Schu has retired again

Schu has retired again

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Wanta996Gotta

5,622 posts

206 months

Friday 5th October 2012
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doogz said:
Wanta996Gotta said:
Yes but he also agrees with my point that his car was so superior to the others. Ask yourself why his dominance came to end in 2005. Check what regulation stopped him from lapping the whole field and winning races in 1 gear,etc,etc.
When Ferrari were signed up to use Bridgestone tyres, which were crap in comparison to the Michelins?

Winning races in 1 gear, you're really clinging onto this one. It's a bit pathetic.
Finally, we are getting somehwere. When Ferrari "no longer" had control of its OWN "bespoke" tyres.

Wanta996Gotta

5,622 posts

206 months

Friday 5th October 2012
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SRT77 said:
Wanta996Gotta said:
What is a Spaz Superkart? Would you prefer to read the Jackie Stewart article when he almost says the same thing?

"Michael's record in F1, particularly his Ferrari period, was so dominant because the car and engine was unquestionably the best on the grid and there was no doubt about who was number one and got most attention in the team."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/19834309
You don't get to put yourself in that position unless you merit it. Are you suggesting for that Karthikeyan could have done the same at Ferrari. Vettel, Alonso, Hamilton are all in top cars because they are worthy of them
As for Jackie Stewart - he mentions Senna in a positive way in his article. He only has to check himself out on you tube and watch his lengthy interview with Senna where he repeatedly questions Senna's driving ethics and number of incidents.
No matter how many posts you make it's not working, Schumacher still has 7 WDCs.
Of course he is still 7 times WDC but what is there worth now?? Andrew Bensons piece on the BBC says - People within F1 - people with the highest regard for his achievements - have begun to question what went before

If Andrew Benson has wrote such a piece for the BBC(Along with Jackie Stewarts comments)then why am i getting stick for saying the same thing?

Wanta996Gotta

5,622 posts

206 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
doogz said:
Wanta996Gotta said:
Of course he is still 7 times WDC but what is there worth now?? Andrew Bensons piece on the BBC says - People within F1 - people with the highest regard for his achievements - have begun to question what went before

If Andrew Benson has wrote such a piece for the BBC(Along with Jackie Stewarts comments)then why am i getting stick for saying the same thing?
Partly because you don't seem able to form an opinion of your own. If we want to read Jackie Stewart's of Andrew Benson's opinion on it, we can.
I dont have an opinion of my own? I have been saying this since he came back as i thought he would at the very least whip Rosbergs ass.If you been on this forum for as long as i have been then you will know i am very opinionated on Alonso,Lewis and the Legend Schumacher.

Wanta996Gotta

5,622 posts

206 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
doogz said:
Wanta996Gotta said:
Finally, we are getting somehwere. When Ferrari "no longer" had control of its OWN "bespoke" tyres.
No, when the Michelin was a much better tyre across the board than the Bridgestone. Apart from in the states of course!
Wrong..................again. The FIA changed rules so that Ferrari could no longer use there own bespoke tyres. Its tough luck on Ferrari and all there unlimited testing and own race track in there back yard if Michelin developed a better tyre.


ralphrj

3,507 posts

190 months

Friday 5th October 2012
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Wanta996Gotta said:
I cant think of any similar incidents from Alonso on the race track. Deliberatly parking on a racing line or barging two competitors off the race track and being the only driver to be banned??
Schumacher was not the first to pull this tactic. Just the year before Raikkonen deliberatly ran wide at the first corner in Hockenheim on his slow down lap to drag gravel and dirt on to the track and spoil Alonso's qualifying lap (one lap qualifying at the time). No action was taken against Raikkonen.

Autosport said:
A bit of gamesmanship from Kimi Raikkonen may have cost Championship rival Fernando Alonso a place on the front row of the grid for today's German Grand Prix.

Pole man Raikkonen, having finished third at Silverstone, was 18th of the 20 cars in the qualifying order at Hockenheim, with Alonso and Juan Pablo Montoya following him.

Having set his 1m14.320s pole time, Raikkonen then drove off the circuit at Turn 1 on his slowing down lap, which put dust down as he came back on. Alonso was by this stage on his warm-up lap and, obviously, the next car through the dirty section. He lost a lot of time in sector one.

