M Series alternative engines
Discussion
DavidY said:
Daftlad
I'm not sure the S Turbo qualifies on any of the criteria! (and its all the better for that!!!)
davidy
David,I'm not sure the S Turbo qualifies on any of the criteria! (and its all the better for that!!!)
davidy
Just read the options menu. I'm obviously sadly deluded, but you and many on here already know that.
Off topic, At Cadwell earler in the month I was kindly given a DVD of some footage from a TVRCC track day at Cadwell. There apears to be a young looking DY on that very nice, but in some ways quite sad footage.
GAjon
I must admit, I have had the odd look in the classifieds recently, I know they are going for peanuts lately, but I still keep finding other things to spend my money on (old house swallows money), and I'd want an M at least as good as the last one (when the engine worked!)
Knowing my luck I won't come back into the game until the prices start rising, and I can buy near the peak (again)
davidy
I must admit, I have had the odd look in the classifieds recently, I know they are going for peanuts lately, but I still keep finding other things to spend my money on (old house swallows money), and I'd want an M at least as good as the last one (when the engine worked!)
Knowing my luck I won't come back into the game until the prices start rising, and I can buy near the peak (again)
davidy
A 2ltr Zetec bolts in with no chassis mods?? Taking that a step further a 2.3ltr Duratec turbo and anywhere between 225 - 300 hp depending on boost. and no weight.
I am currently nailing together a 2ltr zetec vixen S2 and close ratio type 9 with full sequential injection and about 200hp. this will still give 40mpg and will give the car all the performance it needs (with my dad driving)
What bellhousing/gearbox propshaft and diff would I use to convert a 1600M?
I am currently nailing together a 2ltr zetec vixen S2 and close ratio type 9 with full sequential injection and about 200hp. this will still give 40mpg and will give the car all the performance it needs (with my dad driving)
What bellhousing/gearbox propshaft and diff would I use to convert a 1600M?
Daftlad said:
Off topic, At Cadwell earler in the month I was kindly given a DVD of some footage from a TVRCC track day at Cadwell. There apears to be a young looking DY on that very nice, but in some ways quite sad footage.
Morning John, David....A Cine8, conversion to Video to DVD makes everyone look young!Adrian@
Adrian@ said:
Daftlad said:
Off topic, At Cadwell earler in the month I was kindly given a DVD of some footage from a TVRCC track day at Cadwell. There apears to be a young looking DY on that very nice, but in some ways quite sad footage.
Morning John, David....A Cine8, conversion to Video to DVD makes everyone look young!Adrian@
John
Does the footage show my big Cadwell 'off'? One year in the pouring rain, had a bit of a moment, visited grass on both sides of the circuit and one side twice!!!! No damage done, only pride fortunately!
In the afternoon some madman in a red/black SE arched M spent most of the afternoon exiting the hairpin and going up the hill in one big lurid slide!!!!
davidy
Does the footage show my big Cadwell 'off'? One year in the pouring rain, had a bit of a moment, visited grass on both sides of the circuit and one side twice!!!! No damage done, only pride fortunately!
In the afternoon some madman in a red/black SE arched M spent most of the afternoon exiting the hairpin and going up the hill in one big lurid slide!!!!
davidy
DavidY said:
John
Does the footage show my big Cadwell 'off'? One year in the pouring rain, had a bit of a moment, visited grass on both sides of the circuit and one side twice!!!! No damage done, only pride fortunately!
In the afternoon some madman in a red/black SE arched M spent most of the afternoon exiting the hairpin and going up the hill in one big lurid slide!!!!
davidy
Sorry David, no coverage of your off. I seem to recall the old M though, some guy from Manchester way - bit of a rough sort, god knows what became of the car. Does the footage show my big Cadwell 'off'? One year in the pouring rain, had a bit of a moment, visited grass on both sides of the circuit and one side twice!!!! No damage done, only pride fortunately!
In the afternoon some madman in a red/black SE arched M spent most of the afternoon exiting the hairpin and going up the hill in one big lurid slide!!!!
davidy
I don't know if we got your 'off' on film, most of the footage is from the hairpin or from in car, do you remember what year it was? Was is the same very wet year that Duke hit the marshals post at the exit of Mansfield?
What I do have, from inside the car, is my spin out of Charlie's which, if I remember correctly, you were watching from across at the Gooseneck bank.
John
What I do have, from inside the car, is my spin out of Charlie's which, if I remember correctly, you were watching from across at the Gooseneck bank.
John
GAjon
Same year as Duke and the marshalls post, I'd forgetton about that.
I came off at the final part of the bend before the gooseneck, heading left picking up speed on that lovely wet grass, got the car back onto the circuit at a lurid angle, only braking on the tarmac bit, then slid off on the right hand side of the gooseneck entry, wrestled it back onto the circuit, again only braking on the circuit and promply slid off the other side (again). A real brown trouser moment, came in and went for a cup of tea, my passenger wasn't amused!!! but appreciated the cup of tea!
I think you were one of the few people to use 1st out of hairpin that year, you mad fool, it took me many laps to grow balls big enough to do it!!!!
davidy
Same year as Duke and the marshalls post, I'd forgetton about that.
I came off at the final part of the bend before the gooseneck, heading left picking up speed on that lovely wet grass, got the car back onto the circuit at a lurid angle, only braking on the tarmac bit, then slid off on the right hand side of the gooseneck entry, wrestled it back onto the circuit, again only braking on the circuit and promply slid off the other side (again). A real brown trouser moment, came in and went for a cup of tea, my passenger wasn't amused!!! but appreciated the cup of tea!
