Thinking of buying a Vixen or 2500M

Thinking of buying a Vixen or 2500M

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Gurmot

Original Poster:

32 posts

110 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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Can anyone provide some guidance please.

I have no experience of TVR but I'm seriously drawn towards the Vixen based on looks alone. I'm looking for a car for weekend road use, something my wife could drive (and she is 5'2").

I'm looking to spend up to £12k and can look after most running repairs and servicing myself.

I know Taimars are cheaper but they don't look as nice as the earlier chrome bumper models.

Any advice or shared experience including notes on real world differences between models would be very welcome.

Cheers

Simon

tomtrout

595 posts

162 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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Good choice! If it is essential for your wife to drive then I would strongly recommend that you go and see one first before committing to the long wait for an affordable one to pop up. See if she can reach the pedals! Seriously, getting close enough to the steering wheel won't be a be problem but the pedals might be if you are quite short. Without being heightist here, I think there is one Vixen owner who has fitted blocks onto his pedals so could be an issue if you both want to drive. I'm sure if you tell us where you are based then somebody will offer you a chance to have a sit in one at least.

octanetorque

144 posts

136 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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Welcome to the forum

As mentioned, pedal placement will be a problem for a petite person.

Blocks might be the solution, or, other forum members will know the possibilities, of other types of pedal boxes that might be adjustable.

Go see this car see what its all about.

The first one I saw was this one in 2011 and that didn't put me off!...But it took me 3 years to find the one I wanted.

There was a great Octane buyers guide out there - that seems to have been removed, sadly.

Gurmot

Original Poster:

32 posts

110 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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Thanks for the replies so far. This is exactly the sort of insight I was hoping for.

I didn't consider the pedal reach, I was more concerned at the weight of the steering as she is used to power assisted modern things (won't drive my series 2a Landrover).

I had noted the Orange Vixen in Lancashire but I'm way down in Somerset. Also, it seemed a bit pricey considering the condition, or am I wrong here?


Moto

1,230 posts

252 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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Hi Simon. Welcome to the forum.

I agree with you, the Vixen is prettier but it's all personal taste. It is however quite different to use as an everyday car compared to a Taimar. In my opinion the Vixen is more fun as a driver's car because it is lighter and more balanced. However driving at high speed down motorways etc can become tiresome as with no 5th gear and smallish engine the revs are high and engine noise is high. Also you feel all the bumps in the road. The Taimar is much more civilised but not so much fun. The opening rear hatch is a nice to have if using a lot.

Have a look at the silver Vixen with the Alfa engine. It looks to be a nice usable example with a 5th gear bonus. Although non-std engine may put off the marque enthusiast. http://www.carandclassic.co.uk/car/C567693


Good luck...

Gurmot

Original Poster:

32 posts

110 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
quotequote all
Thanks for that Steve. That silver Vixen looks nice, I would a little nervous at how the non standard engine has been been fitted and if anything major has been cut or modded to get it in.

As far as the lack of fifth gear is concerned, I'm used to driving a bog standard 2.25 petrol Landy so im sure the standard Vixen set up will be ok. It's intended to be a weekend car so practicality is not a big issue.

I tend to be a bit impatient in these circumstances and am trying to slow down and take my time. .........

Edited by Gurmot on Saturday 31st January 15:55

Moto

1,230 posts

252 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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Sounds like the Vixen is the right choice for you. The Alfa engine and it's fitting is a sound concern. For what it's worth, if it were me then I would drive it to see whether if felt right and drove well. If it did then the Alfa engine itself wouldn't be a problem for me personally. I'd also check to see if the chassis had been modified or just mountings. If not then could a Crossflow be put in easily, if desired? Maybe it's a negotiation point!

If you go for a Vixen, it's often a long haul. And you'll certainly never find exactly what you want, so it's always going to be a compromise with a plan to get it as you want it. It took me a year to find one and I was very flexible, primarily wanting a car that was MOT'd with a solid chassis. My plan was always to drive it as much as I could with a winter project each year to gradually improve the car.

I think there was a post on this forum from the seller in the last month or two putting some explanation around the Alfa car and sale. IIRC it seemed fairly credible but as with any car buying process, always check everything out yourself.