Fernando said afterwards: "I lost three or four tenths through the first corners: it was windier than this morning and the first corner is very quick and I was a bit unsettled. Then I didn't have the confidence to attack the braking zone at the next corner." Alonso doubtless thought it was the wind that had blown the dust on the circuit and his circumspection at Turn 2 will have been down to concern about dirty tyres.

Raikkonen's Turn 1 'moment' was not picked up by the main TV feed but, in the TV booths, Austrian TV was playing replays from a different camera, and this was spotted by the eagle-eyed former driver Thierry Tassin in the Belgian booth. Tassin then asked Raikkonen about it in McLaren's Saturday press conference.

A sheepish-looking Kimi admitted: "Yes, a little part of my wheel went into the dust at Turn 1..." Whereupon a grinning Ron Dennis embraced his driver with a 'That's my boy!' type of hug.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/45914

Wanta996Gotta

5,622 posts

206 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
ralphrj said:
Wanta996Gotta said:
I cant think of any similar incidents from Alonso on the race track. Deliberatly parking on a racing line or barging two competitors off the race track and being the only driver to be banned??
Schumacher was not the first to pull this tactic. Just the year before Raikkonen deliberatly ran wide at the first corner in Hockenheim on his slow down lap to drag gravel and dirt on to the track and spoil Alonso's qualifying lap (one lap qualifying at the time). No action was taken against Raikkonen.

Autosport said:
A bit of gamesmanship from Kimi Raikkonen may have cost Championship rival Fernando Alonso a place on the front row of the grid for today's German Grand Prix.

Pole man Raikkonen, having finished third at Silverstone, was 18th of the 20 cars in the qualifying order at Hockenheim, with Alonso and Juan Pablo Montoya following him.

Having set his 1m14.320s pole time, Raikkonen then drove off the circuit at Turn 1 on his slowing down lap, which put dust down as he came back on. Alonso was by this stage on his warm-up lap and, obviously, the next car through the dirty section. He lost a lot of time in sector one.

Fernando said afterwards: "I lost three or four tenths through the first corners: it was windier than this morning and the first corner is very quick and I was a bit unsettled. Then I didn't have the confidence to attack the braking zone at the next corner." Alonso doubtless thought it was the wind that had blown the dust on the circuit and his circumspection at Turn 2 will have been down to concern about dirty tyres.

Raikkonen's Turn 1 'moment' was not picked up by the main TV feed but, in the TV booths, Austrian TV was playing replays from a different camera, and this was spotted by the eagle-eyed former driver Thierry Tassin in the Belgian booth. Tassin then asked Raikkonen about it in McLaren's Saturday press conference.

A sheepish-looking Kimi admitted: "Yes, a little part of my wheel went into the dust at Turn 1..." Whereupon a grinning Ron Dennis embraced his driver with a 'That's my boy!' type of hug.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/45914
And your comparing this to what exactly.......................................................

ralphrj

3,507 posts

190 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
Monaco 06 - gamesmanship by Schumacher, huge outcry, called before stewards and sent to the back of the grid.

Germany 05 - gamesmanship by Raikkonen, no outcry (other than questioning by 1 journalist), congratulated by team boss, not summoned to stewards, no penalty given.

It is an example of how people bang on about something Schumacher has done but are willing to ignore the fact that other drivers have done or still do the same.

Wanta996Gotta

5,622 posts

206 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
ralphrj said:
Monaco 06 - gamesmanship by Schumacher, huge outcry, called before stewards and sent to the back of the grid.

Germany 05 - gamesmanship by Raikkonen, no outcry (other than questioning by 1 journalist), congratulated by team boss, not summoned to stewards, no penalty given.

It is an example of how people bang on about something Schumacher has done but are willing to ignore the fact that other drivers have done or still do the same.
You are seriously comparing Kimi going off track and leaving gravel on the track to Schumi stopping on the racing line in Monaco?

Yes or No will do.

ralphrj

3,507 posts

190 months

Friday 5th October 2012
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Yes - if both actions were deliberate (and only the driver will know if it was) and designed to hamper the efforts of other competitors.

heebeegeetee

28,590 posts

247 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
ralphrj said:
Yes - if both actions were deliberate (and only the driver will know if it was) and designed to hamper the efforts of other competitors.
How do you know Kimi's actions were deliberate?

Wanta996Gotta

5,622 posts

206 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
ralphrj said:
Yes - if both actions were deliberate (and only the driver will know if it was) and designed to hamper the efforts of other competitors.
God, you are being serious. You do realise the drivers go off track frequently in Qualifying and practice when trying to get out of the way of drivers still on a hot lap at almost every race? How could this be proved for start.

