Poll: Pirelli tyres
Total Members Polled: 337
Discussion
F1 fans are amazing aren't they? There was definitely an exciting race yesterday, by far one of the best we've ever had at Bahrain and people still are able to find something wrong with it.
Can they ever be happy with F1?
If you can't just sit back and say "well I enjoyed that race and the fastest guy won" without criticism then maybe the sport's just not for you.
Can they ever be happy with F1?
If you can't just sit back and say "well I enjoyed that race and the fastest guy won" without criticism then maybe the sport's just not for you.
Rude-boy said:
Scuffers said:
Megaflow said:
I am surprised by the ammount of people calling for a tyre war and durable tyres.
That's what we had from 1995-2009, a tyre war followed by the indestructable Bridgestones with refuelling, it resulted in drivers running qualifing pace for 15-20 laps and from what I remember most of that dull beyond words.
you just answered your own question....That's what we had from 1995-2009, a tyre war followed by the indestructable Bridgestones with refuelling, it resulted in drivers running qualifing pace for 15-20 laps and from what I remember most of that dull beyond words.
it was great right up to Bridgestone being sole supplier (when Michelin were forced out by Spankies political agenda)
Tyre war threw up a few surprise results, and the odd weekend where one make would be dominant.
The tyres are about the only spec component in F1. If they can't make them work then that is the team and the driver's issue, perhaps they would like to find another place to display their talent?
Sorry whilst the cars might not be able to race flat strap 100% of the time F1 has always been about far, far more than that. If we change the tyres the next thing is people will moan that with the fuel restrictions they can't run at full pace the whole race. Once that is dealt with there will be the next thing such as why don't we have T/C back, and then another and another.
Sorry I think that Pirelli have produced a cracking tyre. The racing is wonderful this year and for the teams it is a total nightmare to choose if it is better to stay out and try to hang on or if they should pit for new boots.
So far F1 2012 is turning into a stellar year and I would rather see 4 or 5 teams in with a shout than 1 or 2 sharing all the spoils between them.
zac510 said:
F1 fans are amazing aren't they? There was definitely an exciting race yesterday, by far one of the best we've ever had at Bahrain and people still are able to find something wrong with it.
Can they ever be happy with F1?
If you can't just sit back and say "well I enjoyed that race and the fastest guy won" without criticism then maybe the sport's just not for you.
It would appear some just to moan for the sake of it, I was very suspicous when the banned refuelling that all racing would disappear enitrely, but they have rescued that with the tyres, and in the last couple of years we have had some of the best racing that I can remember I have been watching F1 for 25 years!Can they ever be happy with F1?
If you can't just sit back and say "well I enjoyed that race and the fastest guy won" without criticism then maybe the sport's just not for you.
Edited by Megaflow on Monday 23 April 13:31
TheHeretic said:
DrTre said:
Leithen said:
Rock hard bricks with limited adhesion, that could easily last several weekends would do for me. Crazy talk?
Pirelli already even have that tyre. Expect them to rock up with a truckful of p6000s soon.
It doesn't necessary follow that relaxing rules will increase costs - if the contact patch adhesion is drastically reduced, driver skill becomes much more important and small gains in power output and aero less so.
Bedazzled said:
You wouldn't need to be Sergey Bubka to get over that bar. By far the best race you say, and yet Kimi had a single opportunity to overtake before he cooked his tyres. I think Grosjean overtook a McLaren, Webber cruised to 4th, Rosberg ventured off line a couple of times to finish 5th, Di Resta made absolutely no attempt to defend his position until the final stint, and finished 6th. Lots of TV action as strategies played out, but not my idea of great racing.
That's exactly how I saw it. Di Resta, I've noticed is now starting to perfect his particular style.Bedazzled said:
You wouldn't need to be Sergey Bubka to get over that bar. By far the best race you say, and yet Kimi had a single opportunity to overtake before he cooked his tyres. I think Grosjean overtook a McLaren, Webber cruised to 4th, Rosberg ventured off line a couple of times to finish 5th, Di Resta made absolutely no attempt to defend his position until the final stint, and finished 6th. Lots of TV action as strategies played out, but not my idea of great racing.
I'm sorry that you only find comfort and interest in something when it meets your expectations perfectly (and that means predictably, too).oldnwrinkly said:
The front wings nowadays are so complicated with lots of small pieces of 'tupperware' tacked on and, as a consequence, incredibly fragile and prone to damage from the slightest touch or bump. IMO the regs should be revised to ensure they are simpler, more robust and, ideally, placed in a more protected area. Might not be bad if they were adjustable within prescribed limits.
I meant to say "Might not be bad if they were driver adjustable within prescribed limits." No, It's not working for him, he's not happy, so what. It's the same for everyone.
He's the undisputed King of one of the worst eras for F1 Fans, a period that was so boring that a race with 3 passes for position when considered an absolute blinder and that's the sort of racing you get from having tyres that offer tonnes of consistent grip and low wear rates.
The tyres they have now give so many more options for teams and drivers. They can glide around watching their tyres and hope to skip a stop or go on a charge and bang in quick lap times to catch the guy ahead which of course leads to more risk of ether running out of tyre or making a mistake.
it also puts more pressure on the teams to get the set-up right, so smaller teams like Lotus and Sauber can overcome a huge budget handicap with the correct application of grey matter and give teams like Redbull, Ferrari and McLaren a bloody nose by making the right call on the day, not have their season determined months before the first race in the wind tunnel.