Edited by Moto on Saturday 31st January 13:04

tomtrout

595 posts

162 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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Good advice from Steve. If the Alfa one isn't for you (to me it looks like a very nice car) and you are looking for a standard car then think long and hard about whether or not you want the triumph 6 pot or the lighter 4 cylinder crossflow. The chances are that a fair % of Vixens that will pop onto the market will have something other than the original Triumph 6 or crossflow engine and box. It's a discussion that comes up on here quite often!In many cases I doubt if it would be a massive job to convert back to original if desired.

Good luck.

vixen1700

22,669 posts

269 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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Gurmot said:
I had noted the Orange Vixen in Lancashire but I'm way down in Somerset.
Good choice, you'll love a Vixen.

Bought mine from Barrie Carter down near Crewkerne back in 1998, he took my wife and I out in round the country roads and we were sold instantly. Quite a journey as we lived in London at the time. hehe

A friend from the next village along went to Belgium to buy his Vixen S2, they're worth travelling to find. smile

Dollyman1850

6,316 posts

249 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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if you are used to a Serious 11a Landy then any vixen will feel positively rolls like in terms of ride and handling.

Engine choice should never put you off the right car. The right car is a car which has a very good chassis or a recently restored car with a new chassis. 12 - 13k will buy you a vixen but as with all you are buying an old car and there are lots of tarted up ham merited specials in this range..Vixens are on the up and a Basket case will set you back 4-5k and cost you 20k to restore properly. a 12k car will likely still set you back a few bob to get it to the condition you want it..

There are a number of cars which get punted around and then there are other cars which seldom come up for sale…

The reality is that there aren't that many of them and if you are not prepared to travel anywhere at short notice (including mainland europe) to see one you will likely have a long long wait to get the car you want.

The engine dilemma is something that worries some but in reality all manner of engines have been fitted to these cars over the years. any 4 cylinder install is generally not intrusive to the main chassis rails and all can be reversed easily. The twin cam alfa / fiat engine, Lotus twins, Pinto OHC, are all much more common period swaps than you will ever imagine..

The cars have always been enthusiast fettler cars so modifications are abound, mostly to make the cars more drivable, faster and suitable for longer runs. They are also well modified for hill climbing and sprinting.
This however is changing with the general rise in values, trouble is the new breed of purist doesn't really know what originality is..They just have their own idea of originality!

The modern choice for transplant enthusiasts is the Zetec. Again this is a mainly bolt in modification with no chassis mods being required.

My advice would be to find a car and buy it if it ticks your boxes. They are cheap as chips to work on and can be brought back to an idea of originality or modified very easily..

Chassis condition is everything..Outriggers, corner supports especially, which corrode at the top where the body sits. Beware a hammerite restored car with a heavily pock marked chassis…These may look good but may only have a limited life before needing a body off again.

Pay a premium for a re-chassid car.

Everything is available to build a new car from scratch if required.

N.

fullpull

260 posts

166 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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OP, you may find this meta search engine helpful: http://www.bob-cars.com/search.jsp?language=en&amp...driving

Gurmot

Original Poster:

32 posts

110 months

Saturday 31st January 2015
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Thank you all. Really ,really useful advice, just what I wanted!

Now some serious thinking.

Edited by Gurmot on Saturday 31st January 15:53

tomtrout

595 posts

162 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
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The cars have always been enthusiast fettler cars so modifications are abound, mostly to make the cars more drivable, faster and suitable for longer runs. They are also well modified for hill climbing and sprinting.
This however is changing with the general rise in values, trouble is the new breed of purist doesn't really know what originality is..They just have their own idea of originality!

[/quote]

Sorry to hijack the OP thread here but I'm not sure what Neil is actually saying? I absolutely agree that these cars are 'fettlers' cars and I see nothing wrong with the desire to make the cars more 'drivable, faster and suitable for longer runs' but if these modifications are taken too far then surely the essence of what the classic TVR actually is will be lost? Or am I just a stupid old fart? Ok - I'll take that!

