Damon Hill Now Unsure about Bahrain
Discussion
Bernie will not cancel or say hes thinking of cancelling. why because if he stops the reace he doesnt get paid. If the FIA cancel it Bernie will find a way of getting paid, if Bahrain choose to cancel they have to pay Bernie (same as last year), then refund all tickets and look a bit silly.
The only way this race will be cancelled imo is if the FIA step in which Todt etc know they need to be very careful not to loose against Bernie and FOTA.
The only way this race will be cancelled imo is if the FIA step in which Todt etc know they need to be very careful not to loose against Bernie and FOTA.
I see Jackie Stewart says the race should go on.
"It is a dangerous precedent to set [if] we don't go to Bahrain.
Democracy doesn't happen in three months, 12 months or 36 months. It takes a generation sometimes.
In reality, a specialist of the Middle East would say Bahrain is more developed than any other Middle East state."
But then he would say that, wouldn't he, as his mate the King clings on to power....................
"It is a dangerous precedent to set [if] we don't go to Bahrain.
Democracy doesn't happen in three months, 12 months or 36 months. It takes a generation sometimes.
In reality, a specialist of the Middle East would say Bahrain is more developed than any other Middle East state."
But then he would say that, wouldn't he, as his mate the King clings on to power....................
I did question this with myself. If we had civil unrest (riots last summer?) and military intervention here in the UK, would we expect the British GP to be cancelled?
Of course not. So why should Bahrain? Yes, I'm aware of the bad things that have happened - but there'd be no Grand Prixs outside of Europe if that was the litmus test.
Just playing devil's advocate in my head, really.
Of course not. So why should Bahrain? Yes, I'm aware of the bad things that have happened - but there'd be no Grand Prixs outside of Europe if that was the litmus test.
Just playing devil's advocate in my head, really.
TonyHetherington said:
I did question this with myself. If we had civil unrest (riots last summer?) and military intervention here in the UK, would we expect the British GP to be cancelled?
If the army had been live firing at people in the UK, prevented the NHS from attending the injured, shot any medical staff who attempted to do so and called in foreign militaries to have a pop at those peacefully protesting... would we really expect a British GP to go ahead anytime soon after?I'm pretty ignorant of a lot of what's going on in Bahrain, but I don't think a bit of looting in PC World is quite the same. If it did go ahead in similar circumstances I suspect that would only be because Silverstone is relatively geographically isolated.
TonyHetherington said:
I did question this with myself. If we had civil unrest (riots last summer?) and military intervention here in the UK, would we expect the British GP to be cancelled?
Of course not. So why should Bahrain? Yes, I'm aware of the bad things that have happened - but there'd be no Grand Prixs outside of Europe if that was the litmus test.
Just playing devil's advocate in my head, really.
We did though- the England v Holland match was postponed because of the riots. I think if MK or Northampton was aflame the month before the British GP was due to be held there would be the same discussion. The race isn't under threat because they disagree with the politics (if it was then surely China would be under threat too), rather they're worried that they could find themselves at the centre of a large, violent and dangerous situation.Of course not. So why should Bahrain? Yes, I'm aware of the bad things that have happened - but there'd be no Grand Prixs outside of Europe if that was the litmus test.
Just playing devil's advocate in my head, really.
TonyHetherington said:
I did question this with myself. If we had civil unrest (riots last summer?) and military intervention here in the UK, would we expect the British GP to be cancelled?
Of course not. So why should Bahrain? Yes, I'm aware of the bad things that have happened - but there'd be no Grand Prixs outside of Europe if that was the litmus test.
Just playing devil's advocate in my head, really.
You do realise that medical staff are being stopped when they try to treat injured civilians... this is the Bahrain state using brute force and horrid tactics to keep things from spilling over: it's not a riot.Of course not. So why should Bahrain? Yes, I'm aware of the bad things that have happened - but there'd be no Grand Prixs outside of Europe if that was the litmus test.
Just playing devil's advocate in my head, really.
TonyHetherington said:
I did question this with myself. If we had civil unrest (riots last summer?) and military intervention here in the UK, would we expect the British GP to be cancelled?
Of course not. So why should Bahrain? Yes, I'm aware of the bad things that have happened - but there'd be no Grand Prixs outside of Europe if that was the litmus test.
Just playing devil's advocate in my head, really.
The issue runs a bit deeper than this.Of course not. So why should Bahrain? Yes, I'm aware of the bad things that have happened - but there'd be no Grand Prixs outside of Europe if that was the litmus test.
Just playing devil's advocate in my head, really.
If one were to pick over the politics of every country F1 races in, you'd find plenty to argue a reason not to go there. We'd end up with just two races - Monaco clockwise and Monaco anti-clockwise.
The root cause of the problem in Bahrain is that there exist two classes - Working Class and Ruling Class. Whereas in the UK, you can be born into poverty yet there is nothing stopping you achieving great success - indeed, if you show commitment, application, talent, etc, it's arguable that you will be given greater support to succeed than those born into the middle classes (see Lewis Hamilton for more details!!), in Bahrain, those from the working classes looking to aspire to greater things are actively prevented from doing so to the point of death if the ruling class deem it needed.
F1 whilst massively popular, is an elitist sport. It costs ridiculous amounts of money to get into F1 and huge amounts to go watch - amounts that put spectating at Baharain out of the league of the suppressed working classes - a fact that will not change unless entry is free or the government allows people to do well and earn more money.
If the race goes ahead, it's F1 waving two fingers to the working classes and demonstrating an unintended support for those doing the suppressing.
StevieBee said:
If the race goes ahead, it's F1 waving two fingers to the working classes and demonstrating an unintended support for those doing the suppressing.
