RE: PH goes rallying
Discussion
New engine...It will be great to see another beemer out rallying this year, there are already 6 or 7 competing this year.
I am out again this year in my E30 325 competing in BTRDA, Welsh National and the BMW Challenge with Martin Auskerin co-driving for me again. Last year we entered the BTRDA class B12 and had great success winning our class, plenty of our incar footage is on youtube! We have taken part in the challenge for a number of years in a 205 and now this year in the beemer, so if anyone wants any advice/top tips send a message.
Chris / Dan - if you want to share service to help you get started (plus helps keep the costs down!) you are more than welcome. We used to share service between 2 to 3 cars but numbers dwindled last year due to finances & off's so at present our service team just look after my car. We service out of a Yellow Sprinter van, white beemer with M stripes and we're out on the Malcolm Wilson this coming weekend, come and introduce yourselves.
Great article by the way.
Jon Ross
I am out again this year in my E30 325 competing in BTRDA, Welsh National and the BMW Challenge with Martin Auskerin co-driving for me again. Last year we entered the BTRDA class B12 and had great success winning our class, plenty of our incar footage is on youtube! We have taken part in the challenge for a number of years in a 205 and now this year in the beemer, so if anyone wants any advice/top tips send a message.
Chris / Dan - if you want to share service to help you get started (plus helps keep the costs down!) you are more than welcome. We used to share service between 2 to 3 cars but numbers dwindled last year due to finances & off's so at present our service team just look after my car. We service out of a Yellow Sprinter van, white beemer with M stripes and we're out on the Malcolm Wilson this coming weekend, come and introduce yourselves.
Great article by the way.
Jon Ross
king brilliant! I had an old E30 318is which was great fun, just needed a quicker rack. Good luck lads, looking forward to the next update. Martrally said:
We love the 325 BMW,We currently compete in a challenge spec car just the same as the one int he article, infact we have had some great battles with Rowland the previous owner!! As the BMW challenge wasnt very strong last year and the events didnt seem to fit for us we entered the BTRDA rally championship and we won the class!! Loved it in what was by far the cheapest car in the class...B12 has millington escorts and all sorts of stuff but the beemer is so driveable and great fun!( and reliable!1) enough power to be entertaining. We have also done the 205 version of the challenge for many years and loved it. I can agree that Pat Flynns enthusiasm and passion is second to none and makes it a brilliant and freindly championship to be involved in.
A few in car bits of us sliding around last year can be found on...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6UDn-4isrQ
or us in the ice last week..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qja04DbyI1w
Fantastic on board footage. Haye Park is a great stage, the on board gives a great idea of speed. Great watch. A few in car bits of us sliding around last year can be found on...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6UDn-4isrQ
or us in the ice last week..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qja04DbyI1w
sanf said:
Martrally said:
We love the 325 BMW,We currently compete in a challenge spec car just the same as the one int he article, infact we have had some great battles with Rowland the previous owner!! As the BMW challenge wasnt very strong last year and the events didnt seem to fit for us we entered the BTRDA rally championship and we won the class!! Loved it in what was by far the cheapest car in the class...B12 has millington escorts and all sorts of stuff but the beemer is so driveable and great fun!( and reliable!1) enough power to be entertaining. We have also done the 205 version of the challenge for many years and loved it. I can agree that Pat Flynns enthusiasm and passion is second to none and makes it a brilliant and freindly championship to be involved in.
A few in car bits of us sliding around last year can be found on...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6UDn-4isrQ
or us in the ice last week..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qja04DbyI1w
Fantastic on board footage. Haye Park is a great stage, the on board gives a great idea of speed. Great watch. A few in car bits of us sliding around last year can be found on...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6UDn-4isrQ
or us in the ice last week..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qja04DbyI1w
Martrally said:
A few in car bits of us sliding around last year can be found on...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6UDn-4isrQ
Dan.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z6UDn-4isrQ
If you want to know how notes should be called, watch this and learn.
I don't know who the guy is reading them, but he's pretty much perfect for the complete stage, it's been a long time since I've seen an amateur nav that good.
That was an absolute pleasure to watch and taking a minute out of a V8 Escort is no mean feat in a 3 series... will be looking out for more in-car from you.
Thanks for the nice comments guys, glad you enjoyed the vids. I am still learning the art of co-driving as i am a much more natural driver but hopefully getting there and it keeps me involved while i save up for my next rally car! ( Jon and i used to sit in the other seats by the way in the 205 challenge)
We are loving our ralying and the BTRDA has been a great championship, so well run and fantastic rallies.
