MK2 is a totally different car.

I do like the ideas behind the MK2. Add in a 650 Burgman and you have micro supercar. Thinking about this, a Mk4 (there was a MK3)a little wide than the 4ft4" to improve handling and a bit longer (7ft11" MK2). Large wheels with modern suspension and sound proofing. Lots of sound proofing. I would want a radio and to hear it, a heater and seat-belt for all three seats are also a must. Sounds fun!

Anyone out there agree?

[Stuart Mills]

I am not sure how the styling fits in today. There are some interesting pictures here including a white Bambi that still looks modern;
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.n...

[KDIcarmad]

Stuart Mills said:

I am not sure how the styling fits in today. There are some interesting pictures here including a white Bambi that still looks modern;
http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=http://www.n...

I agree that the styling is very late 50's/60's. The MK2 looks only a little like the MK1 so the update could be radically different. Just using the idea of the seating and "size" with just a hint of the original cars. I am trying to draw my ideas for this, I cannot draw very well but have a good idea as to how I would see this update. Will post it if and when I get it right.

As for the Bambi I have sat in one, I think these are very 80's. Also very cramped.

[Stuart Mills]

Hope this helps with inspiration

[Stuart Mills]

and this

[Stuart Mills]

and this, sorry it has 4 wheels.

[Iwantoneofthose]

Stuart Mills said:

and this, sorry it has 4 wheels.

Nice!
What would it take to make this road legal, other than mud guards & lights?

[fuoriserie]

Iwantoneofthose said:

Nice!
What would it take to make this road legal, other than mud guards & lights?

More info:

http://www.fh-joanneum.at/aw/home/Studienangebot_U...

[jacjac]

Wow what a brilliant thread! it's taken me two days to catch up.
I have long hankered after a rear drive trike. Hi Stuart (we had a brief chat at the Motorsport show a couple of weeks ago).I also had a chat with Paul on the MEV stand, I had a good look at and sit in MEV's Tr1ke which I was really impressed with.
Like us all, I have my own ideas on my ideal vehicle; I would like the power to come from bike engine. As a keen biker who has always had V-twins this would be an obvious choice for me - I have a Suzuki V-Strom 650 which is a peach of an engine. Paul made a very good case for the R1 engine based on cost/power/weight availability/reliability etc.
I want to be able to cruise at 70/80 mph without a helmet. But also like to go topless in the summer - so a removable roof panel and probably removable side panels. I also want a cage in case I put it on the roof!
It also has to look fantastic. Stuart if you are looking for a guinea pig customer for your tilting trike - as long as it looks like the orange Pug - I could be your man!
I have attached the front end shot of an Aussi track based car (not trike) but I just love the styling. It's called a Spartan V.

[KDIcarmad]

I'm posting this for a friend of mine, I think Its crazy.

He is planing to use this as a starting point for road going Trike design.





This is a sidcar called BEO. He plans to use this as a performance road vehicle. I feel this is both a bad idea and a waist of money. Handling could I think be unsafe for a road vehicle. By the way I don't think these show the same car, the front wheel's on different sides.

I hope a few of you can comment on this.

Update 8/2/12

I have spoke with a motorbike nut and learnt that the BEO was build by Rolf Biland and won a championship in 1978. Rule changes ended it's use in racing, it may have later been used to test parts for the next generation. Having now learn more about this vehicle, I understand the passenger need only sit in the car and it drove more like a car than a motorcycle sidcar. Now knowing this I am wondering about this as a road cars.

Edited by KDIcarmad on Wednesday 8th February 12:03

[slomax]

Edit: wrong thread.

Stupid iPod

Edited by slomax on Thursday 16th February 00:37

[seansverige]

Stuart Mills said:

Wayhay!!!!!!!! Many thanks for stepping forward Italo.
Now then, that is an offer I cannot refuse.
2 front wheels.
1 rear.
1 seat as low as possible.
1 m front track width (tyre cetres).
2 m long, wheel base around 1.5 m
Canopy roof, hinged at the base of the screen.
Screen from a BMW scooter (sorry, I know this is limiting but is available)
Narrow wheels from a yam 125 bike.
Room around the front wheels for tilting up to 30 degrees.
Only one headlight required for MSVA on vehicles under 1300mm wide.
If 2 headlights are fitted min gap is 400mm and 400mm from edge of vehicle.
The above rule applies to trikes (not motor cycle type trikes) under 1300mm
Aerodynamic style.
Contemparary steamline, low, design.

Hi Stuart, can't resist being nosey, few questions:
So it's a tilting trike for commuter / urban use?
Is it the BMW C1's screen (& presumably wiper) you're referring to?
How wide is the battery pack and will it need any cooling (just in case: might be welcome on a cold day, but those packs can get pretty hot...)

Interested to see how it develops.