I'm sure no one is under any illusion that replacing 45 year old plus components with modern replacements makes sense in many cases but for me many of the so called classic TVRs leave me cold because the baby has been thrown out with the bathwater!

Who are the people who constitute the 'new breed of purist' and if it's ok to install modern engines, gearboxes, fuel delivery systems and the like, then why is it a problem if people have their own idea of what constitutes originality?

We all know that each car was unique and even the ones that were supposed to be identical are often quite different but one thing bonds them all together and that is they are all very old (at least the ones that we talk about on this forum are)and most of them will drive like old cars. If I had wanted a slippery coupe that went like sh*t of a shovel and stopped on a sixpence then I would have bought a modern Lotus and not an ancient TVR.

People have every right to throw out their, noisy, thirsty, wheezy, slow crossflow engines and replace it with a nice reliable, efficient and powerful focus engine. But personally I take my hat off to those who want to keep the very essence of what these cars were like in the day. If some of the new breed of 'purist' get a few bits wrong, or even if they deliberately choose to deviate from what the so called experts know to be original, then so what?

I'll get my coat!



Missingbadly

198 posts

110 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
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Yep got mine from Belgium it was well worth the year search. Good that you are looking they come up every now and then and several have changed hands quickly recently. If you are into mechanicals then good too as dont expect anything to be perfect at your budget, these cars often need working through and getting right - everything from the gearbox back on mine has now been rebuilt. There are some good people on here whose combined knowledge will help you when you need it.

Dollyman1850

6,316 posts

249 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
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Andy.
Your vixen is a 1700 on side drafts with hot cam, wilton Carpets, Leather trimmed dash modern tyres…..etc etc etc…IE Modified! Whats your idea of modified too far? You would use a laycock perhaps but not a 5 speed ford box? Side drafts are period, Fuel injection isn't? Points and condenser but not electronic ignition? Mechanical fan but not electric. Does your car still have a dynamo or crossplys?

The point I was making is that you can't generally buy an original vixen, ALL have been modified to some extent.. Some however think they have been modified keeping the essence of a 45 year old car and thats fine….I just see it as modified. end of.… Nothing wrong with modified cars with modern engines and modified ones with old engines. You want a car that drives like an old one! I want a car that looks like an old one but drives like a new one.

I don't really understand the differences. my suspension, chassis, period wheels, steering rack etc etc etc is all as per yours..An engine purely transmits a rotational force to a back axle…Not sure how this looses the essence of what the car was / is etc. It still looks the same!…The fundamental benefit however is cheap supply, better power, reliability and upwards of 42mpg. Not sure why anyone wouldn't want these elements? No car I have ever owned has been built or bought because I want it to break down, be fuel inefficient or handle badly and be left behind by a 1.4 shopping runabout at the lights!

A vixen will generally out handle many a modern faster car and principally people shouldn't forget that its a sports car..its meant to go faster and out handle many a modern car.

The new breed of purist I am talking about isn't the person who has spent 4 years restoring a car. He is the type who buys the car for a couple of years, has it worked on by others, talks it up as original without actually knowing what original is and then sells it on for a profit moving onto his next playtoy..there are more of these people about…I am still unsure whether its a good thing or bad thing. What I do know is that I can't afford an OLD TVR to restore anymore and your car is as original as any fully re-built car can be! smile

Anyhow.
I think if the OP is serious he should keep a very close eye on ebay over the next few days since a very nice Blue 2500 Vixen shaped car is coming on the market for a price not a million miles from his budget.

To summarise and get the post back on topic.….LOOK AT THE CHASSIS CAREFULLY ON ANY PROSPECTIVE PURCHASE

N. smile

Edited by Dollyman1850 on Sunday 1st February 16:22

tomtrout

595 posts

162 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
quotequote all
Good advice re the chassis inspection.

Just for the record, I never claimed my car wasn't modified. Yes it has a modified crossflow engine with twin 40s (came with the car) and luminition ignition and modern rubber. Actually the biggest factor in restoring my car was economics. Which is why I haven't got any leather trim, or Wilton carpet - don't know where you got that from! In fact all of the interior was very amateurishly trimmed by me to save money and ensure I had enough in my budget to actually get it on the road. I'm not complaining, I got a buzz out of doing it but to be honest, if I could have afforded to send the car to a trimmer then I would have done. I would also never suggest that folks shouldn't improve their cars to make them safer - its a perfectly sensible thing to do.