Be great if Chris / Dan want to team up and share service etc, some of the other guys we have had as 'team mates' have become really good friends and we all enjoyed the rallies all the more for it and felt less isolated and could share ideas and experience.
Hopefully see some of you one the stages.
Cheers again.
Martin Auskerin
We are loving our ralying and the BTRDA has been a great championship, so well run and fantastic rallies.
Be great if Chris / Dan want to team up and share service etc, some of the other guys we have had as 'team mates' have become really good friends and we all enjoyed the rallies all the more for it and felt less isolated and could share ideas and experience.
Hopefully see some of you one the stages.
Cheers again.
Martin Auskerin
Basic costs of going rallying in a Beemer in the National BTRDA championship are...
The car was approaching £6k by the time we had the nice things done. It was built while Jon was living in Oz but planning on coming home. It was a full reshell by one of the founders of the challenge after he had a big accident in it on an event.
So that aside the cost of the car individual BTRDA event costs are roughly..
Entry fee £430 (approx. 45 stage miles and maybe 120 road miles)
Pace notes £40 (event pace notes made by Patterson’s, I share the DVD that I use to refine the notes with another crew. Several hours of work but well worth it.)
Accommodation £100 (driver, navigator, 2 service crew)
Tyres- up to £100 (2nd hand, The Beemer runs the same size tyres as many of the Group N, evo's and Subaru's and we are good friends with front runner Jamie Anderson in an Evo 9 and also Russ Thompson who does the BRC in a clio so we have their 2nd hand tyres which are still very very good @ £25 each. If you were to buy new, which we did buy 4 over the year you are looking at £130 per tyre.
Fuel - Rally car £70
- Service van £80 ( inc towing car to event)
Service hire £50 ( we pay our good friend and sponsor Adrian Drury of Drury Deliveries £50 to really cover the investment of 2 rally 'easy-ups' to service under and his specialist tools) this figure was based on 3 of us sharing service but due to accidents and lack of funds we are down to just us now but it’s still £50!!
Food - £80 (Pub meal Friday evening for Driver, Nav, and 2 service boys and van snacks and food for rally)
We make sure that the boys that come and help us, giving up their weekend want and pay for nothing and have a good time so a few thank you pints doesn’t go a miss either.
So that’s about it really...
£870 approx.
When I did the 205 challenge as a driver I would budget £1000 a rally also so pretty similar really.
We split the cost in a way we are happy with - I pay as the Nav 2/3 entry fee, the notes and my accommodation.
There are the consumables and re-prep of course, Last year we had a slipping clutch which we replaced with a ceramic one £400 and the fuel pump failed so we bought new £130. That was about it, they are very strong and reliable!! - touch wood!!
To put the above into perspective the top group N runners in the evo's etc prob spend in the region on £4000 an event which maybe includes some re-prep but not the big bits!!The cars are circa £40k and take some serious preparation. They are around 5 seconds a mile quicker but we are having just as much fun!!! Don’t get me wrong saying that I would love to be in the position to be able to have a go in those kind of cars but I am very stretched and make huge sacrifices to afford it at out level. (Work most weekends as a supercar / rally instructor) - one day maybe!!
Hope that helps
The car was approaching £6k by the time we had the nice things done. It was built while Jon was living in Oz but planning on coming home. It was a full reshell by one of the founders of the challenge after he had a big accident in it on an event.
So that aside the cost of the car individual BTRDA event costs are roughly..
Entry fee £430 (approx. 45 stage miles and maybe 120 road miles)
Pace notes £40 (event pace notes made by Patterson’s, I share the DVD that I use to refine the notes with another crew. Several hours of work but well worth it.)
Accommodation £100 (driver, navigator, 2 service crew)
Tyres- up to £100 (2nd hand, The Beemer runs the same size tyres as many of the Group N, evo's and Subaru's and we are good friends with front runner Jamie Anderson in an Evo 9 and also Russ Thompson who does the BRC in a clio so we have their 2nd hand tyres which are still very very good @ £25 each. If you were to buy new, which we did buy 4 over the year you are looking at £130 per tyre.
Fuel - Rally car £70
- Service van £80 ( inc towing car to event)
Service hire £50 ( we pay our good friend and sponsor Adrian Drury of Drury Deliveries £50 to really cover the investment of 2 rally 'easy-ups' to service under and his specialist tools) this figure was based on 3 of us sharing service but due to accidents and lack of funds we are down to just us now but it’s still £50!!