Jackie Stewart's comments were very unhelpful, especially in light of what has happened across the middle east in the last 15 months. I don't want the race to take place, and that's not because it's usually dull. Dictatorships have their foundation upon the leadership cult, and if something like F1 effectively says "You're a prat" to the King, the army and police leaders that keep him in power begin to question themselves. It's not a big stand by any stretch of the imagination, but IMO it's the right thing to do, wholly aside from the safety issues.
If they do go to Bahrain I can see some riots getting brutally put down, and I'm sure the teams don't want blood on their hands.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/17698721
"Bahrain Grand Prix to go ahead as planned, FIA confirms
The Bahrain Grand Prix is to go ahead as scheduled on 22 April, the sport's governing body the FIA has said. "
"Bahrain Grand Prix to go ahead as planned, FIA confirms
The Bahrain Grand Prix is to go ahead as scheduled on 22 April, the sport's governing body the FIA has said. "
percymk4 said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/17698721
"Bahrain Grand Prix to go ahead as planned, FIA confirms
The Bahrain Grand Prix is to go ahead as scheduled on 22 April, the sport's governing body the FIA has said. "
Contractually, they have to say that. The only people who can cancel it without paying Bahrain a lot of money is Bahrain. It's in the hands of FOTA really. Bernie will ring the King of Bahrain on Saturday, and say "terribly sorry, but the only team that are willing to come is HRT. Do you still want to us to run the race?", the idea being that it'll make a mockery of the race, and would be worse than not running it at all. But that's the way it has to be played."Bahrain Grand Prix to go ahead as planned, FIA confirms
The Bahrain Grand Prix is to go ahead as scheduled on 22 April, the sport's governing body the FIA has said. "
percymk4 said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/17698721
"Bahrain Grand Prix to go ahead as planned, FIA confirms
The Bahrain Grand Prix is to go ahead as scheduled on 22 April, the sport's governing body the FIA has said. "
Great news "Bahrain Grand Prix to go ahead as planned, FIA confirms
The Bahrain Grand Prix is to go ahead as scheduled on 22 April, the sport's governing body the FIA has said. "
StevieBee said:
The issue runs a bit deeper than this.
If one were to pick over the politics of every country F1 races in, you'd find plenty to argue a reason not to go there. We'd end up with just two races - Monaco clockwise and Monaco anti-clockwise.
The root cause of the problem in Bahrain is that there exist two classes - Working Class and Ruling Class. Whereas in the UK, you can be born into poverty yet there is nothing stopping you achieving great success - indeed, if you show commitment, application, talent, etc, it's arguable that you will be given greater support to succeed than those born into the middle classes (see Lewis Hamilton for more details!!), in Bahrain, those from the working classes looking to aspire to greater things are actively prevented from doing so to the point of death if the ruling class deem it needed.
F1 whilst massively popular, is an elitist sport. It costs ridiculous amounts of money to get into F1 and huge amounts to go watch - amounts that put spectating at Baharain out of the league of the suppressed working classes - a fact that will not change unless entry is free or the government allows people to do well and earn more money.
If the race goes ahead, it's F1 waving two fingers to the working classes and demonstrating an unintended support for those doing the suppressing.
Informative. Thanks If one were to pick over the politics of every country F1 races in, you'd find plenty to argue a reason not to go there. We'd end up with just two races - Monaco clockwise and Monaco anti-clockwise.
The root cause of the problem in Bahrain is that there exist two classes - Working Class and Ruling Class. Whereas in the UK, you can be born into poverty yet there is nothing stopping you achieving great success - indeed, if you show commitment, application, talent, etc, it's arguable that you will be given greater support to succeed than those born into the middle classes (see Lewis Hamilton for more details!!), in Bahrain, those from the working classes looking to aspire to greater things are actively prevented from doing so to the point of death if the ruling class deem it needed.
F1 whilst massively popular, is an elitist sport. It costs ridiculous amounts of money to get into F1 and huge amounts to go watch - amounts that put spectating at Baharain out of the league of the suppressed working classes - a fact that will not change unless entry is free or the government allows people to do well and earn more money.
If the race goes ahead, it's F1 waving two fingers to the working classes and demonstrating an unintended support for those doing the suppressing.
So, in this report they went & looked for trouble. . . . and found it, BUT, it sounds like there is a grave danger that trouble is coming & looking to use F1 as the convenient international platform to demonstrate on.
I hope I am proved wrong, but this could all turn to a crock of s
t very quickly.
There is only so much that can be achieved by repression & strong-arm tactics, but, shear weight of numbers could easily turn the tide against the security forces.
This is a perhaps a gamble that would have been best avoided.
I hope I am proved wrong, but this could all turn to a crock of s
t very quickly. There is only so much that can be achieved by repression & strong-arm tactics, but, shear weight of numbers could easily turn the tide against the security forces.
This is a perhaps a gamble that would have been best avoided.
Having read all the posts, and the links provided by many of the posters, in my own mind, the event should NOT go ahead.
Some how, it MUST be stopped.
By who, I don't know, but I think it is quite morally wrong to stage this prestigious event in this county at this time in their turmoil.
vette
Some how, it MUST be stopped.
By who, I don't know, but I think it is quite morally wrong to stage this prestigious event in this county at this time in their turmoil.
vette
exactly, it's what anyone with half a brain would do.
if they are going to do it, let's hope they wait till an exciting part of the race to bring out the safety car.
BE has joked about sprinklers to enliven races, perhaps he has now hit upon the idea of using revolutionaries to invade the track in order to make things more interesting.
if they are going to do it, let's hope they wait till an exciting part of the race to bring out the safety car.
BE has joked about sprinklers to enliven races, perhaps he has now hit upon the idea of using revolutionaries to invade the track in order to make things more interesting.
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