I'm not actually criticizing your choices Neil. You are undoubtedly very knowledgeable about these olds cars and I for one have benefited from your knowledge, which you share on this forum for the benefit of all. The point I was trying to make is that if we all went down the same route then we would lose something very special about the essence of what these old cars are about. I know you won't agree and I don't expect you to but why worry about the so called new breed of purist buying nice cars and trying to make them nicer?

We should be a broad church for classic TVR and people shouldn't feel intimidated in coming on here and having their say, even if they know SFA about classic TVR. I have spoken to people who won't post here because they are scared of being ridiculed for their lack of knowledge! Now that's a shame in my book. Every post is a personal opinion and of course we want healthy debate and disagreeing is part of that process.

Apologies again the OP - enough said by me about new breed of purists! I sincerely hope you secure your Vixen and I'm sure you will get lots of help from the folks on here. If it needs some work then build it how you want it. smile

Missingbadly

198 posts

110 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
quotequote all
Let's hope the OP finds what he wants, whatever type it is, and just enjoys it! To a point it doesn't matter what the carb is or if the carpet is AstroTurf (my rear one was) as long as it's a viable starting point for him.

Dollyman1850

6,316 posts

249 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
quotequote all
tomtrout said:
Good advice re the chassis inspection.

Just for the record, I never claimed my car wasn't modified. Yes it has a modified crossflow engine with twin 40s (came with the car) and luminition ignition and modern rubber. Actually the biggest factor in restoring my car was economics. Which is why I haven't got any leather trim, or Wilton carpet - don't know where you got that from! In fact all of the interior was very amateurishly trimmed by me to save money and ensure I had enough in my budget to actually get it on the road. I'm not complaining, I got a buzz out of doing it but to be honest, if I could have afforded to send the car to a trimmer then I would have done. I would also never suggest that folks shouldn't improve their cars to make them safer - its a perfectly sensible thing to do.

I'm not actually criticizing your choices Neil. You are undoubtedly very knowledgeable about these olds cars and I for one have benefited from your knowledge, which you share on this forum for the benefit of all. The point I was trying to make is that if we all went down the same route then we would lose something very special about the essence of what these old cars are about. I know you won't agree and I don't expect you to but why worry about the so called new breed of purist buying nice cars and trying to make them nicer?

We should be a broad church for classic TVR and people shouldn't feel intimidated in coming on here and having their say, even if they know SFA about classic TVR. I have spoken to people who won't post here because they are scared of being ridiculed for their lack of knowledge! Now that's a shame in my book. Every post is a personal opinion and of course we want healthy debate and disagreeing is part of that process.

Apologies again the OP - enough said by me about new breed of purists! I sincerely hope you secure your Vixen and I'm sure you will get lots of help from the folks on here. If it needs some work then build it how you want it. smile
I don't disagree Andy and I am certainly not criticising yours. What you shouldn't forget is where the Orange car came from…IE A back yard in Bolton, without an engine or much worth saving for that matter..



The next one I am doing might be the very essence of original but without being so…None of them loose the essence of being a classic

Anyhow..

This is on e-bay. I know which one I would buy when choosing between this and the alfa engined one…

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111589041807?ru=http%3A%...

I would certainly have this one if I could afford it.

N.

tomtrout

595 posts

162 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
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Isn't that Tobsham's Viven? Suprised he's selling so soon. Certainly looks like a lovely car and kicking off at a very sensible price provided the reserve isn't too bonkers money.

Missingbadly

198 posts

110 months

Sunday 1st February 2015
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tobsam said:
Missingbadly999......

I am trying to send you a message but it appears that you do not accept messages? confused I am sure that you know why I am trying to contact you so please can you contact me.

Thanks
Don't know! I'll try settings...I think its because this profile is less than 14 days??

Edited by Missingbadly on Sunday 1st February 19:49


Edited by Missingbadly on Sunday 1st February 19:50