Food - £80 (Pub meal Friday evening for Driver, Nav, and 2 service boys and van snacks and food for rally)
We make sure that the boys that come and help us, giving up their weekend want and pay for nothing and have a good time so a few thank you pints doesn’t go a miss either.
So that’s about it really...
£870 approx.
When I did the 205 challenge as a driver I would budget £1000 a rally also so pretty similar really.
We split the cost in a way we are happy with - I pay as the Nav 2/3 entry fee, the notes and my accommodation.
There are the consumables and re-prep of course, Last year we had a slipping clutch which we replaced with a ceramic one £400 and the fuel pump failed so we bought new £130. That was about it, they are very strong and reliable!! - touch wood!!
To put the above into perspective the top group N runners in the evo's etc prob spend in the region on £4000 an event which maybe includes some re-prep but not the big bits!!The cars are circa £40k and take some serious preparation. They are around 5 seconds a mile quicker but we are having just as much fun!!! Don’t get me wrong saying that I would love to be in the position to be able to have a go in those kind of cars but I am very stretched and make huge sacrifices to afford it at out level. (Work most weekends as a supercar / rally instructor) - one day maybe!!
Hope that helps
Martrally said:
Basic costs of going rallying in a Beemer in the National BTRDA championship are...
The car was approaching £6k by the time we had the nice things done. It was built while Jon was living in Oz but planning on coming home. It was a full reshell by one of the founders of the challenge after he had a big accident in it on an event.
So that aside the cost of the car individual BTRDA event costs are roughly..
Entry fee £430 (approx. 45 stage miles and maybe 120 road miles)
Pace notes £40 (event pace notes made by Patterson’s, I share the DVD that I use to refine the notes with another crew. Several hours of work but well worth it.)
Accommodation £100 (driver, navigator, 2 service crew)
Tyres- up to £100 (2nd hand, The Beemer runs the same size tyres as many of the Group N, evo's and Subaru's and we are good friends with front runner Jamie Anderson in an Evo 9 and also Russ Thompson who does the BRC in a clio so we have their 2nd hand tyres which are still very very good @ £25 each. If you were to buy new, which we did buy 4 over the year you are looking at £130 per tyre.
Fuel - Rally car £70
- Service van £80 ( inc towing car to event)
Service hire £50 ( we pay our good friend and sponsor Adrian Drury of Drury Deliveries £50 to really cover the investment of 2 rally 'easy-ups' to service under and his specialist tools) this figure was based on 3 of us sharing service but due to accidents and lack of funds we are down to just us now but it’s still £50!!
Food - £80 (Pub meal Friday evening for Driver, Nav, and 2 service boys and van snacks and food for rally)
We make sure that the boys that come and help us, giving up their weekend want and pay for nothing and have a good time so a few thank you pints doesn’t go a miss either.
So that’s about it really...
£870 approx.
When I did the 205 challenge as a driver I would budget £1000 a rally also so pretty similar really.
We split the cost in a way we are happy with - I pay as the Nav 2/3 entry fee, the notes and my accommodation.
There are the consumables and re-prep of course, Last year we had a slipping clutch which we replaced with a ceramic one £400 and the fuel pump failed so we bought new £130. That was about it, they are very strong and reliable!! - touch wood!!
To put the above into perspective the top group N runners in the evo's etc prob spend in the region on £4000 an event which maybe includes some re-prep but not the big bits!!The cars are circa £40k and take some serious preparation. They are around 5 seconds a mile quicker but we are having just as much fun!!! Don’t get me wrong saying that I would love to be in the position to be able to have a go in those kind of cars but I am very stretched and make huge sacrifices to afford it at out level. (Work most weekends as a supercar / rally instructor) - one day maybe!!
Hope that helps
interesting thanks!The car was approaching £6k by the time we had the nice things done. It was built while Jon was living in Oz but planning on coming home. It was a full reshell by one of the founders of the challenge after he had a big accident in it on an event.
So that aside the cost of the car individual BTRDA event costs are roughly..
Entry fee £430 (approx. 45 stage miles and maybe 120 road miles)
Pace notes £40 (event pace notes made by Patterson’s, I share the DVD that I use to refine the notes with another crew. Several hours of work but well worth it.)