Comparing this to one of the worst incidents of blatant cheating in F1's history is laughable.


Wanta996Gotta

5,622 posts

206 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
doogz said:
Wanta996Gotta said:
Wrong..................again. The FIA changed rules so that Ferrari could no longer use there own bespoke tyres. Its tough luck on Ferrari and all there unlimited testing and own race track in there back yard if Michelin developed a better tyre.
So i'm wrong.

But it's also tough luck if the other tyre was better. So i'm not wrong.

A clue. Get one.
Your missing the point. He was dominating everyone and everything when they used there own Bespoke tyre that no OTHER team had access to.The Bridgestone did work and you could argue it was on par with Michellin - the DIFFERENCE that you dont seem to get is that it was not in a different league as there previous BESPOKE tyre was.

Get over it.

vonuber

17,868 posts

164 months

Friday 5th October 2012
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Wanta996Gotta - I think you might be rivalling CiderwithCerbie now. It's close, but a bit more and you can take the lead.

ralphrj

3,507 posts

190 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
heebeegeetee said:
How do you know Kimi's actions were deliberate?
How do we know that Schumacher's was? I'm not aware that he ever admitted doing it deliberately.

Qualifying in the second half of 2005 was a single flying lap on race fuel and race tyres. There was a considerable distance from the timing line to the first corner and, in order to preserve their fuel and tyres, drivers would back off immediately following completing their lap. It is inexplicable that Kimi would then have run off at the first corner and Alonso would have no choice but to ease off on his one and only lap.

heebeegeetee

28,590 posts

247 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
Wanta996Gotta said:
Exactly. And thats my point, if Rosberg can at the very least match him then whats happened to the Legend that could lap the whole field and win races stuck in 1 gear etc,etc

Mirror Piece on the Legend - http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/formula-1/michael-sc...
I'm a massive fan of the style driver that is Gilles Villeneuve, Nigel Mansell and dare I say it even lewis Hamilton.

But no way in one million years was Mansell a better F1 driver than Schumacher, and to put Lewis well into a list of the top ten drivers of all time, alongside such names as Fangio, Moss, Stewart etc, is utterly ridiculous.

When people want to compare drivers like Mansell and Nico Rosberg to schumacher, they need to recall the stir that Schumacher caused when he arrived in F1. The wise old sages of F1, the people who really do the winning, were amazed by him and of course Schumacher was very quickly snatched away from one team by another.

The likes of Mansell and young Rosberg did nothing of the sort. Mansell struggled to persuade people that he deserved a seat in F3, never mind F1. Young Rosberg would have every gift bestowed upon him as a young driver that only a wealthy former F1 wdc could provide, but still there was no great sensation when he joined F1.

Schumacher was one of those young drivers that occasionally come along that genuinely can do the business and then get the job done. They come along just once in a decade or so, I guess.

superkartracer

8,959 posts

221 months

Friday 5th October 2012
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^^ like Kimi

Evangelion

7,636 posts

177 months

Friday 5th October 2012
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Why does everyone seem to like making a fuss about MSC becoming champion by having the best car?

After all how often has the champion NOT had the best car?

Speed.deman

214 posts

192 months

Friday 5th October 2012
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Wanta996Gotta said:
You have lost me, i have no idea what your talking about.
Like a lot of others here will agree, that really comes as no suprise.

Trying to compare Schum now and Schum then is foolish. Just as is trying to poke holes in his dominance of the sport when he was the main man. People will regard his first and second stint separately in the time to come. In fact, I'd bet on the second stint becoming little more than a postscript when enough time has passed.


heightswitch

6,316 posts

249 months

Friday 5th October 2012
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Eric Mc said:
He'll retire - take up competition aerobatics - and crash.
I think that is quite a sad and disrespectful simile to try to make!
N.

hairykrishna

13,158 posts

202 months

Friday 5th October 2012
quotequote all
Wanta996Gotta said:
Of course he is still 7 times WDC but what is there worth now?? Andrew Bensons piece on the BBC says - People within F1 - people with the highest regard for his achievements - have begun to question what went before

If Andrew Benson has wrote such a piece for the BBC(Along with Jackie Stewarts comments)then why am i getting stick for saying the same thing?
Benson appears to dislike Schumacher almost as much as you do. He never misses a chance to have a pop at him.