Shipping a TVR as a kit car to the USA
Discussion
Exactly bugmeister! That's what I have felt and wondered. A company called Moterex imported the Skyline R to the US and crash tested like 6 cars but they got it done. Or a similer quicker route could be importing without the engine and then dropping in an American Chevy if it fits. I don't think they would need to crash test then. I'm optimistic one of these days someone will be importing them. (But they we cost 33% more!)
fish fried fred said: I thought Penske was going to get into importing TVR's...
I thought Faisal was going to import TVR's...
I thought Peter Wheeler was going to import TVR's...
What has kept these three very bright people from pulling the trigger?
risk return return profile of endeaver i.e. sharpe quotient vs. other investments.
That's why it would be done by an eccentric car lover who would find the whole deal "amusing" for reasons other than money.
That's my two cents.
faisalkhan said:
fish fried fred said: I thought Penske was going to get into importing TVR's...
I thought Faisal was going to import TVR's...
I thought Peter Wheeler was going to import TVR's...
What has kept these three very bright people from pulling the trigger?
Cost vs. benefit.
That's why in Greece they sell cars from Japan, France , Germany and Italian stuff ...
Massive production to sell to the people.
Unfortunately no Handmade cars though
Only a few ones
ByronTVR
PiB said: Exactly bugmeister! That's what I have felt and wondered. A company called Moterex imported the Skyline R to the US and crash tested like 6 cars but they got it done. Or a similer quicker route could be importing without the engine and then dropping in an American Chevy if it fits. I don't think they would need to crash test then. I'm optimistic one of these days someone will be importing them. (But they we cost 33% more!)
PiB - Im intersted in the part about importing without the engine (you may notice I started this thread!) Is this a feasible (or legal) route to go down - I would willingly drop in a small block or similar just to keep the car as intact as possible and get it over to the USA indefinately. Any comments . . . anyone?
I wish I could say I'm an expert at importing and have done it dozens of times but I can't even say I have a friend of a friend who....
If somebody really wanted to import a TVR without engine to and make it legal with a chevy I would call up a Registered Importer like Sunspeed.com. They have been making Elises road legal by putting in Honda power. Give a couple of them a call and ask them what would be involved. That's where to get started. It sounds like fellow PHer Faisal is importing Lotuses as well but I'm not sure.
Someone just needs to do it and then tell us about it! I would try to call and discuss importing a car with as many RI's as possible. Some of them may say "H*ll no we don't do that kind of work." The RI's I read about in the Federal Register do a total conversion almost always on a car that is already in American like makeing changes to a Euro Ferrari or Porsche to US specs. You would think this would easy but many many things have to be changed. But other RI's may be like Sunspeed and do the engine swap deal to get around rules. From what I understand Sunspeed is a licensed car manufacturer.
Here is the link to a list of registered importers.
www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/import/RIlist0206.html
If somebody really wanted to import a TVR without engine to and make it legal with a chevy I would call up a Registered Importer like Sunspeed.com. They have been making Elises road legal by putting in Honda power. Give a couple of them a call and ask them what would be involved. That's where to get started. It sounds like fellow PHer Faisal is importing Lotuses as well but I'm not sure.
Someone just needs to do it and then tell us about it! I would try to call and discuss importing a car with as many RI's as possible. Some of them may say "H*ll no we don't do that kind of work." The RI's I read about in the Federal Register do a total conversion almost always on a car that is already in American like makeing changes to a Euro Ferrari or Porsche to US specs. You would think this would easy but many many things have to be changed. But other RI's may be like Sunspeed and do the engine swap deal to get around rules. From what I understand Sunspeed is a licensed car manufacturer.
Here is the link to a list of registered importers.
www.nhtsa.dot.gov/cars/rules/import/RIlist0206.html
Yes, according to the rules, you can bring a car in without an engine. The problem is that many of the morons who work for Customs will still not allow it. So check at your intended port as to what they require.
Second, because it won't move under its own power, you will have to ship it in a container, which is more expensive than a roll-on roll-off ferry.
Finally, if you manage to get another engine to fit in, then you have to get it inspected for EPA and DOT regulations in your state. Some are much easier than others. But it would probably work.
I would check the engine mounts, dimensions, etc. and get lots of opinions from experienced mechanics before even attempting this, as swapping engines is not a straightforward task. Don't forget about all the sensors in the car, and make sure they can be hooked up or bypassed with the new engine. Or are you planning on a different ECU as well?
Sunspeed, according to those in the know, such as ex-partners of the current owner, is a rip-off operation. There are quite a few people out there who have given Sunspeed a lot of money for everything from Porche 959s to Jag XJ220s to Elises, and all have been ripped off, or given incomplete cars after two(!) years of trying to chase after Tom.