Accommodation £100 (driver, navigator, 2 service crew)
Tyres- up to £100 (2nd hand, The Beemer runs the same size tyres as many of the Group N, evo's and Subaru's and we are good friends with front runner Jamie Anderson in an Evo 9 and also Russ Thompson who does the BRC in a clio so we have their 2nd hand tyres which are still very very good @ £25 each. If you were to buy new, which we did buy 4 over the year you are looking at £130 per tyre.
Fuel - Rally car £70
- Service van £80 ( inc towing car to event)
Service hire £50 ( we pay our good friend and sponsor Adrian Drury of Drury Deliveries £50 to really cover the investment of 2 rally 'easy-ups' to service under and his specialist tools) this figure was based on 3 of us sharing service but due to accidents and lack of funds we are down to just us now but it’s still £50!!
Food - £80 (Pub meal Friday evening for Driver, Nav, and 2 service boys and van snacks and food for rally)
We make sure that the boys that come and help us, giving up their weekend want and pay for nothing and have a good time so a few thank you pints doesn’t go a miss either.
So that’s about it really...
£870 approx.
When I did the 205 challenge as a driver I would budget £1000 a rally also so pretty similar really.
We split the cost in a way we are happy with - I pay as the Nav 2/3 entry fee, the notes and my accommodation.
There are the consumables and re-prep of course, Last year we had a slipping clutch which we replaced with a ceramic one £400 and the fuel pump failed so we bought new £130. That was about it, they are very strong and reliable!! - touch wood!!
To put the above into perspective the top group N runners in the evo's etc prob spend in the region on £4000 an event which maybe includes some re-prep but not the big bits!!The cars are circa £40k and take some serious preparation. They are around 5 seconds a mile quicker but we are having just as much fun!!! Don’t get me wrong saying that I would love to be in the position to be able to have a go in those kind of cars but I am very stretched and make huge sacrifices to afford it at out level. (Work most weekends as a supercar / rally instructor) - one day maybe!!
Hope that helps
I've been racing for the last 17 years so I am used to motor sport costs, but rallying i always thought was on another level. To do a stock hatch round including testing would cost about a grand, but you would get 2hr 30 track time.
so if i budget for a grand and get £250-300 off the co driver... it's almost do able. Soxboy get over here!!
Is it normal to share service crews? If I can somehow manage to share that cost rather than going down the arrive n drive route it might tempt me to start rallying?
Edited by Jerry Can on Tuesday 28th February 07:35
Service crew wise i guess it depends on the individual, We have come through the 205 challenge where budget is very much the essence and it was encouraged to share service.
We like it due to lots of reasons really, the commaradary, the friendship, the banter, the advice, the banter, the shoulder to cry on and of course cost.
We had a few worries regarding seeding as you dont want all 3 cars coming into service at the same time all needing jobs doing but we tended to have a decent enough mix of experience and ability that we are at least 10 cars apart so usually we got away with it.
On a BTRDA round you are usually back to service once or maybe twice throughout the day for between 30 mins and 1 hour. WE try and encourage the service boys to go and watch a bit if there is a stage close to give them something to do in the down time.
At one point we had 4, even 5 cars all servicing out of one Merc sprinter van. Great craic and saved everyone a fair old amount of money etc. We achieved that with 4 service crew i think it was so really cuts down on some of the expenses.
As for the track time compared to racing it is substantially less with our 'competition time' in the region of 55mins usually. HOWEVER you are on the go all day ( set off 10am finish 17:00 due to the road miles on the rally through often some awesome countryside and roads!
We like it due to lots of reasons really, the commaradary, the friendship, the banter, the advice, the banter, the shoulder to cry on and of course cost.
We had a few worries regarding seeding as you dont want all 3 cars coming into service at the same time all needing jobs doing but we tended to have a decent enough mix of experience and ability that we are at least 10 cars apart so usually we got away with it.
On a BTRDA round you are usually back to service once or maybe twice throughout the day for between 30 mins and 1 hour. WE try and encourage the service boys to go and watch a bit if there is a stage close to give them something to do in the down time.
At one point we had 4, even 5 cars all servicing out of one Merc sprinter van. Great craic and saved everyone a fair old amount of money etc. We achieved that with 4 service crew i think it was so really cuts down on some of the expenses.
As for the track time compared to racing it is substantially less with our 'competition time' in the region of 55mins usually. HOWEVER you are on the go all day ( set off 10am finish 17:00 due to the road miles on the rally through often some awesome countryside and roads!
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