I think you were one of the few people to use 1st out of hairpin that year, you mad fool, it took me many laps to grow balls big enough to do it!!!!
davidy
Thinking laterally (
). Assuming you were to keep the essex V6 what could you do to modernise it for sensible money. By that I mean more power and less fuel consumption.
I was thinking:
1. Fully mapped fuel injection (on std manifold?)
2. High compression pistons
3. Gas flowed big valve heads
4. Lightened flywheel
5. Roller rockers
6. A camshaft suited to fuel injection
7. add you own...
I know it's possible to get huge power if you feed it a cheque book (Rick Wood alloy gas flowed heads, triple webers etc...) But I'm thinking about what could be done for a £grand max, with a target of increasing power/torque by say 50% and improving over all efficiency.
The reason I ask about is I have a few of them lying around
Two of unknown state, one of which is under the bonnet of a Taimar, and one of them actually runs in a Scimitar
.......
). Assuming you were to keep the essex V6 what could you do to modernise it for sensible money. By that I mean more power and less fuel consumption. I was thinking:
1. Fully mapped fuel injection (on std manifold?)
2. High compression pistons
3. Gas flowed big valve heads
4. Lightened flywheel
5. Roller rockers
6. A camshaft suited to fuel injection
7. add you own...
I know it's possible to get huge power if you feed it a cheque book (Rick Wood alloy gas flowed heads, triple webers etc...) But I'm thinking about what could be done for a £grand max, with a target of increasing power/torque by say 50% and improving over all efficiency.
The reason I ask about is I have a few of them lying around
Two of unknown state, one of which is under the bonnet of a Taimar, and one of them actually runs in a Scimitar
.......robgte
Sensibly, you cannot increase power too much before air in and exhaust out become restrictive on the standard items. You also have to think about cooling. The original TVR system is barely adequate on a hot day!
Many people go for a slight warming with just a big valve head and a slightly wilder cam and jet the 38DGAS to suit, and you can go for anything in-between right up to GAjon's type of setup (Cosworth GA block, Ric Wood heads, etc). Dry sump setups are available as well.
There are multi-injectors in a single barrel type Fuel Injection systems, but these are in effect a single point injection system and will never be as efficient as a triple type throttle body arrangement, however they are likely to give you better mpg, but why crave for better mpg, unless you are going to use the car for everyday use, and it's a light use vehicle then the savings in mpg are insignificant.
If your car has the TR6 diff you will need to upgrade the carrier for this and possibly the front plate as well as these can twist a bit with higher output engines. Also be prepared to change driveshafts and rear hubs on a more regular basis.
I would suggest to talk to some of the TVR specialists such as Adrian Venn or Steve Reid, both of whom post on here, or talk direct to some of the engine builders, John Wade, Ric Wood, etc
You may well find it's more cost effective to buy a second hand engine thats already been warmed then start one from scratch. Adrian and Steve may be able to help here.
davidy
Sensibly, you cannot increase power too much before air in and exhaust out become restrictive on the standard items. You also have to think about cooling. The original TVR system is barely adequate on a hot day!
Many people go for a slight warming with just a big valve head and a slightly wilder cam and jet the 38DGAS to suit, and you can go for anything in-between right up to GAjon's type of setup (Cosworth GA block, Ric Wood heads, etc). Dry sump setups are available as well.
There are multi-injectors in a single barrel type Fuel Injection systems, but these are in effect a single point injection system and will never be as efficient as a triple type throttle body arrangement, however they are likely to give you better mpg, but why crave for better mpg, unless you are going to use the car for everyday use, and it's a light use vehicle then the savings in mpg are insignificant.
If your car has the TR6 diff you will need to upgrade the carrier for this and possibly the front plate as well as these can twist a bit with higher output engines. Also be prepared to change driveshafts and rear hubs on a more regular basis.
I would suggest to talk to some of the TVR specialists such as Adrian Venn or Steve Reid, both of whom post on here, or talk direct to some of the engine builders, John Wade, Ric Wood, etc
You may well find it's more cost effective to buy a second hand engine thats already been warmed then start one from scratch. Adrian and Steve may be able to help here.
davidy
Alan Snowling said:
A 2ltr Zetec bolts in with no chassis mods?? Taking that a step further a 2.3ltr Duratec turbo and anywhere between 225 - 300 hp depending on boost. and no weight.
I am currently nailing together a 2ltr zetec vixen S2 and close ratio type 9 with full sequential injection and about 200hp. this will still give 40mpg and will give the car all the performance it needs (with my dad driving)
What bellhousing/gearbox propshaft and diff would I use to convert a 1600M?
Not sourced one yet Alan but pretty sure it will be an RS2000 hydraulic, unless you use a hydraulic release bearing in which case any rear 2.0ltr bellhousing will bolt up to a zetec.I am currently nailing together a 2ltr zetec vixen S2 and close ratio type 9 with full sequential injection and about 200hp. this will still give 40mpg and will give the car all the performance it needs (with my dad driving)
What bellhousing/gearbox propshaft and diff would I use to convert a 1600M?
Neil.
AmericanTVR said:
heightswitch said:
or better still a 347 stroker all alloy V8 small block ford and emulate some of the factory sanctioned 5000M's which were screwed together in the states..
Two questions here, does there exist an all alloy 347 and were 5000Ms Ford 302 powered?you can build a 347 version of a 302 in alloy form.
N.
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