If you are willing to take the responsibility of getting it registered, then any competent mechanic should be able to do the conversion for you.
Give me a call at +1.650.875.7696 if you want to chat.
Rgds,
Faisal.
Second, because it won't move under its own power, you will have to ship it in a container, which is more expensive than a roll-on roll-off ferry.
Finally, if you manage to get another engine to fit in, then you have to get it inspected for EPA and DOT regulations in your state. Some are much easier than others. But it would probably work.
I would check the engine mounts, dimensions, etc. and get lots of opinions from experienced mechanics before even attempting this, as swapping engines is not a straightforward task. Don't forget about all the sensors in the car, and make sure they can be hooked up or bypassed with the new engine. Or are you planning on a different ECU as well?
Sunspeed, according to those in the know, such as ex-partners of the current owner, is a rip-off operation. There are quite a few people out there who have given Sunspeed a lot of money for everything from Porche 959s to Jag XJ220s to Elises, and all have been ripped off, or given incomplete cars after two(!) years of trying to chase after Tom.
If you are willing to take the responsibility of getting it registered, then any competent mechanic should be able to do the conversion for you.
Give me a call at +1.650.875.7696 if you want to chat.
Rgds,
Faisal.
How about a Chimaera sans engine ? Then sourcing a used 4.6 Range Rover engine - I'd have thought it would fit ! And if you got one from the same state the emissions and stuff would be doable.
Chimaera's are also fairly plentifull, even in LHD.
Simon
(not at all biased ex Chimp owner in Los Angeles)
Chimaera's are also fairly plentifull, even in LHD.
Simon
(not at all biased ex Chimp owner in Los Angeles)
Shipping it in as an "assemblage of parts" would work. I don't know how it would fare as far as safety testing is concerned. NHTSA does not allow you to rebadge a vehicle once it has been sold by the manufacturer. So you would be making some "representations" as to the identity of the vehicle you have cobbled together.
I was guessing that maybe the NHTSA wouldn't be involved if the car was imported sans engine. That the contents of the cargo wouldn't require any forms from the NHTSA. Ultima GTR buyers don't have to deal with the NHTSA at all do they? There are a whole variety of things that car doesn't comply with but the owners seem to just deal with state governments. I have also wondered how exaclty the "Numpty Mobiles" Ginetta G4's get imported legally supposably.
Well, this was the case till a few years ago. And yes, even today, importation of vehicle parts is not overseen by NHTSA, simply by customs. So it's no problem to import them, even today. But importing a disassembled car can still lead to problems unless it's disassembled enough that you can satisfy the customs people that it is indeed just parts.
As for registration, it's just state governments you have to deal with, as PiB says. With two caveats:
1) Now just about every state is savvy and updated on a daily basis by NHTSA. There's a good chance that you will be inspected by a state DOT representative (NHTSA is a part of DOT) who knows exactly what is legal and what isn't. This is not a big deal, but something to be aware of.
2) If you are ever in an accident and found to have illegally imported, constructed, or operated a vehicle that the manufacturer did not certify for use on the public roads, then you are subject to fines of millions of dollars. For most people, it means being bankrupted and having all future earnings garnished. Not a pleasant thought. The chances of this happening are remote, but they are there.
>> Edited by faisalkhan on Monday 18th November 20:56
As for registration, it's just state governments you have to deal with, as PiB says. With two caveats:
1) Now just about every state is savvy and updated on a daily basis by NHTSA. There's a good chance that you will be inspected by a state DOT representative (NHTSA is a part of DOT) who knows exactly what is legal and what isn't. This is not a big deal, but something to be aware of.
2) If you are ever in an accident and found to have illegally imported, constructed, or operated a vehicle that the manufacturer did not certify for use on the public roads, then you are subject to fines of millions of dollars. For most people, it means being bankrupted and having all future earnings garnished. Not a pleasant thought. The chances of this happening are remote, but they are there.
>> Edited by faisalkhan on Monday 18th November 20:56
Aren't the G4's considered a continuation model like the Shelby Cobra's?
I just read Pagani is going to import the Zonda into the USA. They build 30 VERY expensive cars a year and can get into the USA. TVR builds at least a 1,000 cars and can't find a way into the USA? Face it, they don't want to be here!
I just read Pagani is going to import the Zonda into the USA. They build 30 VERY expensive cars a year and can get into the USA. TVR builds at least a 1,000 cars and can't find a way into the USA? Face it, they don't want to be here!
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