Driving a minibus, B licence requirements

[AJordan]

Hello chaps,

Looking for some clarification on the above, if anyone has any experience, detail taken from the gov.uk link below,

https://www.gov.uk/driving-a-minibus

Looking at the following, I'm particularly interested in the part; "the maximum weight of the minibus is not more than 3.5 tonnes - or 4.25 tonnes including specialist equipment for disabled passengers, eg a wheelchair ramp"

Am I to take that to fulfill this criteria, a vehicle converted for disabled passengers must be under 3.5 tonnes prior to its conversion or adaptation? (ie it allows for up to 750kg of extra weight to be specifically added by any added equipment)

Cheers in advance,

[silverfoxcc]

If it helps i drive for a charity a max 16 seat minibus, it is normally fitted with 12 seats and room for two wheelchairs at the rear.It has a rear tail lift. I tnink the GWT is 4.5 tonne
I think it depends on when you passed your tes all of our drivers have had a licene from when they were in small red booklets!!! so we get grandfather rights on a lot of what may need addition test qualification now

[GoneAnon]

The maximum weight is the weight of the completed vehicle including driver, fuel and other fluids, passengers, luggage and any other fitted equipment.

Driving a standard bus you are limited to one weighing up to 3500kg but, if a wheelchair lift or other equipment for disbled passengers is fitted, that maximum weight goes up to 4250kg.

There will be a plate in the bus, normally on the driver or front passenger seat base, that gives the MAM (Maximum Authorised Mass).

If you estimate about 75kg per passenger, there won't be many 16 seat buses that can meet the weight requirement.

[mph1977]

GoneAnon said:

The maximum weight is the weight of the completed vehicle including driver, fuel and other fluids, passengers, luggage and any other fitted equipment.

Driving a standard bus you are limited to one weighing up to 3500kg but, if a wheelchair lift or other equipment for disbled passengers is fitted, that maximum weight goes up to 4250kg.

There will be a plate in the bus, normally on the driver or front passenger seat base, that gives the MAM (Maximum Authorised Mass).

If you estimate about 75kg per passenger, there won't be many 16 seat buses that can meet the weight requirement.

there's very few 16 +1 that are 3500 kg MAM - they tend to be 4250 now as the levle of overloading of 3500kg 16 +1s was ignored for long long time

14+1s or 12+1s are normally far safer from an MAM point of view for cat B derogation drivers unless it;s accessible ...

unfortunately the line between ojk to drive on a car licence and needs to be treated as a lorry or bus was all ready drawn at 3500 kg MAM across much of europe a long while ago ...

a 3500 kg 16 +1 was dodgy weight wise regardless unless it was used for primary school kids

[AJordan]

Cheers guys,

So am I right in thinking therefore that the below is fair game on an ordinary car licence? (Comes in at bang on 4,250kg it appears)

http://www.austentrading.co.uk/used-vans/used-vans...

[mph1977]

AJordan said:

Cheers guys,

So am I right in thinking therefore that the below is fair game on an ordinary car licence? (Comes in at bang on 4,250kg it appears)

http://www.austentrading.co.uk/used-vans/used-vans...

depends if TPTB condsider it is actually an accessible vehicle rather than a botched conversion of the factory 16 +1

BTW it may fail O-licence/ CoIF on the lack of adequate emergency exits ... as purpose built accessible minibuses have sliding doors both sides becasue the rear doors are blocked by an internal ramp

i'd also be interested to check the gradient of the ramp and the fixings of the tracked seats ...

[R0G]

Are you going to be driving this minibus for a charity under what I believe would be a section 19 permit ?

The one in your link does not give the GVW

[mph1977]

R0G said:

Are you going to be driving this minibus for a charity under what I believe would be a section 19 permit ?

The one in your link does not give the GVW

Op doesn't say , S19 or actual not for hire or reward is the only stuff the drive on a B derogation or D(101) can be used for ...

cue the usual tt fest of people who don't know what 'not for hire or reward' means

[AJordan]

I'll be driving it for a charity (Scouts) on a voluntary basis, but not for hire or reward.

Good spot re; the emergency exits, that wasn't something I'd considered. This is the first vehicle of this type, ie without a folding lift from under the floor, which I've seen. It does have a hatch in the roof however

Website states gross weight kg 4,250 under dimensions, but it was pretty hard to find,

Apologies, can't quote on the mobile site

[mph1977]

AJordan said:

I'll be driving it for a charity (Scouts) on a voluntary basis, but not for hire or reward.

Good spot re; the emergency exits, that wasn't something I'd considered. This is the first vehicle of this type, ie without a folding lift from under the floor, which I've seen. It does have a hatch in the roof however

Website states gross weight kg 4,250 under dimensions, but it was pretty hard to find,

Apologies, can't quote on the mobile site

scouting iirc comes under S.19 quite happily as well

'not for hire or reward' can be interesting as the odd banger racer or horsey tpe learns to their cost when the VOSA bit of DVSA decides to start digging into 'private HGV' ...

every minibuse i've driven with an internal lift / ramp that blocks the rear doors like that has had sliders both sides of the body - they can also be useful if stopped 'wrong way' in giving a kerb side exit

unless it;s got a full sized coach roof hatch that doesn;t count as an emergency exit and even then they do tend to want to see 2 routes of egress with the vehicle the correct way up ( which means 2 side doors if the rear is blocked by a lift / ramp / kit cage

Edited by mph1977 on Tuesday 24th May 23:51

[R0G]

Conditions you must meet

You can drive a minibus within the UK as long as the following conditions apply:

1. you’re 21 or older = YES ?
2. you’ve had your driving licence for at least 2 years = YES ?
3. you meet the ‘Group 2’ medical standards if you’re over 70 - check with your GP if you’re not sure you meet the standards = UNDER AGE 70 ?
4. you’re driving on a voluntary basis and the minibus is used for social purposes by a non-commercial body = YES ?
5. the maximum weight of the minibus is not more than 3.5 tonnes - or 4.25 tonnes including specialist equipment for disabled passengers, eg a wheelchair ramp = WITHOUT SPECIALIST IT IS NO MORE THAN 3500 ?
6. you’re not towing a trailer = NOT TOWING ?