I agree though, the “must use both types” rule seems a bit pointless now in light of the other regs.
He's the undisputed King of one of the worst eras for F1 Fans, a period that was so boring that a race with 3 passes for position when considered an absolute blinder and that's the sort of racing you get from having tyres that offer tonnes of consistent grip and low wear rates.
The tyres they have now give so many more options for teams and drivers. They can glide around watching their tyres and hope to skip a stop or go on a charge and bang in quick lap times to catch the guy ahead which of course leads to more risk of ether running out of tyre or making a mistake.
it also puts more pressure on the teams to get the set-up right, so smaller teams like Lotus and Sauber can overcome a huge budget handicap with the correct application of grey matter and give teams like Redbull, Ferrari and McLaren a bloody nose by making the right call on the day, not have their season determined months before the first race in the wind tunnel.
I agree though, the “must use both types” rule seems a bit pointless now in light of the other regs.
P-Jay said:
They can glide around watching their tyres and hope to skip a stop...
Should that be an option, really it's F1 after all. Maybe a points system should be in operation based on the amount of seconds (rather than just position) the cars finish behind the winner. Edited by Johnboy Mac on Monday 23 April 15:15
Leithen said:
Not if the tyres were really, really hard, with limited adhesion and as stated in my original post, you then relaxed engine rules etc. Think about it - aero becomes less important, allowing closer racing, no marbles allowing different lines, sky high power to weight ratios, tyres that happily slip sideways without damage.....
With a rock hard tyre the aero becomes more important because you need to maximise the performance of the tyre. Mechanical grip will be lessened, so downforce will become everything. Ahonen said:
Scuffers said:
other issue seems to be that they are somewhat inconsistent, one set is OK, the next is dire going on what the drivers/teams have been saying all year.
Which teams and drivers have been saying this? I'm intrigued. Johnboy Mac said:
P-Jay said:
They can glide around watching their tyres and hope to skip a stop...
Should that be an option, really it's F1 after all. Maybe a points system should be in operation based on the amount of seconds (rather than just position) the cars finish behind the winner. Edited by Johnboy Mac on Monday 23 April 15:15
I think tyre/engine/car management is a big part of being the perfect driver or the perfect team, it's about playing the long game - chasing the best full race time and position and letting the team/driver work out whether that be by a 4 stop tyre/engine burning frenzy, or a 3 stop careful race - more than that it's the period between stop races that are really interesting, like yesterday Vettel out in the lead being careful, Kimi behind giving it death to catch him, in the end Kimi took so much out of it catching him he didn't have anything left to mount a challenge for the lead, but it could have gone the other way so easily.
The idea of drivers giving it 100% for 60 laps sounds like it would be the better spectacle, but in reality history has shown us that if the cars can do a full race distance at 100% it becomes a boring precession of who's got the biggest budget or the biggest sway with the FIA. Giving them cars that evolve as the race progresses, have to be managed more and are harder to drive puts more onus on the driver and means different cars/drivers are faster at different points during the race giving us a better race to watch.
Scuffers said:
well, so far I have seen comments from Red Bull, Renault, Rosberg, Perez and Kobayashi basically all saying things like, "set two were not as good as set 1" and the like.
I am in no way qualified to give proper comment on this but I would say it is a case not of set 1 being better than set 2 but that by the time set 2 has been put on the track is in a different place compared to the tread on set 2 Vs set 1.The tolerance of these tyres being so fine that the amount of rubber laid down when set 1 was fresh is totally different to the amount when set 2 is fresh.
I have yet to hear anyone say how much better set 2 is than set 1 other than with a change of compound.
P-Jay said:
so smaller teams like Lotus and Sauber can overcome a huge budget handicap
overcome huge budget handicap you say? You know what would be the best for overcoming that, 2000 HP monsters with tires better just enough to hold 20-30 laps of real racing. The reason being is that difference between 2.4 V8 with 750 HP and 2.4 V8 with 730 HP is a lot bigger on track than between 2000 and 1900 HP, where drivers ba..bravery and knowledge is what is gonna matter the most. It's not too expensive to build such engines and the consumption doesn't have to be (much)higher, especially with force induction. For the greenies - the fuel they use for logistics(trucks airplanes etc. transporting F1 cars) is spent in a much bigger quantity than F1 cars spend it on track so I can't see the difference really. I mean if F1 cars produced >1500 HP from 1.5 engines during 80s I am sure that 30 years later they could make 2000HP out of 1.5 V6s with KERS and stuff.
Rude-boy said:
Scuffers said:
well, so far I have seen comments from Red Bull, Renault, Rosberg, Perez and Kobayashi basically all saying things like, "set two were not as good as set 1" and the like.
I am in no way qualified to give proper comment on this but I would say it is a case not of set 1 being better than set 2 but that by the time set 2 has been put on the track is in a different place compared to the tread on set 2 Vs set 1.The tolerance of these tyres being so fine that the amount of rubber laid down when set 1 was fresh is totally different to the amount when set 2 is fresh.
I have yet to hear anyone say how much better set 2 is than set 1 other than with a change of compound.
with the operating window for these tyres being so narrow, that's a real issue I guess?
Gassing Station | General Motorsport | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff